Take a look at the enclosed picture. I’m thinking about using some ball bearning full extension drawer guides for these small drawers (the small ones on either side) and mounting them on the *bottom* of the drawers as opposed to the side. Is there any reason that wouldn’t work? these are pretty small so i’m assuming i’d only use one per drawer — agree?
here’s a link to the style of drawer guide i’d use.
http://www.accuride.com/products/woodworking/details.php?p=38321&c=mediumduty_wa
Replies
Why not bottom mount slides made for the application, like the Accuride 1029?
The only issue is attachment to the drawer bottom. If there is any extra stress it will probably want to pull the screws out. You may want to size up the bottom thickness. I'm doing the same thing with a pull out but I'm using two on a half inch bottom. The full extension under mount slides are too expensive.
Beat it to fit / Paint it to match
Hammer:"The full extension under mount slides are too expensive."Undermount slides seem to be priced somewhere between $30 and $50 a pair - more than I wanted to pay!I just paid $10 a pair for 15 pairs of 22" undermount at Hardware Warehouse.http://thehardwarehouse.com/index.php?cPath=4Prompt and friendly service. Haven't fitted any of them yet.Hastings
Hi Bob ,
The Accuride slide in the link is not designed for under mount usage , it can be used but will flex more than need be . Jigs has given good advice the Accuride 1029D is designed for under mount , KV makes one also .
Regardless you will need a 1/2" bottom for either type . I use them on roll out shelves when retro fitting them .
I use 2 under each unit and do not use the nylon glides .
good luck dusty
The 3832 will fail relatively quickly if side mounted. The bearing/race structure is set up to resist the load in the up/down orientation they show it installed in. The 1029 is designed to mount flat.
The 3832 would probably fair better mounted horizontally, than the 1029 mounted vertically, but since there isn't any real difference in cost, it really makes more sense to use things like the designer intended.
dusty sorry this is meant for Bob, but I forgot to change the to, and if I try going back I end up at the first thread I looked at tonight.
well, thanks so much! That looks good, i guess i just didn't know a nice ball bearing version existed. Does anyone make a version that fully extends? Also how much room do you guys/gals typically leave on either side of the drawer. I'm short on space so i'm thinking something like 1/8th" on either side.
Bob , Do you need any clearance for the hinges ?
Zero protruding function allows for clearance .
Will you have a shelf or rail between the drawers ?
What will the slides fasten down to ?
dusty
for the small drawers on either side (5 on each side) there will be a face frame member between each drawer -- about 1" wide. So i suppose i'll run a piece of wood between the ff and the back of the cabinet for the slide to mount to or use the bracket that attaches to the back. <-- i've never used these...for all my other slides that mount on the side, i've mounted the slides to the side of the cabinet.
You bring up a conern i have on another part of the cabinet though when you mention clearance. For that center section where i want to have a couple doors in front of some drawers, i'm thinking that i'm going to have to have the drawer slides (blum tandem maybe) sit in a good 3/4" from the face frame. Also i can't use my typical euro hinges cause they'd be in the way of the drawers. So i need to use something that doesn't protrude out into the drawer area when the doors are open. Any suggestions?
Bob ,
On that center section you have several options , you could simply make the roll out a bit narrower to allow the needed clearance or , place the hinges between the roll out drawers.
Just out of curiosity , why not use side mounted slides on those small drawers on each side ?
dusty
the reason i'm not using the side mounted ones is, it just seems to me that it would look odd on such small drawers. They almost seem like the kind that don't have any real slide at all -- rather ones that just fit into a cavity and slide via friction.
regarding making it narrower, that is kind of what the picture on the right shows. It shows that there actually a 3/4" piece of wood inside the cabinet which the big drawer drawer-slides mount to. i was thinking of doing this just so the door is out of the way enough of the slides not to get bumped. I'm afriad the door won't open all the way because it'll probably hit the drawer pulls on the small drawers.
Edited 5/6/2007 12:06 am ET by BobC
I'm late to the dance here, but others are quite correct about not using the 3832 slides as undermounts, and instead using the Accuride 1029 model. The 1029's are a good and inexpensive alternative to the to the full extension undermounts (like the Blum Tandems), but they do open only to 3/4 length.If you don't mind spending the money the Blum Tandems are terrific. Accurdie 1029:http://tinyurl.com/369zssWith your other question about hinges, if you want to stay with a European style cup hinge, both Grass and Blum offer face frame hinges that would solve the problem you mention.http://www.grassusa.com/Pages/DisplayCat.asp?Command=hg&ItemIndex=12&famID=tec********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
nikki
i've used the blum's on all of the kitchen and i just can't see paying that kind of money for these 10 little drawers. On the 3 big center drawers where i have a lot of dovetail joinery to show off, i might us the blums.
I like that TEC 831...never seen a hinge like that.
I stopped by woodzone today and actually picked up a couple ?(terminology)? hinges which aren't the euro=cup style. Rather hinges which will allow me to fit these doors inset (forgot to mention that in my original post). They are the kind you see on typical china cabinets where only a small part of the hinge sets outside the door. there's no documentation w/them naturally so i need to determine how much gap they need -- i.e. what size should my door be for a given face frame opening size.
For those small doors on your vanity, the Accuride 1029's would be just what the doctor ordered -- as long as you don't mind the 3/4 extension (which IMHO would not be a big deal on such drawers).The 1029's are engineered to use only one slide per drawer, so they are really easy to install -- as long as you are using a face frame.********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
would you recommend that i mount them to a piece of wood that extends from the ff to the back? or to use the bracket that attaches to the back (which right now would probably be 1/4"). I've never used a bracket, so my hesitancy is knowing how to get the bracket exactly level.
When I have used them, I always did so with the bracket (which allows you to attach the cabinet member to the back of the cabinet).They are very easy to install, and as long as they are attached before the vanity top is installed, it should be easy peezy. I would definitely get the slides before you make the drawers (or the cabinet, for that matter), so you can be sure you have the proper clearances, etc.Since there is only one slide per drawer, I would also use this kind of edge guide on the front face frame:http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=207********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
Bob ,
It seems the further you go the more obstacles you are running into on this project .
In the name of helping you , I'd like to make some suggestions . The design imo needs tweaking . You have painted yourself into a corner so to speak where at each turn there is a problem .
Why have the doors at all in the center ? Why not just have the stack of drawers . I am not sure as to the final use of this cabinet , but it does not seem like a kitchen cabinet , but why open 2 doors just to get to the drawers especially the larger more useful drawers ?
From the pictures the cabinet looks maybe 36" wide give or take , why would you plan on so many smallish drawers on purpose ? What will they hold ? Can you re configure the looks of this piece ?
Functionally speaking drawers or roll outs behind doors are not wheel chair accessible so why the doors just for looks ? Why so many small drawers just for looks ?
I try and let the function dictate the design or at least guide the looks to adapt to the final purpose or use .
Sounds like you will use inset doors and drawers , will they be flush inset or 3/8" lipped where part of the door is in and part is out ? This will further hamper the 1029 slides and set them back more then just the face frame . Depending on the drawer box construction , will it have a front then drawer face applied ?
The 1029 comes 7/8" longer then the size ordered so 22" comes 22 7/8" long .
Also by only using only 1 - 1029 per drawer there be be no up and down leveling adjustment , with 2 you could shim under the brackets if needed , unless you plan to adjust the face .
The 1/4 back will offer little bite for the brackets , perhaps you could place rails across the back at the correct locations and set the slide on top of the rails . Honestly if you can make any changes to the engineering and design I would strongly recommend doing so .
good luck dusty
oldusty
i appreciate the pushback. The cabinet is just over 50" wide and it's meant to be almost more for looks than for function. I need something that looks more like a piece of built-in furnature -- w/a more formal look. The big drawers behind the doors would only get used once in a while. Kinda of like a china cabinet.
the way i've constructed my drawers thus far have been done such that the door face is installed after the drawers are completed -- they just attach. it's a little unclear how you do this when the door are fully inset (the plan).
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