Replies

1. 
   jc21 | Jul 14, 2004 06:59am | #1

   It's the new PC 890 series that has above the table adjustment. Call me crazy but I still prefer my old 690 and the Model 100 to the 690. The 890 and the Bosch have lots of nice features- more power, variable speed, etc but all these features come at a price; weight and balance. Having said that I don't believe you'd go wrong with either the 890 or the 1617- I'd check them out and see how they feel in your hands, look at some reviews and come to your own conclusion.

   
   

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   Edited 7/14/2004 8:22 am ET by jc

2. 
   BG | Jul 14, 2004 01:12pm | #2

   NCLAQUER,

   I would also consider the issue of changing bits while mounted in a router table...can it be done...is it easy to do.  For my Dewalt I bought an offset wrench from CMT which lists for about $16 bucks and with shipping, etc.  I waited till a WWorking show came around and got it for $10.  Anyhow, I'd hate to have to buy two wrenches....there is an adaptor on the market but I've only seen it once.
3. 
   DougF | Jul 14, 2004 11:57pm | #3

   I don't think either model is sufficiently powered if you are serious about using flat mounted raised panel cutters.  For raised panels I would recommend at least a 3hp VS model.  The machines you referenced would be sufficient for vertical panel cutters however.

   I have both a Bosch and 2 PC routers and I think you win with either brand.

   Doug

1. 
   NCLaquer | Jul 15, 2004 02:17am | #5

   Well, you raise a good point about the panels (pun intended). 

   The thing is, I am what you might call a "high end hobbyist".  I don't get near enough time to do the woodworking I'd like to, but I'm addicted to the tools (no explanation necessary for this group) and like to have the right tools when I do build something.  My current router is a small 1+ HP Black and Decker.  It has only a 1/4 collate and I am now motivated to upgrade for two reasons:

   1) I want more cool tools.

   2) I am going to build some kitchen cabinets and need to use 1/2' raised panel bits.  I suspect I will use the horizontal variety, based in the doors I'll be matching.

   With the Bosch or PC under consideration, I am hoping to accomplish several things:

   1) Plunge capability

   2) Ability to raise panels

   3) More power

   I would rather not need to buy a 3ph model due to the price and my limited need for THAT much power.  I doubt, however, I'll have the patience to take several passes with a panel bit.

   Will the 2 1/2 HP raise a few panels per year?  A dozen?  Two dozen?  Will I burn it out?

   Thanks for your help

1. 
   CharlieP | Jul 15, 2004 06:40am | #6

   Remember that you can make multiple passes to raise a panel, thus using a lower powered router.  In fact, with my 3hp I usually make at least two (or 3 or 4) passes - seems to give me better control and less sanding. 

   Do invest in a great panel raising bit - I got a cheap one, and it didn't take many doors until I could tell it wasn't as sharp as I would like (more sanding required). My smaller box-size raised panel bits are better quality, and it sure makes a difference. 

   Also I got the 5 bit set, and only use three of the bits (rail, stile and panel) - the edge and glue bits in my set are of limited value.  I probably could have gotten a good 3 bit set for the price of my cheap 5 bit set.

   Remember that you can do curved panels with the horizontal bits, which you cannot do with the vertical bits. 

   Hope this helps________________________Charlie Plesums  Austin, Texashttp://www.plesums.com/wood

1. 
   DougF | Jul 15, 2004 04:25pm | #7

   Charlie,

   I have several 1/2" curved vertical raised panel cutters.  Granted, there are a greater variety of horizontal panel cutter on the market but it is a viable option.

   You are correct that you can make many passes thus reducing the need for more horsepower but at a cost of more time and greatly shortening the cutter's usefulness before resharpening.  One technique I have used if I have many panels to do is to first vertically bevel cut the panels on the table saw and then finish dressing them on the router table.  I have found this to very effective, speeds up the process and greatly reduces the trips to the blade sharpening shop.  If I had a full kitchen to build, I would either stage my work assuming that the cutter will not make it through the entire project before sharpening or start with two freshly sharpened cutters on hand.

   One point that hasn't been mentioned is the stability of the router mounting.  A very solid and vibration dampened surface and router mounting is extremely important when cutting raised panels. 

   Doug

4. 
   Crunk | Jul 15, 2004 01:06am | #4

   Nothing ever beat the 690 series for low center of gravity and comfort.  Nothing.  Everything else is too 'tippy' in my opinion.  Too high a center of gravity IS a big deal. 

5. 
   cynwyd | Jul 15, 2004 05:23pm | #8

   In the end how the router fits you is most important since you're choosing between two top rank routers. If the handles aren't comfortable or the switches oddly placed for you what does it matter that someone else likes it. For raised panel work stay with vertical bits and you'll have enough power - less scary too!

6. 
   BArnold | Jul 15, 2004 05:39pm | #9

   I now have 3 Bosch 1617EVS routers.  Why three, you say?  Well, the first one was a decision based on research on a variety of routers, including PC.  My decision was based on price/value and the input from more experienced woodworkers that the Bosch was a great tool.  Since that purchase, I have had the opportunity to use several PC models (while working in cabinet shops) as well as my Bosch.  I'd still buy Bosch today.

   The first Bosch 1617EVS I bought was mounted in a table I built.  Among the first things I ran on it were the components for a raised panel door.  It operated must fine, especially making multiple passes as is the best procedure regardless of the HP of the router.

   Subsequent to purchasing the first Bosch, I got the two-base kit so I would have a router for hand-held operations.  Call me lazy, I got tired of taking the unit out of my table.

   The third Bosch 1617EVS came as part of the tablesaw package from Jet that I purchased earlier this year.  Let's see now -- how many more routers do I need to catch up to Norm???

   I'm very satisfied with the performance of the Bosch routers.  In fact, to my ear, they are quieter than a comparable PC router.

   Good luck on your decision!

   Bill Arnold

   B&B Woodworking

1. 
   NCLaquer | Jul 15, 2004 06:50pm | #10

   I have read some reviews indicating the 1617 is prone to switch problems.  Are you aware of this?  Have you had any trouble? 

1. 
   BArnold | Jul 16, 2004 01:30pm | #13

   I haven't had any problems with the switch or speed control on any of my routers.  I make an effort to keep them as clean as possible by blowing the dust off them when I finish using them.Bill Arnold

   B&B Woodworking

2. 
   CharlieP | Jul 15, 2004 10:58pm | #11

       "how many more routers do I need to catch up to Norm???"

   The answer is easily determined.  Count the total number of router bits you own, subtract the number of routers you already have, and that is your answer.  (Have you ever seen Norm change a router bit?)

   ________________________Charlie Plesums  Austin, Texashttp://www.plesums.com/wood

1. 
   BArnold | Jul 16, 2004 12:23am | #12

   (Have you ever seen Norm change a router bit?)

   Amen!

   (especially when he can build anything in a half-hour, huh?)Bill Arnold

   B&B Woodworking