Band Saw Quick Release Tension Problem
Hi Everybody,
I haven’t posted in awhile, been really busy, it’s nice to see things are as active as ever.
Following in no small part the advice from a lot of well-respected people here I purchased the Grizzly G0555 bandsaw about a year ago. As I said, I’ve been really busy so it hasn’t gotten as much use as I would have liked, but I can say that I REALLY enjoy it and I’m happier and happier with it each time I use it.
I have a question about the quick release blade tension lever. I tension the blade with the “Flutter Method” as the guide suggests and this has worked well. My only gripe with the tension lever is that every time I release tension it messes up the relation of the blade to the wheels and the guides. Then, when I go back to it I have to ensure that the blade is tracking in the middle of the wheel and that the guides are properly adjusted. It’s not that it’s a big deal, it only takes a couple of minutes, but if I’m missing something and I don’t have to be doing this then I’d rather just tension and get right to sawing. Does everybody go through this each time? ‘Cause if so I’ll just shut up about it.
Thanks all!
Erich
Replies
Hi Erich,
Nope, usually I tighten the tension and spin the blade by hand to make sure all is well and I'm ready to cut. Only if I change blades do I need to reset/check bearings, guides, etc.
It sounds like something else is not right. I have a Delta 14" so I can't help you with your Griz. I'm sure there are folks in here that are familiar with your saw. Hang in there, they'll be along shortly I'm sure.
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Erich, there are several people at WWA who have owned this saw for awhile, this is the first time I've heard of an issue with the quick-release. Have you called Grizzly? Pretty sure there's something going on with your particular saw.
Forest Girl and Bob,
Thanks for the replys. It seems that what happens is that the blade is so loose after releaseing the tension that it kinds of slips to the edge of the wheel and I have to push it back to the middle. This slipping towards the front of the wheel pulls it away from the guides of course. I've tried to be very slow in releasing the tension so that it doesn't slip. Maybe it's just not tight enough to start with. Maybe I should call Grizzly. Thanks again and for anybody else who might have more input. Take care...
Erich
Is there a minimum setting as well as a maximum somewhere between tensioned changing. Sounds like one stop bolt is missing. If not it kind of defeats the convenience doesn't it?
I have a King 14" with the standard tension bolt. When I back off to where the blade is sloppy but not falling off the tires, I wind it back tight and away it goes.Don
Erich,
When I was the Shop Manager at Fine Woodworking, I found that this was true of many of the blade release mechanisms. Personally I don't prescribe to the theory that blade tension needs to be released at all, but that is a topic for another discussion.
If you can get the loose blade roughly centered on the tires and then apply the tension and rotate the wheels by hand, the blade should track back to the position it was originally set up in without having to adjust the guides or the tracking.
John White
Hi Erich... I've been using my '555' for two+ years and I never release the tension on the blade. Most of the time I have a 1/4" or a 3/8" wide blade mounted for the projects I do. On my previous 14" bandsaw, I never released the tension either and the rubber tires (not poly) only lasted 18 years before one of them had to be replaced. If you release the tension on the blade, open the upper cover(guard) and spin the wheel through a half dozen revolutions WHILE re-tensioning the blade. THat should solve the problem.
SAwdustSteve Long Island, NY (E of NYC)
Evening Erich..
There is nothing wrong with your BS when you retention it. John White has already given you the answer. All BS's I have seen with a tension realease do that and why shouldn't they? You have not slowly released tension as you would if you were hand screwing it without a tension release quick lever. The sudden drop of the wheel all "at once" releasing will usually move the blade one way or other on the wheel.
Just be sure when you do re-tension that you "do" open the upper case and turn the wheel by hand about 3 or 4 complete turns. It will re-track itself if the tracking is set properly. Then.. be sure you "do" look at both the upper and lower guides to be sure when it did re-track that the blade is inside the guides seated as it was with the teeth forward to the bottom of the gullets.
I did this exact procedure 3 times today alone and only takes a matter of a minute. Another thing to be cautious about is I will leave it tensioned if I know I will be back to the saw shortly. Once when I though it was tensioned (in other words I did release tension and forgot I did it) I just took a quick glance at the guide-blade position which was fine and turned it on.
Oops.... to say the least as the blade goes flying off.. metal clangs and the blade likely snaps. So.. now, regardless if I know it is tensioned or not tensioned.... I Check it period to be sure it is. Your health.. your blade.. your guides.. your tires all appreciate this pre-caution! ha.. ha..
Sarge..
Hey Sarge, I did the same thing with my 14", forgetting to retension (pull the lever) and everything goes flying. Did this twice. Now...I put a small spring clamp on the blade, to remind me to RETENSION the dang blade before I turn it on. So far, this hasn't happened to my 17" bandsaw that replaced my 14". I believe in leaving the saw untensioned, when it's not going to be used for awhile. Stress is stress, and constant tension will needlessly reduce the life of the components IMO.I don't leave my gun clips loaded either, except when I need them. Saves the springs....;-)Jeff
My "string around the finger" is to drop the upper guides all of the way down to the table whenever I remove the tension from the blade.
-Steve
That's an excellent idea Steve. Similar to what I do when removing the battery from the smoke alarm (broiling steaks, whatever). I leave the little step ladder right underneath the alarm, and it's right in the way when walking into the bedroom. Otherwise, the darned thing will be un-powered for days before I notice.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
ah, I guess you don't live in a house with one of the d@#$ new style smoke detectors that are hardwired in. Those D@#$ things go off even with the batteries removed. (Ask me how I know.....)
Doug
Once upon a time I was a team leader on a Ranger sniper team. I had to go to the range 7 days a week and fire 600 rounds a day at targets ranging from 100 meters standing to 1000 meters open sight. Up to 1200 meters, the scope was used.
I spent a year in VN and we (we were about 400,000 of us at one time with the total number being higher over the course of the war years) always short-loaded the clips to avoid spring fatigue. If the spring wasn't just right, we found that first round out of the clip would often jam if the clip has been full loaded for awhile.
Some of this may have had to do with not using a heavier spring and possible feed design on a particular military firearm. There... as here... I didn't feel there was scientific evidence to back up spring failure or not as it could not be positively pin=pointed to the spring.
There.. as here... I just short loaded the d*mn thing and never had a problem with my weapon even though I cannot prove that was the true fix. Couldn't been just luck. So.. again... to each his own as there is no right or wrong answer IMO. ha.. ha...
Sarge..
Edited 1/10/2008 3:12 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
Edited 1/10/2008 3:13 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
Sarge,
You can over compress some springs if they aren't properly designed for the application, which causes them to become permanently shorter. From you description, that sounds like the problem with the ammo clips. It isn't caused by fatigue, the first time the spring is compressed too far the damage is done. The same problem occurs with the stock springs on 14" Delta style bandsaws.
John W.
And I agree that could be the case as the spring was somewhat light IMO. But... in this application you could not have one too heavy either as it would present a problem on the other end of the spectrum. With upward projection that could possibly launch it too high in relation to the barrel receiver before a gas operated bolt made contact and seated the round.
I suppose weapons needs are a bit different than those required on a BS. Unless you really over-tensioned one, I personally don't think there would be a problem. But.. as I stated, I have a tension release and I use it regardless of my guessing as to what really happens.
On one hand, it may not be needed? On the other hand, it doesn't do any harm so I have both hands covered by doing so. ha.. ha...
Highest regards Mr. White...
Sarge..
E, not to worry, we all use different saws but set up properly they all mostly act the same(we are not dealing with power and cut here) so I have a Ridgid 14" with a riser block using a 105" blade. I installed a Carter tension release as I leave it for months at a time till my final move into this house. I had wrecked a tire with a factory blade with too much tension and now use Suffolk blades at a lower tension. Never the less, using a 1/4" blade over the holidays I would open the top cover eye ball the blade on the tire move the tension arm slowly to increase the tension while insuring that the blade was sitting close to center on the tire. Spin the top wheel by hand and the blade should center up on the tires and in the guides.
When you drop the tension smaller blades may slide over due to having less mass, just re-center them as you re-tension, roll them by hand and all should be fine. I think that you just needed to have your level of expectation re-focused and knots is cheaper than having to replace tires, like me, but ya always need to check. Paddy
Paddy, everyone's talking about tires, but I was under the impression that giving the bearings a break was a primary reason to release tension. No???forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Yes..ma'am....Bearing would be another argument for those that do and those that don't and the question rages on and will continue to as "pins or tails".. "left-right tilt".
It is a fact that bearing under load will wear out sooner than bearing not under load. The real question lies in "just how much load" before it becomes a factor. With various specs on various BS's.. that is another factor IMO that there will be no scientific answer to.
Again.. just use your common sense and make a personal call based on that. I don't think you will be right.. nor do I think you will be wrong. :>)
Regards...
Sarge..
A moving bearing under a heavy load will wear out faster than the same bearing rotating under a light load. If the bearing isn't moving, which is what is being discussed here, then releasing the tension won't make any difference to the life of the bearing.
Also, as someone else has already pointed out, a stationary spring under a constant load doesn't suffer from fatigue, it is repeated flexing that occasionally leads to spring failure, and I have never seen a band saw spring that cracked, so the problem, if it exists at all, is very rare.
The only valid argument for releasing the tension is that the saw's tires might take a set, but I haven't seen that happen with the modern synthetic tires. If a saw's tires are taking a set, it is probably a sign that they are deteriorating and need to be replaced.
John White
J, I guess it would help them out if they were not in stationary pressure but the pressure will be across at least 1/3 of the race, not a real small concentration and the sealed bearings are of a decent size not little tiny ones. I generally don't leave things in tension or under pressure( it's an old Navy thing) . I even depressurize and secure air lines when finished with them for the day. No hoses should ever be left pressurized to a source like your BBQ grill, secure the tank or supply pipe valve and just turn a burner valve on for a second to relieve the pressure in the rubber hose and the hose will last you a long time and be safe.
I just find the BS tension release an easy way to take care of business particularly when changing blades, it is a few bucks but worth it. I will be changing to a resaw blade in the AM and will take note of the bearings and tires and post if any lights come on. All the best, Paddy
John, Steve, Sarge and Paddy,
Thanks guys. Sounds like I'm doing it right after all, and that I will need to just go through that quick check of the blade position and guide position when I re-tension the blade. Also, I thought it was law and probably somewhere in the U.S. Code that the blades be released between uses. Maybe I need to relax about that too to a certain extent. I appreciate all your help!
Erich
I have no knowledge of a law stating that and frankly, doubt it. Even if there were, who would enforce it in a home shop?
There has always been an argument about releasing tension or not releasing and that won't change. After working for years with automobile springs and the effect of consistent compression on them, I release. And that is simply based on physical evidence of worn out (stressed springs). The guy standing next to me swear he has never had a problem and may not have?
Those with that opinion would probably mention constant stress on the BS tire also as rubber will crack and break with wear. I cannot say how the new style polyurethane tires react at this point?
So... just use your common sense and draw your own conclusions. You have the feature, so why not release? If you can reason that it is not necessary in your mind... leave it tensioned. Life is simple! ha.. ha...
Sarge..
"Even if there were, who would enforce it in a home shop?"
Why, the Bandsaw Police, of course!
The arguments for releasing tension on a steel spring don't make much sense to me. Barring temperature extremes, steel can fatigue from constant flexing, but it doesn't measurably fatigue from being held fixed, in tension or compression.
Rubber and some kinds of plastics are another story. They can take a "compression set." Polyurethane is generally much better than rubber, but it's not immune.
-Steve (who always releases the bandsaw blade tension at the end of the day, except when he forgets)
I release after I had a talk about this with Eaton-Detroit Spring who have been mamking auto springs since the 1920's I believe. There is no true scientific evidence one way or the other. They just say that they have been in business making and replacing springs for almost 100 years.
I have a tension release.. I release. I would not tell someone they are wrong if they don't. My decision is made for me and it's up to them as I doubt anyone can present true sceintific evidence that you should or shouldn't and probably a conversation most will forget 20 minutes from nowll ... much less 20 years from now! ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..
Regards...
Sarge..
I have similar Grizzly bandsaws, had the 14" now have the 17" extreme...both have tension levers. I also use the flutter method. What I have found effective, is to retension the machine (pull the lever) and spin the top wheel by hand, watching to ensure that everything realigns properly. I usually need to spin it about three revolutions and everything realigns just fine. Give that a try, you may be surprised...& let me know if that is not effective for you. If it is not, then some aspect of your configuration is NOT holding it's alignment.
Jeff
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled