Replies

1. 
   blewcrowe | May 09, 2007 04:50pm | #1

   Jeff, hardly anything can match the fleck pop that boiled linseed oil will give you. You can follow that with shellac or laquer.

1. 
   woodman2263 | May 09, 2007 04:56pm | #2

   Blew,

   What would the process be if I need to stain it for a darker color?  Would boiled linseed oil have any affect at that point?  If I need to stain it, what would be your advice?

   Jeff

1. 
   blewcrowe | May 09, 2007 05:03pm | #3

   IMO, dying should be done prior to the BLO, whereas pigment staining (some may disagree) is better done after the BLO because pigment has a potential to block absorption.

   Side note: a dye will help to pop the grain, too.

1. 
   woodman2263 | May 09, 2007 05:12pm | #4

   Blew,

   I hate to wear you out on this topic, but when you say dye, are you refering to stain or actual dye?  And if dye, what would you rec. I use so I don't ruin these cabinets?

   Also, are you saying I can "dye" the wood, then use BLO and they laquer or shalaq?

   Thanks again,

   Jeff

1. 
   blewcrowe | May 09, 2007 05:26pm | #5

   Typical coloring of wood is done with either dyes or pigment stains or both. Dyes are typically water or alcohol based (I prefer water). Dyes penetrate; pigments nest in the wood grain and cracks. Think of a man standing on the street, next to the Empire State Building. That would exemplify the difference in particle size between a dye and a pigment.

   You can dye, then BLO, then apply a final finish over top. Ideally, it might pay to let the BLO cure down for a week.

   Does that answer your questions?

2. 
   woodman2263 | May 09, 2007 05:30pm | #6

   Yep, think I am good to go.

   Thank-you for your help!

   Jeff

3. 
   BG | May 09, 2007 05:51pm | #7

   woodman,

   There is a  routine that Jeff Jewitt (I think) popularized for taking white oak to A&C dark finish without fuming. Others here know it much better than I but it goes something like this: Dark Stain(brown alcohol based), shellac, gel stain( very dark), varnish. The stain gives you the color, shellac a bit of red, the gel fills the pores with dark and the corners with aging and, finally, the varnish the protection. Perhaps others can confirm or correct this routine.

4. 
   blewcrowe | May 09, 2007 05:52pm | #8

   Another comment. If you are new to the world of dyes (I hardly use pigment stains anymore), look around. There are lots of types with different solvents. If you're after typical wood colors (gold-brown-red), look at the Transtint brand. It's already a concentrate in solution. A few drops in half a cup of water and you are good to go on a small table, frinstance. Always pre-test the strength/value on a piece of scrap, then tweak it by adding more concentrate or more water.

   One last side note: some "stains" today use a mix of dyes and pigments. Only your hairdresser knows.

2. 
   GW52 | May 09, 2007 07:40pm | #9

   If you make a mistake with the dye, water based, is there something that you can put on the wood, like maybe bleach, to remove the effects of the dye.

   Thanks,

   Greg

1. 
   blewcrowe | May 09, 2007 09:08pm | #10

   Water flushing will remove the worst of the surface color, but like pigment stain, you can never get it off totally unless you sand, scrape or plane down through it.

   Anytime you're working with oak (oak has tannins that react with minerals in water), use a purer form of water such as distilled water.

   The way to fly is to dampen your wood with distilled water. Let it dry (half an hour or so). Then sand it back with a light touch and very fine grit like a 320 or 600.

   Have a few scraps on hand (sanded to the same grit). Now, you fiddle with the dye concentration until you have what you want (which takes me all of a cuppla minutes). Judge your color by what it looks like while the wood is still damp.

   Now you have your concentrate. Flood it on. Don't be stingy and you won't get light value and dark value spots. If you get unevenness, you haven't flooded enough.

   Let it dry. When it dries, it will develop a "bloom" or hazy powdery look. Don't worry. The color will return to its look (as it was when it was damp) once you apply your BLO.

   You may choose to do another very light sanding after the dye dries, to remove fiber swelling.

   Then go to your BLO.

1. 
   GW52 | May 10, 2007 06:04pm | #13

   Thanks for the info. I am currently making a Craftsman style rocking chair with quarter oak and I am looking for that ray, fleck pop with the finishing. I've got a few pieces of scrap and will be checking out different combos. If I go to the BLO after a dye do you recommend sealing with shellac over it if I want to use a pigmented stain on top.

   Greg

1. 
   blewcrowe | May 10, 2007 06:17pm | #14

   Any kind of a true sealing type finish like shellac, laquer, poly or varnish will largely block a pigmented stain. Then, a pigmented stain would be more like a glaze. So, unless I wanted a glaze, I'd

   dye

   stain

   blo

   finish

   in that order. But that's just me. I'm sure there are greater finishing experts than me here.

2. 
   GW52 | May 10, 2007 09:41pm | #15

   Thanks

2. 
   philip | May 10, 2007 04:51am | #11

   Woody, because you say you want to spray a lacquer (hopefully a pre catalysed) , this is what I would advise, having done it many times with both red oak and white oak:
   Use a PENETRATING solvent stain (usually turpentine based) . Experiment first with the shade and colour you like. Spray it on lavishly and wipe it off with rags to even it out. It dries quickly.
   Then spray a coat of Zinsser dewaxed shellac sealer (Bullseye).
   Then spraythe catalysed lacquer-not gloss.You can then rub it down with 0000steel wool and wax if you want. Very easy, protects well and brings out those medullary rays in the white oak.
   The good thing about solvent stains as opposed to water based dyes or stains is that there is no grain raising or extra moisture and they are quick drying. Philip Marcou

   
   

   ---

   Edited 5/9/2007 10:05 pm by philip

1. 
   blewcrowe | May 10, 2007 02:57pm | #12

   I'm gonna have to try out these solvent stains. I've always used water based and these solvent ones sound better.