I am wondering what advice all of you professional furniture-makers can offer to someone that wants to become a furniture-maker. I am 25 years old and I have been working as a finish carpenter since high school. I really want to make the transition into furniture and cabinetmaking. I would like to know what schools you would suggest and maybe some insight on what it will be like trying to find a job after I complete school?
Replies
you might want to tell us where you are to find schools
"It is like hitting yourself in the head with a hammer: it feels so good when you stop"
I live in the catskill mountains in NY. I am open to moving. I have been looking at the woodworking program at Red Rocks CC in Denver. Was thinking about the center for furniture craftsman in maine, but I am concerned about borrowing that much money.
my freind has a cabin in the catskills. you must do a lot of skiing
"It is like hitting yourself in the head with a hammer: it feels so good when you stop"
I know a couple of people who have gone to North Bennet Street School, in Boston, are very successful. Also know of one that taught there and is on advisory panel, again very successful.
http://www.nbss.org/home/index_flash.asp
North Bennett Street School in Boston is the best.
What ever you do be careful of taking on a lot of debt if you go with going to a high end private school. You are looking at a career that is not as a whole conducive to earning a large yearly income. You might consider trying some of the community colleges like college of the redwoods in Fort Bragg California and then working at some of the high end commercial shops. This is not to put down some of the private schools I am sure they are excellent. It is just my opinion but getting out of school with a 50 to 100k debit load is very scary if you are going to make less than 50k a year. Of course opinions are like noses and people might not like to hear mine blow:). Anyway good luck with your future
Troy
Thank you for taking the time to respond!
Getting deep into debt is the last thing I want to do. I have been looking at the college of the redwoods and red rocks community college. Can you offer any advice on getting a job in the furniture world. I am wondering how difficult it will be to find employment in a furniture shop as opposed to a commercial type production minded cabinet shop. Would you mind sharing a little about what you do and how you got to where you are?? Thank You!!
I just ruin wood in my garage. I have taken classes at Laney college in Oakland CA. I have some friends that work on their own or at shops. I think you have to start networking with other students and instructors. If you do well in a school like your looking into you will be able to get work. Be paitiant, have a good attitude, be someone an employer will want around, add value, don't be a jacka**. Good grief I sound like my father:) Anyway I'm sure you will do great.Good luckTroy
Jack
Consider finding a craftsman who is looking to take on an apprentice. It would be valuable, hands on experience, and you will learn as you work. It will also give you an opportunity to see the day to day strife in a professional shop.
Jeff
Jack,Furniture shop or cabinet? You need to refine that question a little. By furniture shop, do you mean a Lane, a Henredon or ####Pennsylvania House or do you mean with a high end Furniture Craftsman?
In my former life, I have photographed many of these big operations from Georgia Pacific and Boise Cascade timber harvest operations from Barranquilla,Colombia and Fairbanks, AK to end installations of finished doors, cabinets and furniture and it gave me a unique position to view the industry. In reality the Lane etc. operations are no different than the Kraft Maid Kitchen industrial cabinet operations. It's mean low paying, low benefit, high pressure, high production work with more and more of it using less labor and more CNC methods. I'm not putting down people who work there in any way- they work very hard and are really nice. Employment is far from stable.
Most big shops have cut over 30 % off labor force in the just the last 2 years (aside from the economy) because of nesting, CNC computer operations and outsourcing to foreign labor. You will learn in short order how such business are set up but you will learn very little about fine woodworking. Not in a 100 coffee table/day or 1000 cherry sink bases/day nor in a 5000 bed knob/day in the backwood barns of North Carolina. That being said, if you can find such a "day" job near the school you want to go to, it will soften the financial blow, but as an end goal of employment, you seem to imply you want more.
I echo others here about Community colleges or College of Redwoods. They will teach you everything that the "famous" schools will at 1/3 the cost. Student loans are backbreaking to pay off. The high end schools do offer other benefits and intangibles but the essence is not much difference from other complete schools - furniture design is another matter. North Bennett is fine. There are two great schools up in Maine and Vermont and a great one in Portland, Or. If your thinking Maine, with your skills you might find "fill in" work in the boat building industry.As far as working for a fine craftsman, they often have their own ways that would conflict with what you learned in school but more importantly, they usually can't pay you what you think is a fair. BUT you will learn more than tenon joints from them. This would be a good starting point for a career.
As a finish carpenter, you already have a head start on most. Most of us can do a great dovetail but fall apart cutting ceiling crown :-)
Pick where the instruction you want is then after school pick where you want to live THAT has general markets for your goods, supplies to make them, and with a demographic of buyers that can afford your products. All three. (all easy to say)Go for it!I'm not anything if not verbose...John
If you are willing to move, then look for what suits you best. I moved from Washington D.C. to Australia to go to furniture school. Because of the program that they offered. Some people say that North Bennett is the best. But that depends on the type of furniture you want to make when you finish. If you love antique reproduction work, then yes it is the best. If you are into more contemporary design and Studio Furniture, then I would go there. Look at College of the Redwoods and The Centre for Furniture Craftsmanship. I actually know and have been taught by the lead instructor at the CFC. He is a great maker and fabulous teacher.As far as finding a job, it's slim pickings. There are not a lot of makers out there that are bigger than their one man shops. So your choices are doing it for yourself, or hoping you can find a job out there. I hope this helps. If you want to go overseas, check out The Australian School of Fine Furniture. Great program in making and design.Kaleohttp://www.kaleosworkshop.com
This question always reminds me of Sam Maloof’s comment on WW schools, “Forget them, use the money to buy tools, machinery and wood and build a portfolio and go out and get noticed”
That is from a guy who is, to say the least, one of THE most successful furniture makers ever, like $50,000.00 plus for a rocking chair sucessful. Just a thought.
I offer another suggestion, versus a Furniure/woodworking school. Go to http://www.furnituresociety.org and look under opportunities for those looking for Apprentices. Some are paid and others are education only, but this would give you "Real" world experience working with a Furniture maker. Your education can be developed as you go.
Also, I recommend at least taking some college level Art classes. These will give you the basics of design, color, line weight, shapes etc. Better yet, if you're very serious about Furniture making as a career, go to College at night and get a Fine Arts degree. You would be surprised how many well known Furniture makers have MFA's. Also, comes in handy if you want to teach later in life.
Be forewarned Furniture making can be a difficult lifestyle, but like anything else has it's positives.
Earl
Dang, Earl!! You beat me to it. I hadn't read your response, or I wouldn't have typed mine!
Jeff
I'm 29 and have been a professional cabinetmaker/furnituremaker for 10 years. After graduating highschool, I, like yourself, wanted to be a woodworker. I looked at several schools across the country and ended up at the University of Rio Grande in the Fine Woodworking Program. I feel that the education I received there was excellent. At that time it was taught by Lonnie Bird. He had a tough teaching style and it was a sink or swim learning environment, but I think for the person that's serious about wanting to learn and achieve, it was a great experience. I know that Lonnie has his own school now and Rio Grande has continued there program. I would recommend both. I know of a shop that has hired both North Bennet, and Rio Grande graduates, and the shop owner prefers Rio Grande Grads. Its my understanding that North Bennet Grads are known as "Diamond Cutters", a.k.a. slow. Rio Grande empasisizes efficiency to make you a more productive woodworker.
You need to check http://www.furnituresociety.org
Schools like RISD, RIT have good support and former grads tend to help out newer grads.
Check out Palomar Community College, North of San Diego.
Pete
I live in Denver Colorado and have taken several classes at Red Rocks. I'd suggest contacting the school, specifically Rand Richards. He a professional high-end woodworker that moved to the Denver area 8 to 10 years ago. If I remember correctly, he had run several successful WW businesses in two other states and, when he moved here, decided to get in to teaching.
The school's web site is http://www.rrcc.edu/finewood/index.html
From there, Rand's phone number and email address are listed. Rand is a great guy and he has done an incredible job with the program.
My only complaint is that he works during the day (M-->F) so it is hard, if even possible, for me to take one of his classes.
Hello!I read you post and wonder why you are thinking of being a Pro! Taking a couple of classes and having an interest is a good thing, but it is not enough to be a Pro. Pro means you have to deal with all the woodworking situations you can and wil get into and being able to successfully accomplish what needs to be done. It also means that you are going to have to produce, sell, design, keep the IRS happy, make enough to provide for your bills and more and like it enough to like the 14 -16 hour days 6-7 days a week.If you really like woodworking find a Pro who does what you would like to be doing and contact them. Watch them, help them, learn from them. If you have not worked in the trade for a while you have no idea what trouble you can get into quickly and lawyers are expensive.I have owned several businesses. It is not for everyone. Woodworking is an easy profession to get into, basically all you need is a Sears charge card and a business card. Unfortunately there are to many people who believe this to be true and they do not help the Profession. To be a Pro you have to know what you are doing. This means you have to have the woodworking skills, the marketing, legal, accounting, and people skills to be successful. Don't get me wrong. There is nothing like having a business that is working really well which allows for you to do the things you want to do. There is also nothing like not having one, but having all the problems that go with it.I mean to help, but I have found that many times woodworking is the Profession at the bottom of the food chain. For the reason mentioned above there can be a plethora of competition that really has no idea what it is doing, yet you have to compete with them. Learn all you can before you take this step. Start small. Take on only what you can readily accomplish. Be careful not to get in over your head. Be sure you can pay for medical insurance. This is probably one of the most expensive costs, but not having it is not really an option if your living depends on your ability to perform. A minor accident can cost upwards of 10 grand, and that is another expense and time that will make things harder than can be imagined.If you would like any help please feel free to contact me. I also have a web site that I am slowly working on. http://www.dalefvictor.com/ . it is not very well organized but there are pictures.Dale
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