I’m amazed at the number of folks that equip their shops with significant tools, then visit this website for the most elementary of information. In the past, I’ve had visitors to my shop ask why my old Walker Turner table saw cuts so effortlessly, and their Powermatic has trouble with 1″ lumber! Following up with: “Does it really matter which way the teeth point on their carbide saw blade?” Later, they are amazed at how efficiently a bench chisel pares a joint to fit …. lamenting that “… guess I’ll have to get me some chisels…” Then there’s the guy across town with six or seven L-N planes asking what I do for sharpening, “…cause he’s going to have to get something soon…..”
As a fifth generation furnituremaker, I was crawling around in the sawdust on the shop floor before I could walk and was taught the proper basics from the first. As a youngster, a week-long summer visit to Granddads found me in his shop, usually on a stack on crates in front of the lathe! The maddest I ever saw my mom was when she chastised Dad for spending money on a diminutive Atkins #65 Junior handsaw for me. I suppose everyone has to start somewhere, and with the demise of more & more school shops, it’s to be expected. I’m sure they find the advanced “how-to” books daunting, the basic instructional materials are seldom referenced here.
I’m sure there are others, but in sorting through a number of old “basics” the other evening … seeking an article on inlays, I ran across the Ten Speed Press reprint of “The Complete Woodworker”, (edited by) by Bernard Jones. I see used copies available for $15 & under postpaid on ABEbooks, and would recommend that volume to anyone seeking basic instruction. I’m sure there are many, many more, and the school instructional books must number in the hundreds, however locating them might be a challenge. Even volume I of Audels carpenters guide has some excellent information (skip vol 2,3,4).
John in Texas
Replies
I can give you an answer of sorts.
I don't know much about woodworking so I buy top quality tools knowing that I won't have to deal with with tuning issues and tool inaccuracy (at least initially). It eliminates one source of error at a time when you don't have the skills to avoid a lot of user induced error. That in turn keeps the frustration enough in check to keep going with the whole project.
Unfortunately, many of us weren't graced with early exposure and lessons at the hands of a master. Being largely self taught, I know what it takes to learn on my own. Good tools are key for me.
Though my current use doesn't justify say, an upgrade to my portable table saw, I know that I'll grow into it down the line and I also know that it's very, very rare for me to regret going up in quality and quite often I have regretted getting cheaper tools. I'm not running out to buy L-N planes (a Stanley is probably sufficient for me) and I don't doubt that there are many excessive purchases, but do know that there's sometimes method to the madness. You aren't always buying just a tool, sometimes it's what gives you the confidence to keep pushing forward when you don't know what you are doing.
cheers,
-s
I think alot of woodworkers started as tool collectors. Eventually they get the bug to use their tools.
You just described me!!TFToolfanatic (a.k.a. The man formerly known as "Toolfreak")
Old ancient Chinese proverb: I hear I forget, I see I remember. I do, I understand.
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
Kidderville, NH
Use whatever tool needed to Git 'r Done!
It's not surprising that a fifth-generation furniture maker would have familiarity and knowledge that comes harder to the rest of us newbies, who have to learn on their own, by doing.
Take a guy like me, who had shop classes about a million years ago, and now wants to make furniture for himself and his family. There are hundreds of articles and other bits of advice on what tool to buy, and how to do many of the individual processes. But there's no equivalent to the old apprenticeship system. I won't be sat in a corner and told to sharpen planes for a week, though the experience would do me good (especially because, when I did one wrong, a more experienced person would come over, cuff my ear, then show me how to do it right). I have to figure out if I've sharpened it right, by using it and matching my impression of what I've done with the descriptions others give of their own work.
Another interesting difference comes from the fact that different people who give you advice have different opinions and agendas. If I were someone's apprentice, I'd do it his way (or hit the road). When I'd mastered all he was willing to teach me, presumably I'd either apprentice with someone else, or start learning on my own. But as a beginner here, there are literally dozens of people who will weigh in on any given topic, and much of the advice will be contradictory. It's hard to chart a consistent course with no missteps.
It's a slow road, and not having the gear wouldn't make it easier. The gear doesn't make you a woodworker, either... but we all have to start somewhere.
Please don't take my observation wrong. I was not trying to belittle anyone. I am thankful I was "home-schooled" in furniture making, and when I retire from my real job, I will try to help more folks enjoy woodworking, without opening a school for pay!
I was simply hoping others would share titles/authors of the basic instructions with all. I am worried about the violations of safety practices these uninformed may otherwise commit. It's ever so important to think each process through, imagining at each step, what could go wrong & the outcome, and consider a possible alternate method that will not put them in harms way. The helpful texts are out there.
You'd be surprised how many of the helpful hints and methods of work that FWW awards each issue, are published in handbooks and instruction manuals .... many 60 years or more ago. It tickles me to see someone offer up a "new" idea (he read in a 1950's Mechanics Illustrated or the old Jorgensen clamp catalog from 1956), and take home the set of chisels or twin saws, et al. It simply proves many of the editors are enjoying learning as well!
I am reminded of a list of woodworking texts being assembled in these pages some time ago, and I was amazed then at how few introductory/basic ones made the list. Seek them out, for most of the answers you seek were published long ago.
I didn't mean to step on anyones toes, perhaps another will offer up a title and an author that might keep some of the new folks aligned and on track. Everyone seems to be on such a fast track in this digital age .... we need to take time to "enjoy the little things" as Krenov wrote in my copy of The Fine Art of Cabinetmaking ..... an excellent elementary text itself.
John in Texas
Edited 3/9/2006 9:30 pm by tailsorpins
I'm actually very surprised there hasn't been a show or episode devoted to real safety practices and concerns presented to beginners who want to buy power tools. I would also like to see a video of any format given to, or included with power tool purchases. It could be that some of the people who have these tools can't or won't admit that they don't know these things, but will ask a question in a way that really shows that they don't. It would probably be very easy for Taunton and the other publishers to start a fundamentals and safety column in their magazines. If it was advertised and marketed properly, it could keep the borderline frustrated woodworkers from reaching the point where they sell off all of their tools and just watch TV.
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
While I am a novice who's skill is improving by the day, I have a regular job, a wife and two kids. When I buy something, I want it to be the last time, and I don't want my purchase to allow any excuses. Someone earlier said that many tool collectors become woodworkers, or something to that effect. I guess that is half true in that, many novices who have this great endeavor as a hobby, do not have to be concerned with each purchase and its profitablility. Granted, it's almost a cliche that some people own more tool, car, house whatever, than they need. How many places in this country exist where you can really put a Lambourghini through its paces? Yet some peoople own them...obviously for the status, or more likely, their lack of "stature" somewhere else. That said, I think people come to this hobby as adults, with discretionary income, and want to get serious. Obviously, you have to pay your dues, and practice/learn. I have enormous respect for those who make a living at this craft, but I will stop short of saying that I envy them. Think about it, the pro gets to do what he/she loves as a living every day, great. But with that come deadlines, having to make stuff for other people and their tastes, and not being able to make much for yourself. The hobbyist, on the other hand, never has to worry about deadlines (other than those self imposed), can make whatever he/she wants, can keep it if desired, and never has to worry about profitablility. So who has it better. Both do I guess, since job or hobby, you're still making sawdust. I guess the grass is always greener. I don't think you can replace the upbringing you had with anything but ,if you didn't have it, you didn't have it. I read everything I can get my hands on with regards to WWing, and use everything I do as a learning experience, but it will never make up for the way you were raised. I'ts like a skier. If you were on skiis when you were two years old, and I just started now...I will probably never catch you in terms of development, but if I love the sport, I'm going into it with gusto.All that said, I agree with you that people need direction, but more importantly, inspiration. I turned a corner when I read George Nakashima's "The Soul of a Tree." Not much in the way of instruction, but that book made me want to get back to basics, and really think about what I am doing, and why I am doing it. I highly recommend this book. You learn how to cut a straight line, or chop out a set of dovetails by trial and error, and no other way...but like the commercial says, Inspiration..."priceless."
" I am worried about the violations of safety practices these uninformed may otherwise commit." This is absolutely my biggest concern when the "basic question" gets posted. Scares me to death to think that someone has a jointer plugged into an outlet, has run a piece of stock over it at least enough to know it's not cutting properly, but hasn't read Word One (other than the owner's manual) on how to use it safely. We all know how much credibility owners' manuals carry, ROFL.
I had zero instruction or exposure to power tools growing up. Every thing I've learned has been via books (mostly) or "talking" to people here and on other forums -- and all that followed by making mistakes of course. As much information as is availble on the internet, IMHO there is no substitute for a good book on a given tool (assuming you didn't grow up in a wood shop).
So, that being said, what to recommend? Well, for safety and success in tool use, Mehler on tablesaws; Rick Peters for planers and jointers; Duginske or Bird on bandsaws; Speilman or Warner on routers. For care and maintenance, John White for sure! forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Tailsorpins,
I hope you do retire soon and choose to help us, we need it! I poured over several books, they've helped, but there are so many instances where working in the shop alone is a real challange especially when it comes to safety.
This past week I wanted to round over some hand-holds on a mahogany tray I made. Yes, I could do it by hand, but doing it on the router table with a round over bit would give a nice uniform pattern. I've never done this before but know proper direction is paramount and if the spinning blade touches the wrong side the piece could go flying.
Everythig came out fine and it turned out to be a piece of cake. Without any guidance available beforehand, however, I sweated the details...and put a clamp on the workpiece to keep my hands away from the blade just in case. My point is books can provide direction but an experienced woodworker to advise me would have been much better.
tailsorpins,
That is one of the problems with this electronic media. We can't see your face or hear your voice inflections when you "speak."
Your post came across as something like, Amateurs, don't bother us professionals with stupid questions. Particuarly when you started outlining your pedigree / lineage of family woodworkers.
I believe it was Mark Twain who said we are all genius (or mentally retarded) just in different areas.
Might be good to leave out the complaints and approach things from a more positive note and teach or help the amateur, if that is what you are trying to do.
Glad to see your clarification.
Alan - planesaw
I'm glad this thread took the turn back into the direction I intended. I find it as hard as the next person, to read all the safety warnings (without glossing over them), as they've increased in quantity to the point of almost a joke. The mechanical equipment I've designed for 40 years in my real job, is so covered over with warning labels and stickers, in multiple languages, that it's all become quite ugly!
That said, I understand why! We need some instruction, but it needs to be brief & to the point. I am fortunate to have visited other tool collectors / woodworkers, in their shops, perhaps as many as 20, with experience varying from 3 to 50 years. Reinacting what an early employer did to me the first day on the job in his furniture & store fixture shop, I started asking them to describe or go through the steps in changing out the saw blade on their table saw. Only the 65 year old man unplugged the saw before beginning .... and some of the others took on a look of such shock at the mention of it that I'm certain they unplug EVERY TIME since. Several of the others wanted to argue with me over the necessity. Now, I don't unplug my drill press, and sometimes not even my bandsaw ..... (shame on me) .... but these basics must be gotten across to those new to this hobby. Compiling these and communicating them in a brief, focused format is absolutely necessary. We don't need idiot-proof equipment nor horribly expensive table saws to allow us go through the motions thoughtlessly!
Thanks for the thoughts. Oh yes, When old Jack ask me to change the blade on his 12" table saw (in front of eight or ten lurking old-timers), I went over and threw the disconnect, and asked him if there was a padlock handy and where the wrench & block of wood were kept ..... That was in 1965 .... long before lock-out tag-out became the norm .... but that's what I'd been taught. When life & limb are in jeopardy, you take no unnecessary chances.
Lets keep it going.
John in Texas
Hello,
I live in LA. I would like to apprentice with someone to begin to learn master carpentry. Although it wouldn't hurt to know builders carpentry, I am really interested in furniture making...but really intricate and art type furniture. I know enough to know this sort of thing probably cannot be learned in a lifetime on your own so I am looking for someone in the area who would take on a apprentice.
Thanks
John,
Interesting thread idea with some good comments.
Here are some useful books for beginners:
-----
Best of FWW/New Best of FWW:
Bench Tools
Selecting and Using Hand Tools
Working With Hand Planes
Jim Tolpin: Measure Twice, Cut Once
Thomas Lie-Nielsen: Sharpening
Garrett Hack: The Handplane Book
Graham Blackburn: Traditional Woodworking Handtools
Dick Onians: Essential Woodcarving Techniques
Alex W. Bealer: Old Ways of Working Wood
Aldren A. Watson: Hand Tools Their Ways and Workings
Peter Korn: The Woodworker's Guide to Hand Tools
Andy Rae: Choosing and Using Hand Tools
Michael Dunbar: Restoring, Tuning, and Using Classic Woodworking Tools
Bob Flexner: Understanding Wood Finishing
-----
This list is obviously heavily oriented toward hand-tool woodworking, since that's what I do. Even so, there is much useful information, even for those that are strictly or mainly power tool users.
I'll leave the selection of recommended titles for the various machines, etc., to someone who is better versed in that area than I am.
Like many of the other posters in this thread, I'm mostly self-taught, with a lot of frustration at the front end of my woodworking education. Despite that, one thing that I can say is that those early hard-learned lessons are lessons that have stuck with me. The good part of that is, now, I have a much better idea of what I don't know. And the books have greatly expanded my knowledge.
James
Tauntons Complete Illustrated Guides are decent. At least the ones I have read. They demonstrate things well enough to give you an idea of how to do things. What I really like about them is that they often show how to do things with hand tools as well as power tools... Which is pretty cool.
By definition, all we FWW-readers and Knots-discussers are literate types who can process information from print, talk, photos and video. There are many folk in the world who, for one reason or another, cannot easily do that kind of information processing. Give them FWW or a tome on woodworking techniques and they will glaze over or get all despondent.
Personally I don't think that this means such people should be excluded from woodworking. Where it's practical, I will try to show such a person WW via demonstration and "guidance at the bench". I have done this will 3 people, from a teenage girl of no real education to a couple of older blokes whose working lives have involved little reading or other such information processing.
Such folk seem to learn via demonstration very succesfully - typically faster than I did via my self-taught/read FWW route. I suspect that they learn better partly because there is less mental noise between them and the WW actions.
In this day and age, it costs a lot of money to go on a formal class with a tutor. As has been discussed many times in FWW (and, I imagine, in Knots), there is a lot less endemic WW taught in schools, colleges and at home these days. This seems a pity when there may be lots of people out there who are stymied right at the start of a potential life in WW because they cannot do the reading thing; but find there is little practical alternative.
Short of adopting such a person if you come across one, what could we do about this?
Lataxe
I think the super-tool craze is something that's inherent, in one way or another, in all of us. I know I always have a little voice inside telling me that, if only I had a better tool, I could do it "just like the masters". It's a tendency towards self-denial, looking for a way around the long, hard road of practice and experience. Newbies (and even not-so-newbies like me) simply want to be able to accomplish everything they see the master do, and they want it right now. I've recently started playing guitar and I get the same feeling about that -- if only I had that $20,000 pre-war Martin, I'd be able to play just like the masters who've been playing their whole lives! Of course, this is ridiculous, and on a higher level I know this. But our instinct is to look for the easy path -- although it often does not exist -- and that little voice is just so darn convincing sometimes! <G> And although it may not make the final product any better than a lesser tool, I do enjoy using a really fine tool. It's just more fun, and that's what it's all about, for me anyway.
As for particular good books, I'm not sure that matters much either. No one book (or armload of books) can substitute for years in the shop. I have read endless books and mags (and still do) since FWW first came out. I've found that I only absorb a limited amount from any written piece, no matter the source, depending on where my head/skill level is at the time I'm reading. If I go back and re-read the same piece years later, with more experience under my belt, or from a different perspective, I often see it in a whole new light -- sort of an "Aha!" moment. So, my advice would be to read whatever catches your interest at the time, spend as much time making sawdust as you can, and use hand tools when it's practical and power tools only when it's not.
Mike Hennessy
Pittsburgh, PA
Not to put words in your mouth, but what I think you are describing is consumerism run amuck. WW magazines and TV shows are in business to sell tools and they are good at it. The ads/infomerical PBS shows clearly state the solution to your problem is a tool or a better tool. This is witnessed in this thread and others by the people who say they don't have time to learn, so they need tools that "work out of the box". But tools don't actually work that way. Just because the ad said so, doesn't make it true.
If you want to build stuff, you need skills, not tools. Outfitting the "ultimate" shop is indefensible and inevitably unsatisifying, particularly for the hobbyist. Unfortunately, this is what people think they need and the industry responds to their dollars with more of the same.
There's no institutional solution to this problem. Businesses will continue to do what must be done to make money. My advice to woodworkers is to raise their BS antenna to anyone selling them something (like the dished honing plate, $400 scrub plane, etc).
BTW, I have some fancy tools that are unneccessarily fancy. I can cut DT's with a hacksaw. I really don't need fancy saws, but I just like having them. If you like having fancy power tools, that's fine. The problem comes in where you convince yourself (or allow yourself to be convinced) that these tools are required for good work.
Adam
To add, etc, what happens if the machine breaks down? Having the skills to do it by hand would be a great solution to that.
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
Edited 3/10/2006 10:35 pm by highfigh
John,
Some what like you I also have been blessed with being born into a woodworking family. I remember my grandad building whatever it was that was needed at the time and doing a precision job of it because even though he's no longer with us most all of everything he's ever created is. I now have quite a few more tools than he ever did but the tools that he did have created what most of us build today and did just as good of job if not better. He used to tell me that fancy tools and a fat checkbook or lots of money in a credit card does not a craftsman make. There's been people that's had fancy shops with about every most expensive tool in it that would make skilled craftsmen tasks sooooooo much easier but because the craftsmen chooses to use his money for other things besides fancy tools he tends to always just get by with what he has. Also personally I'm yet to see a tablesaw turn its self on or even a hand plane pick its self up and start planing wood it always takes a person with some anishative and ability to do the creating no matter how expensive and good the tools are. Good luck to everyone and I hope the newbies don't get frustrated and decide to give up because it took someone many,many years ago to start woodworking so that we could be multiple generation woodworkers.
Sincerely Jim C
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled