I’ve got a project where I have butternut panels glued up. They need to be sanded down for flatness. Don’t currently have a belt sander – the friend who was going to lend one is going through a tough time and I don’t want to ask. Do have a pretty good Makita orbital sander. Can i get the job done with the orbital sander?
Should I equip my shop with a belt sander? Probably yes. I’ve been reading reveiws etc.. Generally I’m a believer in spending the extra cash to buy the better equpment – it’s better for a reason. Don’t know how much difference it might make here. I won’t use it that often but of course, once bought I can have it for years. Thoughts about this?
Also I see all the different sizes. Having once bought an orbital sander with a weird paper size, don’t want to make the mistake again. What are the standard sizes found in local hardware stores?
Thanks everyone.
Replies
I think you'll find that opinions vary widely on belt sanders. That's particularly true for flattening operations, since belt sanders aren't easy to control sufficiently to avoid edge divits. Unless you've already developed those skills, you might be better off using hand planes.
Butternut is nice to work with
It's so easy to work with, I'd just use a hand plane. You could finish up with the random orbit.
I agree with Ralph. Although seemingly benign, the belt sander can ruin quickly in an inexperienced hand. I have belt sanders but try to use them only when nothing else will work and don't let an apprentice near one without careful supervision.
I once sucked my sweater up into my belt sander and thought I might have it permanently attached to my belly. It was seriously stuck. Had to have a helper relief cut the housing of the sander with a hacksaw to get it off. So be wary of loose clothing.
Choose a sander that is easy to balance. I'm partial to the Makita.
Bret
I wouldn't rely on a belt sander to flatten your work.
Early on I tried that approach; results not so good. Then I bought one of those attachments that surround the sander with 'stiff bristles in a housing'. It's supposed to provide a larger base to stabilize the crazy horse in side. Results can be summarized by "Do you want to buy one slightly use accessory?"
A plane, or planes, is the best way to go. Read up on the proper procedures.
Frosty
Frosty,
Belt sanders in frames are like any other tool - one needs to obtain a well-engineered one then larn to use it right.
For years, before becoming enamoured of proper handtools, I flattened with a belt sander in a frame followed by an RO sander. Like many newbies, I bought cheaper items to begin (Black & Decker, no frame, feeble motors) which were poor in many respects. So, in short order, a fine upmarket Bosch belt sander (with sanding frame, right angle fence and other gubbins) was obtained for two hundred quid; and a Festool RO with a sucker for another Great Wodge of Cash.
But they work. And they work extremely well. It is possible to flatten (and I do mean flat, a-la straight-edge check) a large and ledge-ridden planky tabletop of 6ft X 3ft with these tools. I have done it quite a few times (as well as the numerous smaller surfaces).
Nowadays I like to use planes to flattern, although I draw the line at four-squaring rough planks, as a planer/thicknesser with 3 horses makes lurverly planks of squareness and eventude. Hand planes are faster than a belt sander and RO sander at flattening as they can remove a lot of wood quickly. And they are pleasant to use. Like the sanders, they took a bit of larnin'; and a heavy, well-engineered plane is a very sooperior experience to a $50 ticky-tacky one.
So if a fellah prefers power tools, a belt sander + frame followed by an RO sander (best with a hard pad, by the way) is a perfectly viable option to flatten surfaces. Like with a plane, the korrect procedures must be learnt.
I confess to also uing a hand power planer at times, especially on rough and dirty planks (one doesn't want to risk big nicks in the planer/thicknesser knives). Ah ha! One of these beasts can four square a plank (roughly) in no time at all - at least compared to a scrub plane.
******
Options; they are nice to have. In all cases it requires a good tool and a skilled user.
Lataxe
How I spent today
Okay, so thanks to comment here, I thought "hand planer! time to learn to use that tool." (I consider myself an advanced beginner or maybe low intermediate.. those who know nothing about woodworking think I'm accomplished. HA!) So I spent the morning browsing this site, reading up and watching videos on sharpening and adjusting and "what planer to use". Went out and bought a Stanley Contractor Bench Plane. There were two much nicer planes at my local store, but one was shorter and the other "low angle" and actually I have no business spending money on any tools, right now. So the Stanley was the choice for today. I also think that IF I master planes I can find many nice planes at yard sales where I live.
So, carefully sharpened the iron using glass and sandpaper method. Worked pretty well, I think. THEN ARGH how it in the blazes does this thing get adjusted? I read, I adjusted, I tried, I read some more, I adjusted... that's the way the afternoon went. At one point, so frustrated, took the dog for a walk. Seems that what I finally "got" is that to adjust the depth of the iron I have to release the frog, but then tighten frog AND tighten depth adjustment to make it snug. Maybe I got it adjusted right.. seems that one of the things is realizing how miniscule is extenstion of the iron below the plate.
I worked on a panel that won't be seen, I fear it had some too large chunks torn out, while I was trying to figure out how the tool works. And I realize this discussion should now get cross posted on Hand Tools, but I don't know how to do that.
In any case having taken up the time to write this - my partner certainly won't sympathize.. I'm wondering if there are other words to the wise about using hand planes. I realize that they are a BIG part of working with wood and do want to master them.
Thanks
!
Cross-posting is generally not a good idea, as it creates two separate conversations. Posting questions about planing technique in Hand Tools would be appropriate, however. (Like how to get a gnat to hold still while you pluck one of its eyelashes to test sharpness of the iron. ;-) )
Lataxe,
I guess I went on to better things. Or, perhaps I learned to glue-up panels with only minor ridges. A card scraper did the trick for me.
I always hated the chore of pulling out the belt sander, mounting the frame, hooking up the dust collector and changing belts as I moved through the grits. Prevention is better than cure.
Frosty
Even though I do have a belt sander, I rarily use it. I'll go to my bench planes, 5" or 6" random orbit sanders and get a much better job.
Avoiding the Problem
In the "Wood and Materials" section there is another discussion already taking place on the same subject. The original question was about how to finish off a table top glued up from ash planks. Here is what I wrote there:
"I take an entirely different approach to making table tops, planing a top after it is glued up from several boards is way too difficult, near impossible in woods with irregular grain.
Start out by getting each board flat, squared up, and smoothly planed with the top surface planed to as perfect a surface as you want the finished table to be.
Now when you do the glue up, glue the boards together just a pair at a time and take the time as you clamp to bring the top surfaces of each pair to as close to flush as possible. By only having to worry about one seam this really isn't hard to do. A can easily edge glue two 6 foot long boards together with only a barely perceptible step anywhere along the length of the joint.
Once you have the paired boards glued up, glue the pairs together, again only one new joint at a time. In this case, with an odd number of boards, I would make three pairs to start and then join the odd board to one pair to make a three board wide panel which I would then join to a pair to make a five board wide panel. The last step would be to join the last glued up pair to the five board panel to make up the full seven board wide top. Using yellow glue and leaving each glue up in the clamps for half an hour to 45 minutes you would be able to glue up the full top in less than four hours working at a leisurely pace.
If you prepped the boards properly, and got each joint flush as you went along, you will now have a top that has only very slight height differences at each of the seams. At this point, fifteen minutes with a sharp cabinet scraper will clean up the top to perfectly flat with no chance of tearing out anywhere."
Nice approach, John. I'll try it next time.
Frosty
Unlike some of the other responders, I love my beltsanders and use them all the time. I love my hand planes, too but I only take them out when I have time to play. I have to get the jobs out and the checks in. I can't expect customers to pay me to play nor can I afford to deal with tear out and the many issues that can arise from using a plane. There is a learning curve with a beltsander but I think they are easier to learn than hand planes and don't require sharpening, tuning, special angles and all the phyical effort.
There are two common sizes, 4" x 24" and 3" x 21". Belts for these sizes are readily available most anywhere.
Not a big fan of Belt Sander. I rarely use it. But as you have mentioned, you also won't use it quite often, you can go for it.
What size your current orbital sander has? I am comfortable with my 5" orbital sander. Don't know about the standard size.
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