Replies

1. 
   yellowtail | Feb 16, 2007 07:06pm | #1

   I, too, have the pm2000. I bought the optional low profile riving knife to prevent kickback. I like the saw as set up and have not had any problems. I've worked with TS's for more than 30 years, both as an amatuer and pro. The only problems I've ever had involved kickback. Not serious, but enough to get my serious attention. I also purchased the optional zero clearance table insert (can't remember what it's called, exactly). Hope this helps.

1. 
   t_mauery | Feb 16, 2007 10:55pm | #2

   Yellowtail,

   Where did you get the low profile riving knife (part number?) ?  I was almost ready to grind/hack the standard knife to a low profile design.

1. 
   yellowtail | Feb 17, 2007 12:56am | #3

   If you look in the back of the manual you should find a list of accessories or options available from Powermatic, along with a 1-800 number. I can't recall the prices right off hand, but I do remember them being a little pricey, but they were worth it IMO.

2. 
   Elcoholic | Feb 17, 2007 03:09am | #4

   Naw I won't jump you.  I half-way think the disclaimers in the magazines about guards removed for safety are PC BS.  I have a Jet cabinet saw with a Beis splitter and an Excaliber overarm blade guard.  I'd say I can and do use both 60 -70% of the time.  The guard gets in the way when ripping anything much under 6" wide though.

   John O'Connell - JKO Handcrafted Woodworking

   The more things change ...

   We trained hard, but it seemed that every time we were beginning to form up into teams, we would be reorganized.  I was to learn later in life that we tend to meet any new situation by reorganizing; and a wonderful method it can be for creating the illusion of progress while producing confusion, inefficiency, and demoralization.

   Petronious Arbiter, 210 BC

3. 
   Lataxe | Feb 17, 2007 10:35pm | #5

   Mr Breeze,

   As has been oft discussed in Knots, many Unisaw-style TS do not have well-engineered safety features, such as riving knives and guards.  Those supplied seem to pay lip-service to safety but, as you note, are soon removed as they interfere with work.

   It may help with your new PM 2000 to see how European saws configure for safety; and how they can be easily enhanced to include more safety, without getting in the way of the work.  I think you could add some of the features shown in the photos but (significantly) probably not that usable riving knife and guard.

   Photo 1 shows the TS fence with a T-track mounted on top into which Veritas hold-downs are mounted (the ones they supply for their router table fence).  They are quickly moved and locked to suit each workpiece.

   Photo 2 shows a false fence face mounted to the fence via its T-track, the hold downs and the integral riving knife, which is below blade height but follows the blade curve at about 5mm away (and rises/falls/tilts with the blade).

   Photo 3 shows the riving knife profile and a false fence ending before the point at which the teeth come up out of the table, to obviate any pinching of the work between the fence and the area of the blade that causes kickback.

   Photo 4 shows a zero-clearance insert which is screwed to the TS top via 8 flat-top screws, preventing the blade from raising or throwing the insert should it catch.

   Photo 5 shows an alternative feather board, running in the TS tabletop T-slot.  The blade guard is shown mounted on the riving knife, from which it mounts & dismounts in 2 seconds, via a bristol lever. The guard does not get in the way of seeing the work and has an integral dust collection hose.

   Photo 6 shows the whole fence face moved back along the fence-proper - an arrangement that allows different fence faces (eg tall or short) to be rapidly (dis)mounted, into any position on the fence-proper.

   Other safety fetures:

   * A no-volt release on/off switch with a lockable cover.  You can't leave the saw switched on when the electricity supply is switched off.

   * A blade brake, which brings the blade to a stop in 2-3 seconds after switch-off.

   * a push-stick-holder and supplied push stick, on the fence.

   Generally I use my TS with all this stuff in place.  It is quickly configurable and doesn't interfere with either the opertion of the saw or the view of the work. 

   You could adapt a Unisaw-style machine to have some of these features; but perhaps the manufacturers should be lobbied to include them or even be forced by legislation to provide them.  Once these features are endemic, they do not add to the cost - it's just a matter of making something one way rather than another.

   Lataxe

   
1. 
   forestgirl | Feb 18, 2007 09:16am | #10

   Lataxe, great use for the Veritas hold-downs, thanks for posting the pics!  I wonder if, with the creative use of rare earth magnets, there might not be a way to mount them on the far side of the blade for wider stock?  Hmmmmmmmm,............forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-) 

2. 
   coolbreeze | Feb 18, 2007 07:07pm | #11

   Lataxe,

   Boy, you have given me enough to think about to tax my three brain cells. I printed your reply for slow consumption. I am particularly interested in the setup in photo #1.

   I am also considering a zero clearance insert, and yours is the second post I have seen refering to the blade catching and throwing the insert. That's scary. I would be pleased to have additional comment about that issue.

   Also, I noticed that your blade looks like a blade normally used on a mitre saw. I installed a WWII on mine. Is the blade I saw in the photo the blade that you use for general use or is it on there for a particular job?

   Thanks for your input.

1. 
   Lataxe | Feb 18, 2007 09:39pm | #12

   Cool,

   Aha, I have piqued your interest with the strange Ypean thang!  I know it might seem a bit over-the-top, safety-wise; but think of the fingers all still adjacent to one another in the two fully-loaded grasping appendages. (And also of the ding-free head from kickback).

   Those Veritas hold-downs are very handy items and can be configured to work on any machine that has a fence on which T-bar channels exist or can be mounted.  Using big knobs allows them to be reset or moved rapidly.  Their only drawback is that the feather-spring (to keep the work against the fence) is limited in capacity (ie in its reach from the mounting point) to around 3-4 inches depending on exactly how you mount it.  Hence the need for an "ordinary" feather board too.

   The fences on Ypean saws tend to come as 2-part items: the main member, which slides/locks to the front bar; and a demountable aluminium face that is quickly slid off/on, or moved along, the main member.

   The demountable face can be in many shapes and usually includes T-slots to mount things on.  I have three such faces and two main members (for the TS and the bandsaw) which are interchangeable. The demountable faces can also be reversed and put on to either side of the main member, allowing the fence to work on either side of the blade.

   In addition, a wooden false face can be mounted via the T-slots to the demountable face.  This allows even more versatility (eg a very low fence for cutting skinny wood or a very high fence for cutting tall bits on their edge, as in making a groove). You can make and mount a tenon cutter to the demountable face, allowing you to use the fence and its fine adjuster (0.1mm gradations) to tweak the tenon width.

   More photos can be took, if you are curious.....

   ***

   A zero-clearance insert is good for avoiding the disappearing thin bits, helps reduce breakout and is generally safer - as long as it's held in place.  As the blade is very close, it is possible for the edge of the insert to catch the back of the (rising) blade. If the insert is held down, it will merely get cut a smidgin wider. Otherwise it may get thrown at you.

   Three things might cause the blade to catch:

   * it distorts and wobbles slightly under the pressure/heat of a heavy cut;

   * the up/down mechanism moves the blade a tiny amount sideways (due to play or sawdust in threads or other parts);

   * tilting the sawblade alters the relative position of the slot to where the blade rises.

   Lastly - that blade in the saw is a temporarily-mounted flat top grind, used to cut a dado or two. We aren't allowed dado blades in Yup as they are deemed too dangerous.  :-)  We have to cut dados via multiple passes over the 3.2mm wide blade.  However, there is a nice sliding table and crosscut fence that allows this to be done very quickly and accurately. 

   Normally there is a 42 tooth combination blade in there, of the usual sort.  All the blades I have are made by Scheppach, the German manufacturer of the TS (and bandsaw).  I also have an 18 tooth rip; and an 80 tooth 45 degree ATB for veneered boards.

   Hope this helps you in making usable safety improvements to your own saw.

   Lataxe

1. 
   BigFrank | Feb 18, 2007 10:30pm | #13

   I don't understand how you use that veritas holddown on your table saw... I mean, with the cross bar in the way, how do you push the work piece all the way past the blade?I must be missing something...

2. 
   coolbreeze | Feb 18, 2007 11:26pm | #14

   Thanks for the reply.

   You know what kind of rip fence that comes with the PM2000. I'll have to digest the setup.

   Properly aligned with a good stiff blade such as the WWII, catching the backside of the Zero should be remote. Nontheless, I will take that into account.

   One thing about "Yup", its not hard to find 220V tools. Thays all the same thang. I'v been to the BI's on a number of occasions. British people were really friendly everywhere we have been. Guess that has been modereted somewhat because of Iraq.

   Here's hoping every bloody Brit is born naked:-) 

4. 
   wiskytango | Feb 17, 2007 11:08pm | #6

   i just set up my new Delta Hybrid and was about to post and ask what everyone feelings where about taking off the Blade Guard. It seems like more of ####hazard than a help.

5. 
   geilerzimmermann | Feb 17, 2007 11:29pm | #7

   I hate them, do not use them, they obscure my sight of the operation of the saw. So long as you are conciense of what you are doing with your fingers at any given time, has always been safe enough for me.

   mark

1. 
   Lataxe | Feb 18, 2007 01:29am | #8

   "So long as you are conciense of what you are doing with your fingers at any given time, has always been safe enough for me".

   .....until you lose the first one.  What: you think things can't be different tomorrow than they were yesterday?

   Lataxe the cautious.

6. 
   woodenhead | Feb 18, 2007 06:26am | #9

   I watched a friend of mine using his pm2000 with the guard and realized it was a safe way to operate a table saw. I was using my old saw without one for 10 years, not safe . I just finished assembling my PM 2000. I also like the dust collecting,riving knife,mobility and arbor lock.Its a great saw and they even give you the 27mm wrench and a push stick. When i must remove the guard i will .Five stars *****

   Semper Fi