Hi,
This is my first post to knots, but I visit regularly and soak up as much knowledge as possible. I am looking for a better way to cut the top off of some boxes that I build, mainly jewelry boxes and humidors. I have been trying to saw them with the table saw, but that technique requires tons of sanding and when you place the top back on the box, there are always unsightly gaps. I recently purchased a riser block for my 14″ Delta bandsaw and the wood slicer blade from Highland Hardware, as I have read about some woodworkers who slice the tops off with their bandsaws. Has anyone out there tried this method, and if so, do you have any pointers? Or does someone have a better idea/method? I have about 10 boxes completed and after sawing the first one on the table saw have stopped in search of a better way.
Thanks,
Birdseyeman
Replies
I've done a couple of boxes and sawn the lids off on my table saw. I haven't had the experience you've had with roughness. I've only done this on my new saw with a new blade. Is your blade old or dull? Maybe that's the problem. My blade is also a "thin kerf" model so that might make a difference.
Brand new Forrest woodworker II blade. I am getting a ridge where the horizontal cuts meet the vertical cuts, if that makes any sense. The cut itself is very smooth, though.
Birdseyeman
Is your rip fence square to your blade? That may be part of the problem. I've done a few on the table saw, the only other advice I can give is to make sure you insert a spacer, the same width as the saw kerf, between the box and lid as you flip the box over to cut the other sides.
Definitely sounds like the saw isn't tuned perfectly. A contributing factor could be the box not being totally stable during the cuts, but the results would be inconsistent in that case.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Definitely your saw setup or your technique. Check your blade for square to the table, as well the other suggestions above, and keep th blade just high enough to cut all the way through the sides of the box. Setting the blade high will just magnify any wobble that occurs while the box is being cut.
If your boxes are square and clean, and your fence square and parallel to the blade, and the blade is square to the table, you should get near-perfect cuts.
If eveything checks out and you're still getting misalignment, check your spijdle for side to side movement. That's pretty rare, but possible with loose or badly worn bearings.
Michael r=r
Tighten the Woodslicer as tight as it will get on the Band Saw and go to it.
_________________________________
Michael in San Jose
"In all affairs it's a healthy thing now and then to hang a question mark on the things you have long taken for granted." Bertrand Russell
The bandsaw will work well and obviously give you a thinner kerf over a TS. But I'm not sure I'd use the Woodslicer. I use them and swear by them for resawing, but IMHO you might want something with a few more TPI and finer cut for box work. You normally want a blade that will keep a few teeth in the thickness of the stock. Once you've sawed through the walls, you're only ever cutting at two points on the box, both of which are the thickness of your walls. Pick a TPI that works for the thickness of your box sides.
If you build it - he will come.
Doug,
Thanks for the tip. I didn't even think about the # of teeth. I just installed the 6" riser block today, and the only 105" blade I have is the woodslicer, I will have to pick up a new blade. Any suggestions? The boxes are hard maple, soft maple, and mahogany.
In the meantime, I'm going to try some of the tablesaw suggestions on the post. Thanks to everyone, your ideas are greatly appreciated.
Birdseyeman
My Jet riser block kit came with a 105" blade - I think maybe a 6 TPI? I take it your kit didn't come with a blade. I think you're normally supposed to want 2 or 3 teeth in your stock, so if your box sides are 1/4 to 3/8 you probably want 8-12 TPI. 1/2 to 5/8 puts you about 4-6 TPI. 3/4 stock starts putting you into the range where the WoodSlicer might be OK. Any of the good name brand blades should work well - Timberwolf, Olsen, Starrett, Lennox. I'm sure I've forgotten someone's personal favorite and they'll chime in.
If you build it - he will come.
> Cleanup that remains is best done with a plane - block or bench depending on how thick the sides are and personal preference. The plane will quickly and accurately remove the desired amount of wood and keep everything flat/non-rounded/parallel to boot <
Yeah, but this requies a skilled hand and a bit of nerve - it's easy to chip out at the corners, and easy to get the match between lid and bottom a bit gappy. I still reckon a sheet of sandaper fixed to a flat surface with the box rubbed against it is the failest-safe approach!
M
New Zealand | New Thinking
Edited 2/21/2005 5:12 am ET by kiwimac
Friend,
In case you are doing it different:
Using the T. S., do not cut totally throug separation, or leave just a hair so that the lid does not separate from the box.
That insures that the fence, blade, and box are always at a consistent distance.
When all sides are cut, cut through the 'hair' with a knive, and sand or scrape minor excess, which will be in the inside edge of the box, anyway.
Good luck.
-mbl-
I've been doing this since the 70s, both with band saw and table saw. Both work OK, but depend on a bang-on square setup, as outlined in previous posts. It helps to have a high fence so the box doesn't wobble, and either cut just right thru, or cut to leave a mm or so to be released with a knife or fine handsaw. The secret to sucess is about 95% technique. Practice the passes a few times with the blade withdrawn to be sure your motion is smooth and wobble-free.
When to lid is off, use a whole sheet of sandpaper fixed to a flat base (your TS) and sand off any saw marks by passing the sawn edges over the sandpaper. That way you'll end up with a lid to base alignment that is as fine and gap-free as a glue joint.
MalcolmNew Zealand | New Thinking
Ditto previous comments about table saw tuning and not quite cutting all the way through the box sides.
Cleanup that remains is best done with a plane - block or bench depending on how thick the sides are and personal preference. The plane will quickly and accurately remove the desired amount of wood and keep everything flat/non-rounded/parallel to boot.
Birds, if your saw blade cuts a 1/8" 'kerf',
slice up a few pieces of wood the same thickness as the kerf.
When approaching the end of each cut, insert a small piece of the 'Spline'in the cut line and add masking tape to keep the gap from opening or closing.
Also, by first adding some masking tape
to the inside( prior to cutting,) you'll reduce tear out.
If at all posible, run the box bottom along the ripfence ,so that the "Cutoff" (Lid) will exit without binding.
Steinmetz
Here's a trick for the TS when cutting boxes I saw in another forum. Before you glue the final piece on th box, attach small blocks with hot glue or a touch of glue to the inside where you will make the saw cut. This keeps the box together and avoids gaps when you cut. Then use a putty knife inserted in the slot to knock the blocks loose
Don`t bother with a band saw,unless it`s set up just right your asking for trouble. I usually make the cut all around the box leaving about a 1/16 left.Then I cur through the rest with an olfa knife. Clean up only requires a few paces with a sharp plane ..
Good luck..
I think the bandsaw is the best way to do this IF you have aligned your fence to the blade to account for drift.
You may know how to do this.. but my method is to snap or scribe a line parallel to a straight edge on a board. Begin to cut freehand along the line until you are about halfway down the board. Stop and carefully clamp the board to the table. Make very sure it doesn't move. Then move your fence up to the board and, using the alignment screws, align the fence to the board. Now draw another line and, using the fence, certify that the blade is cutting square to the fence.
When you saw the top off your box.. use a 3 tpi, 1/2" blade of good quality, like a Timberwolf. Go slowly and carefully and you'll be happy with the result.
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