I am looking to purchase a new mitre saw. I’ve had a Delta 10″ for years and its been OK. I have settled on a 12″ compound. I was going to get a DeWalt, I have a bunch of their stuff and always had good luck. However on Amazon I read that some woodworkers have had a problem with the front end of the table rising when the knob is locked. Has anyone heard of this? I have considered a Ridgid, (100 bucks less) has anyone used one? (I have had some Emmerson tools in the past and have had good luck for the money.) Or should I just fork up the dough for a Bosch? Please dont mention Makita, as i have had nothing but CRAP from them! (Bad luck I suppose)
Tim
Replies
I own the 12 inch De Walt compound sliding mitre saw. I really like it.. to prevent tipping Dewalt includes legs that stick out the back.
I have heard nice things about the Mikita sliding compound mitre saw but have no direct experiance..
The problem I am concerned with is not a tipping problem. It as as follows..." When you lock the table anywhere, the table flexes up in the front. It just pushes right up. All of the Dewalts do and non of the competitors do. The knob applys pressure directly to one point and bows both pieces of the aluminum up and down. The wider the molding the more tapered the cut. So regardless of how excact the marks are the cuts will be off."
Tim
Will second Don C's motion of Hitachi. I have the SCMS an it is dead accurate. Saw it on clearance at Lowe's months ago, so I checked with about 10 trim guys I know. Seven of the 10 in the Atlanta area had Hitachi's an swear by them. Bought it an have no regrets.
sarge..jt
Yep Sarge, my Hitachi with no exceptions has been the most problem free, extremely accurate tool out of the box I've ever owned. Of course I'm limiting this to toolsmachines that involve multiple moving parts. Nothing beats a hammer out of the box! ;^)
I will say though that some I spoken to about the saw didn't care for the heightsize of the fence, but it has never caused me any problems.
Don
Don
I got the old style without the flip fence on clearance for $239 at Lowe's. The only difference I saw was the new one had a taller fence an the degree indicators were more clearly marked. A piece of phenolic slotted for an adjustable fence front and a red fine tipped magic marker saved me about $250.
Mine does not have the laser. I am not into laser anyway. The plastic guide block you cut into behind the blade is remarkable. Hitachi had it together with that block as it is dead accurate an you know where the blade will be on the stock. You can make a guide on any sliding miter with red plastic tape run the length of the blade slot. Lower the blade an it will cut the tape. That becomes your guide, but I much prefer their guide block.
Have a great week-end...
sarge..jt
Look into the Hitachi. They're really nice miter saws.
Don
Edited 8/22/2003 11:44:59 PM ET by Don C.
You might want to take a closer look at the Makita. Mine is bar none, the most reliable, accurate, most often used tool in my shop. Its a slider, and I wouldn't change a thing about it. Makita also sent a wonderful blade with it.
Funny about our preconcieved concepts of tools based on brands. I used to think that because my Dewalt router is a constant headache, that all Dewalts were suspect. Now, after more experience, just my router appears to be obnoxious.
Steve
I've had the Bosch 10" SCMS for 7 yrs. and have no problems with it. It only tilts to one side but I haven't seen this as a problem. I think Amazon has it for about $400. Bosch does have a new 12" with lots of bells & whistles but is more $. I have used the Hitachi also and found it to be toip quality.
Joe
Timothy,
I received a Dewalt 12" SCMS as a gift upon retirement. I have had no trouble at all with it and all my cuts have been dead on. I have used it for two years now and have not had to adjust it yet. I did make a zero clearance insert for it and use hard board against the fence as a zero clearance fence. almost no tear out and easy as pie to see the cut line. Good luck.
Tim,
I went out and looked at my Dewalt. The only way I see the problem happening is if you REALLY tighten the miter lock EXTREMELY hard. You really dont have to tighten it at all at the detents. I barely snug it down and have never had a problem. I have had it about three years and have never had a bit of trouble. Try one at the store and you will see what I mean unless they have changed them.
Hope this helps,
Bill
Depends on what you're going to use it for. If you just want a chop saw around the house, you'd probably be content with most of what's out there. Dewalt, Delta, etc. Having used most of the saws on the market and owning several, I have to say the Makita 10" slider is a pretty nice setup and around here tends to get some popularity at sales. You can get one for about $450 if you're patient.
I'm not too sold on the Dewalts. They work, but in my experience they feel and work kind of clunky. Not particularly well thought out in design, more geared for people who look at the thing and say "oooh, big motor" and buy one. The slider in particular is entirely too top heavy.
Hitachi isn't winning any popularity contests nationwide judging by sales but some of their wares are overlooked gems. The 15" chop in particular is a heck of a good saw (though bigger than you probably want) and offers some great cutting capacity for a non slider.
My latest addition to the arsenal has been a Bosch 12" SCMS and there's little I could do to improve it. From balance, capacity, function, layout of the controls, accuracy, it's really a tool that someone sat down and put some thought into. Though you didn't say you were looking at sliders, if you are considering them, it's a heck of a good saw, though at almost $700 it is certainly more geared for people who make a living with their saws rather than those who own one to feed a pastime.
"The child is grown / The dream is gone / And I have become / Comfortably numb " lyrics by Roger Waters
RW,
Probably right about the Hitachi. FG, although never owning one, once posted she isn't impressed by Hitachi tools so they are worthless. Sorry Sarge. We should dump our saws!
Don
Don
Just got through cutting some 4" thick laminated ply with maple veneer with that Hitachi. With the aid of a Freud 60 tooth SCMS blade on board, got smooth splinter-free cuts without even scoring the veneer first. Duplicated four 66" long pieces of stock without using a stop. That guide block is dead accurate. Didn't even have to trim the ends with a low-angle block plane. Smooth as silk an the exact lenght.
Think I'll keep it, as it is a great saw. A majority of trim carpenters here in the Atlanta area are sold on their value an accuracy. Of course, they may be more accurate in this area than other areas of the country. ha..ha..
I have used the Bosch an Makita also. Both are excellent. I don't think the fact that Hitachi sales are low will indicate that the saw is not a great one. They don't advertise heavily an most people over-look the brand for that reason. That will catch up with a company eventually.
There is a Makita assembly plant about 14 miles from me in Flowery Branch, GA. I know some folks that work there an have for years. They have had 3 major lay-offs in the last 6 years. Back in the early 80's Makita was the dominator on the market when they introduced the well made, big HP electric hand tools. At this point, their SCMS is all I would be interested in as most of the line is over-priced an Makita is not as innovative as they once were. Just because Makita is having a few problems of their own, does not lower the quality of the current SCMS. My opinion only, of course.
Evening...
sarge..jt
Sarge,
""most of the line is over-priced an Makita is not as innovative as they once were""
You think innovative is a criteria for judging a tool company? Too funny. Ask Jamie, she'll explain that one to you! ;^)
Because I can't! Last word in criteria ya know! hehehe
Don
Edited 8/24/2003 12:51:05 PM ET by Don C.
Don
I do think innovation is one criteria for judging a company. If a company these days doesn't keep up with the lastest gadgets an another company does, they lose market share. I have seen people sell a perfectly good tool to get one another company added a gadget too. And this was done without the new tool being put through the grinder in the field. They had a excellent tool, but were attracted to the new gadget.
I don't think that way, but many do. An that changes market share. If the market share drops too low, that puts the company in risk of decline an failure. If they fail, I can't get parts an support for their product I previously bought. So I look at that as one thing I consider when purchasing from a particular company. Hitachi added a laser, a taller fence an more postitive an idenifiable degree stops. Why? Innovation to keep up with the competition. The saw was great before they did it, but the improvements of their original engineering over-looks makes it even better.
Delta has finally got their head out of the sand an are getting innovative at this moment. After years of riding a name with no innovative improvements, they lost market share an dedicated customers. Is it too late? I don't know, but I can tell you it wasn't soon enough. That's a different thread.
So yeah, I think innovation is an important criteria I use to judge a tool company. Or one that I would consider buying stock in also. If the public is asking for it, you better give it to them. If you don't, that innovative competitor will an we go home without a pay-check eventually. ha..ha..
sarge..jt
Sarge,
I totally agree with you. I also think companys that lag the rest of the market with innovation because they do nothing on their own except copy what has been successful for others is a good indicator of what a company is really about. DeWalt's Woodworker Tablesaw followed by Jet's Supersaw is a good example. Jet doesn't offer anything to woodworkers except the dumbing down of the efforts of others.
Good to know research is still important, and that criteria can exceed color and "a good deal."
I'm with you on the Delta changes also. Good to see them unequivocally separate their tool line out with first the import Shopmaster line, and now the "X" line. Should reduce the confusion by some of what is made where which has been a contention for some for a while.
Enjoy the day,
Don
Don
BTW, if you do need any parts or tech support for the Hitachi, there is a factory parts an service center about 9 miles from me here in Atlanta. I just drop in ocassionally to see if they've got anything new in the cooker. The service staff are really know-ledgeable guys an gals.
May drop by tomorrow on the way to the hardwood store to pick up some spare drive belts for the SCMS.
Have a good week-end...
sarge..jt
Sarge,
Thanks for the offer. Should I need anything in the future I will keep this in mind. You know, I don't have a clue where the nearest repair center is for me? Hopfully I'll never need to find out either! ;^)
Don
Sarge, Being so close to the Mak plant (is that Buford?), have you ever heard why many if not all of Makita's stationary tools are no longer available? I've always regretted selling my 2040 planer. I've used the 2030 combo machine in the past, too ............ all top notch imho.
jc
Yes, it is Buford. Actually Flowery Branch. They are a stones throw from each other an Makita may have a Buford mailing address.
I do not know why they stopped production on the stationary tools. I remember when Makita came on strong back in my early WW days. Seems it was either late 70's or early 80's. They were making great machines with quality an a lot more HP than most others. The serious WW back then would have killed to get their hands on a new (then) Makita.
The folks that worked at Makita were paid relatively well an had great benefits. That innovation toward employees may have led to what is currently happening. It's da*n hard to compete with the cheap Taiwanese an now the even cheaper Chinese labor. Hooker Furniture in Kernersville N.C. went down about a week ago. They're making furniture over there too. Sad, but a reality.
I will try to make contact with some of the Makita folks I know. If so, will try to get an answer to that. I'm lucky to have a Makita, Hitachi, PC, Dewalt an I think Bosch service center within about 20 miles of my home. (Not totally sure on the Bosch, I think Stone Mtn. Tool)
Have a good evening.. probably morning when you read this..
sarge..jt
Did you ever find out why Makita stopped manufacturing stationary tools?
True, true. Hitachi hasn't gone out on a limb to advertise heavily and make a big name for itself. Its business strategy seems more geared on making a decent tool and sticking to their market share. Some of the wares are so-so, but priced well enough to still generate sales. I probably hear more good things about the saws than anything else they make. The 15" chop is a staple to some crews, both framing and trimming, for capacity alone. If a trim carpenter is comfortable staking his reputation on that saw for cutting wide crown, it can't be too bad, one would assume, even if you hadn't owned or tried it. Anymore, you need the build of a linebacker to lift some of these things. Ok, that's maybe a downside to the sliders more than regular compound saws. When I set up in a new home, I have to adjust the pants, squat, and deadlift the thing onto the stand.
Yesterday was a good day to be thinking about features. I trimmed an expansive basement with one other guy, and that saw ran for the better part of 13 hours for the two of us to get it knocked out in one day. He'd never used my saw before. I think he's about ready to buy one now. "The child is grown / The dream is gone / And I have become / Comfortably numb " lyrics by Roger Waters
I've owned 2 8" Hitachi sliders. My partner and I destroyed the first from use and cleaning with compressed air. It turned out we blew sawdust into the bearings.
The second one we just used until it wouldn't work anymore. We would have bought a third but at the time there was a heavy tax being levied on import tools and it drove the price up to $700+.
I bought a Dewalt 12" SCMS and haven't had a single complaint. I like the handle on it, seems more natural. I did add a table with extension side wings.
I've used the Bosch and Makita but how many SCMS can a man own?
Len
Thanks for all the info and replys guys! I have looked into it further , and, as I do make my living from it, have decided to put my tool brandism aside and go with the Makita slider. Also considered the Bosch and Hitachi, but for the $$ seems like Makita is a deal.
Have fun with your Sawdust. Timothy B.
The dewalt saw sucks. Excuse my language but I use one very day at work. It is not accurate, the blade is the worst on the market, it is unsafe, it is so loud that it scares me to start it up..... the list goes on.
I own the Makita 10" slider. Simply a joy to use. Wouldn't own anything else. Awesome in every way. GREAT blade.
Good luck with your decision
Rob Kress
Robs post reminds me of something else I like about the Bosch, and forget about anymore until I hear other saws. It's (relatively speaking, of course) quiet. My shop vacs make more noise. I wonder if the belt drive doesn't have something to do with that."The child is grown / The dream is gone / And I have become / Comfortably numb " lyrics by Roger Waters
I've noticed that about machines originating from Europe.
That's not to say they aren't built here. I don't know if Bosch has a plant here.
They're quieter than American and Japanese saws.
Does European manufacturers have a noise level that they design to?
entirely possibly but beyond the scope of my knowlege base. But you have a point. Look at the Fein or Festo vacs, or even the motors on some of the Metabo wares. Quiet is good. Earplugs are a hassle (I still wear them all the time. Keeps me from hearing my wife!) :-)"The child is grown / The dream is gone / And I have become / Comfortably numb " lyrics by Roger Waters
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