2025 is going to be a rip. Stumbled into starting a shop
TLDR:
I accidentally started a furniture & cabinetry shop. I have most of my ‘shop tools’ (tables saw/etc. floor standing machines) though I need to outfit myself with the ‘hand tools’.
Happy New Year’s Eve!
I nearly forgot what day it was…life has been a wild ride recently & I figured it would behoove me to seek some feedback from a forum.
Likely, some will not believe this post, especially if the full story were to be told, though I couldn’t make it up if I’d tried.
Long story short, a friend asked me to help complete the construction of a log cabin in Nov & I decided I wanted to get into working with my hands by becoming a carpenter. I initially intended to start by going into ‘general contracting’ & then into cabinetry + furniture over time, though boy has life thrown me some wild curves & turned all of that on its head.
Last month a local businessman sought to repurpose some ‘historic waste materials’ from a demolition into shuffleboards (anticipating ~70 units + ‘up-sell’ furniture add-on), I’ll be closing on a ‘handyman’s special’ home/flip at the end of the week, the start of last week saw the delivery of most of my ‘stationary shop tools’, & Friday of last week was a meeting with a custom home designer/home builder from the nearest ‘big city’ who was eager to find basically exactly what I’m looking to build as well as feeling jaded towards their current cabinet maker. It has been invigorating to ‘get back into the game’, as I’ve been on an unbelievable sabbatical for the past several years, though it is also quite daunting.
On the ‘legal front’, I’m working on getting incorporated/insured/etc. though paper only moves so fast.
Last week, I received an 8″ jointer, 22/44 drum sander, belt/disk combo sander, drill press, mortiser, table saw, band saw, & shaper table. Table saw had a broken weld on a part & is being replaced (the entire unit…very annoyed by that), expected mid-month, & I have an OS31 mill waiting to be assembled + chew logs. After closing on the house & squaring away other tools/parts of budget, I’ll be getting a 20″ planer so long as/once I can safely afford it (same for upgrading dust collector).
The above tool outfit was in preparation for making the shuffleboards, which were going to be of good quality though built more in a rustic/timber style for which high-precision was not as crucial (e.g. the mortise & tenon construction from S4S lumber would have for the most part fit off the power saw/mortiser with a bit of love). I was prompted to make this post as the pieces being sought by the custom designer/builder are two-fold: general custom cabinets (e.g. kitchen) & custom fine furniture/woodworking (e.g. high-end vanities, shelving, artistic wood floor patterns, etc.). The former (shuffleboards) would have required some ‘close work tools’, though the latter (custom designer work) will require that I move my ‘hand tools’ investment up to the very near term – it is for this investment which I am seeking advice.
I’ll elaborate as requested, I already wrote too much.
Thanks,
-Some dude in a tent on the edge of the wilderness
PS:
I’ll have another mate working in the same shop on the same products as an independent contractor, so some redundancy in tools would be advisable to keep select tools ‘our own’, e.g. chisels & other blades/squares/gauges/oft used/’apprentice tools’.
PPS:
While I’m not yet in the position to seek feedback as I’m at the drawing board, once I have more understanding I look forward to discussing the details of woodworking & furniture design with you folks. Cheers & Happy New Years!
‘If you need a tool & don’t buy it, you’ll pay for the tool & not have it.’ -Henry Ford
Replies
So you labeled your own lengthy post TLDR (too long, didn't read)?
Someone is celebrating New Year's a bit early....
I guess moving the TLDR to the top may have been a poor design decision.
Thank you for your constructive criticism.
Take no notice. I likes long essay-posts as they represent an antithesis to the often-mentioned "overthinking" meme. Some may be content to chew a small piece of twitter-gum all day but I likes a large joint o' summick meaty to get me mental teeth around! Yum-yum.
Anyroadup - good luck! Methinks you'll need it. :-)
In particular, mind yer fingers with all them new-to-you machines. The USA has a somewhat high appetite for risk-taking with such stuff. Also, don't be in hurry, despite the nagging from your customers. Time having fingers sewn back on in a hospital is not money (for you, at least).
Hello lat_axe & thank you for your sage advice!
I appreciate that the first constructive comment is about safety - I was a combat medic in the army, I've seen some injuries & the last thing I want is to get caught up in a piece of machinery. For me, quality/precision & safety trump profits & schedules.
I look forward to providing you with more large joint o' summick meaty in the future lmao (I was voted 'most articulate' by the student consultancy I was a member of - I am verbose if nothing else! ahah)
Cheers & happy new year!
Congratulations - this sounds like an exciting step in your journey!
The move from hobbyist to production will require backing off the bling and focusing on making this work financially. The biggest things to consider about how you outfit yourself from here on out are efficiency and safety.
Get things that help you manage volume. Carts for moving and managing material are often overlooked. Your time is money and every step you take fetching material is time wasted and money lost. Keep volumes of material close at hand and easy to move in bulk. Machines and jigs that help you safely process material at volume are extremely important. Hand-paring four parts with a chisel is fun. When you have 250 parts to complete you're looking at 14 hour work days.
Focus on your safety. Use power feeders when you can. Collect all dust possible since some dust is sensitizing over time and can shut down a career prematurely. Take your safety seriously since things fly unexpectedly, monotonous tasks and having to moving too fast leads to accidents, weird stuff happens, and hearing loss comes for everyone with enough exposure.
Moving to a production setting removes plenty of the romance of woodworking. Time, money, and safety become your biggest concerns because losing any of those three legs of your business stool means your idea may not last too long. Good luck!
Hello colopr!
What you stated is well received & greatly appreciated.
It is easy to 'romanticize' the work though at the end of the day it is still work.
While I do not have a specific specialization in process engineering, I have some background in the topic & some of the things you mentioned were on my mind (e.g. material movement & volume processing). One interesting aspect of the intersection of process engineering & woodworking is the need to consider the properties of wood, which isn't something which other materials need to consider as much, e.g. one can cut a steel beam & let it sit for a month though if one cuts a mortise + tenon in wood a few hours/days can make the joint non-fitting.
Presently, my shop is ~30'x45' with ~1/4 consumed by a parking space & furnace. I've invested in powermatic for all shop tools but the shaper & likely the planer (Jet). It is my aim to be accurate enough with these power tools to be able to fit joints on 'volume furniture' with minimal hand fitment. (In this vein & the previous statement about wood process engineering, I'd originally planned to process in batches of eight, i.e. prep boards for eight tables, then mark M+T next day, then cut M+T next day, then fit+glue next day, I've been reconsidering & thinking instead that to prevent issues related to wood movement that I should instead process tables from start to finish instead of batch. Any thoughts on this?)
Dust collection was a concern of mine & after leaving prototyping before entering production I am hoping to have sufficient capital to invest in a quality filtration system. I'd not seriously considered power feeders, thank you for mentioning this, I will work that into my plan. Re. hearing loss, I plan to wear hearing protection when using any power tools - I worked at a trap/skeet field in high school as the guy who hit the button, I learned my lesson haha.
Fortunately, as far as 'financial concern' goes, if the closing on the property goes well next week, I'll have a roof + tools + vehicle with no debt (some student loans), so I should be in a decent position to weather lean times (I can get a remote job or 'work at a gas station' to make ends meet if needed - I'm adaptable, I've been living in a tent in the woods for three years now ahaha).
Cheers & happy new year!
Wood - it is volatile stuff compared to those other worked-materials such as metals and plastics, as you mention. Although we murder the tree, the planks still have a sort of zombie life in them, expanding and contracting; cupping and winding; perhaps harbouring a tension that springs out to surprise you when you table saw through it.
Early on in my amateur woodworking I did buy some pretty hardwoods from a timber yard. This was the stuff that taught me the sometimes annoying lessons about recently-felled wood and its remaining liveliness. Even three years in the air drying stack hadn't fully finished it orf!
Later I took to scavenging and reclaiming much older timber from various sources such as refurbished old buildings (often Georgian or Victorian). This timber tended to be far more stable than the stuff from those timber yards. However, there was still the problem of the movements due to making at one level of humidity (initially in an unheated and sometimes damp shed) then installing the finished item in another (usually drier) humidity such as a centrally-heated house.
More lively wood antics, with lessons learnt about designing for relative movement of juxtaposed parts in a piece. However, even catering to that in the usual ways, if the shed was particularly damp whilst the house was warm and dry ....... Crack! Warp!
So ..... for you, making for perhaps unknown final locations, it may be necessary to make your work space as akin, humidity-wise, to a house interior as possible. Some commercial makers don't do this. Even some of the posh ones may still be producing their stuff in a large cold shed that's dampish.
We have some Mouse-man (Robert Thompson) style solid oak furniture made by one of the Mouse-man's apprentices (Albert Jeffrey) who has a production environment as old-fashioned as the things produced. The dining table has small gaps on the table top ends, because it was made in a relatively damp environment then put into an always-warm modern house. But Albert probably couldn't afford a centrally-heated new factory shed so had to make in his old stone barn.
I can't offer any advice on what you asked for.
Sounds like you have a whole lot going on at once.
I'm not being negative; I just imagine myself in your position.
I would be very excited about all these incredibly big and new opportunities.
It sounds like this is a prime scenario for huge failures as well, though.
My unsolicited advice would be not to be afraid or back down at all but to temper yourself so that when you do fail, big or small, it isn't as devastating and to remember not to give up.
Learn from them, do what is right, and keep on trucking.
In my view succeeding = growth, failures = 10x growth
I focus on my failures SO much more than my achievements.
Not because I mean to be hard on myself but only because I know that's where the juicy lessons and wisdom reside.
Lat_axe, your posts are by far my favorite lol. You crack me up every time. XD I literally laugh out loud.
Also, I think your advice is particularly sage in this case.
His attention is going to be pulled in 20 different complex directions constantly.
It is very easy to get in a rush or not pay attention while using all those new machines.
Checking himself constantly and remembering to slow down and RELAX will be crucial.
Hello Bentusi :)
Thank you for your advice. It brings to mind Robert Kipling's work 'If' & other quotes from 'greats of the past' regarding the importance of the ability to rise to challenges & to accept 'defeats' not as instances of being conquered though instead as instruments of learning.
Your last comment reminds me of the oft stated 'motto of the medic' - "Slow is smooth, smooth is fast".
I look forward to seeking your council in the future as you seem to be a wise individual :)
God bless & happy new year!
Be careful about how far you get it. It sounds like all of this "could" happen, which a buyer seeking favorable terms would always say "will" even if they think the could go a different direction at some point or change their mind entirely. They'll tell you what's in their best interest, not yours.
GCs and builders are notorious for pushing around smaller subcontractors - and sometimes.
did I gather correctly from what you said two months ago you decided you wanted to work with your hands? How much stuff have you made in the past for pay, and what have you learned from it - in terms of efficiency, etc.
I'd be very wary of any GC or builder seeking out people new to the business - it doesn't make a lot of business sense for them to do that without you having a portfolio and a history of hitting budget (or better) and timelines.
Hello davidweaver!
Thank you for your comment & I appreciate you providing your wisdom, it sounds like you have a breadth of experience as relates to providing products for GCs.
The designer/builder I met with is an owner/operator custom builder & the custom designer who I met with specifically is a small business owner which was absorbed by/started a new company with the custom builder. The designer was looking for two things: 1) Someone who would provide custom pieces, & 2) A new cabinet maker as their current supplier 'doesn't value their business'. They seem to be good people & they are fully aware of my business' present state, with the first 'job' being a shelf system & a vanity (I didn't want to bite off more than I could chew & agree to a six figure job which I couldn't deliver on & could bankrupt me if it went south). I approach business a little bit differently due to my 'old soul', fortune 50o consulting experience (which soured me to modern business practices), & business education - I'm seeking a strategic & long-term partnership with this client & they seem to be the type to value a long-term vendor. I've approached this first job in this fashion & kept it small to ensure it is a good fit/to not over extend myself.
I've not built much with my hands recently. In my youth I was more into this creative expression & I've done some work 'in the trades' (flipping houses/apartments) + I have a BS in engineering to provide technical background in engineering & design as well as a MSTM (basically an MBA for engineers) to provide a foundation in business.
The guy I'm working with (technically an independent contractor for my company) has 30+ years of construction experience & ran a small/mid-sized construction company before 'entering retirement'. He is 'a bit rough' in that his work has been more in the realm of home/outbuilding construction as opposed to fine woodworking with shop tools, though he is killer at sales & has vast experience in general construction, which is a valuable asset & should help me bridge the gap.
I'm guessing that with your experience that we'll cross digital paths in the future - it is nice to meet you, David. I hope your 2025 is off to a good start!
After reading it a few times, I think I don't know what you want.
Hand tools are ALL based about having very sharp cutting edges that you as the user have to maintain.
Your first port of call is to learn to sharpen effectively, and to that end I recommend a Tormek. It's pretty hard not to end up with razor sharp tools with that system and though it's a little slow, the results are stunning.
After you have learned to get sharp, you don't want to buy too many - almost all of my work is done with a 1/2" and a 1" chisel, a block plane and a No4 plane. a 1/4" chisel is occasionally useful. If you are starting out and have the $$ buy veritas or lie nielsen to make sure you know what a good one feels like from the start.
You can make a lot of stuff with that short list, and a couple of decent saws.
Sounds overwhelming:-) From scratch to a shop full of powermatic is not something many could pull off.
Solid brand but my understanding is that ordering can take a while so not a bad idea to stack up on small parts when you have an order. Can be a killer to have a machine down 2 weeks because of 4$ part.
Seen a few post on FB of people liquidating shop. Might be something to look for for additional equipment along your journey. Hope to hear more from you. GL