I’ve made the decision to eventually build 2 chairs for our dining room table. These will be arm chairs and I’m not worried about following the form of the other 4 chairs at the table. I’m looking for a grand, but not too over the top appearance and COMFORT. A chair that I will enjoy placing my rear end in for the next 30 years.
I’ ve been leaning towards the look of a Combback Windsor, and as I’ve gone through the process I was even leaning towards buying 2 of these handmade chairs. But I”ve decided that as much as I like woodworking, and as much as I need to learn more about handtools that it just makes sense to build these myself, even if it takes several chairs to “get it right” and many, many months before they’re done.
But now that I”ve made this decision, I think it’s smart to step back and decide again on what type of chair to make. All that I’ve read about chairs has been about Windsors only. Everything about their design seems to be exactly what I’m looking for – beautifuly lines, time tested design, durable, comfortable, design options (combback, continuous arm, etc.). But given that I know next to nothing about other chairs, I was hoping for some feedback.
So, what type of chair would you build for yourself given the following criteria:
newbie to chair making, some woodworking experience but very little with hand tools, willing and excited to learn, not in a rush, dining room table “end” chairs with arms, somewhat grand design (think Combback Windsor), durable chair, comfortable chair
Thanks very much for your input
Replies
I attended one of Mike Dunbar's one-day workshops on Windsors years ago. (I hate to admit how many years ago -- he was but a young pup then!) It would amaze you how much you can learn about working with hand tools by making one of these. He has at least one book, and probably a video by now. If you can swing it, I'd recommend attending one of his week-long workshops. It's one of those things I've had on my own "must do" list. http://www.thewindsorinstitute.com
Mike Hennessy
Pittsburgh, PA
Woody,
Presumably we are talking wooden chairs without upholstery....?
If so I would recommend, for long-term comfort an Adirondack. One built with all the curves (rather than the flatback type sold by garden centres) is very, very comfortable hour after hour. (Tested in the gazebo on long summer evenings). But they are generally too low-slung for dining tables. I wonder if there is a design that can make an Adirondack into a dining chair? (A bit of a challenge there)!
Next on my list would be a slat & stick chair of the Country or Shaker type. They are often seen as rockers but also come as dining chairs, with or without arms. I've built a number of these and seat them with bark. If you build them in the traditional way, the bark seats and thin curved slats make them very comfortable. The back slats bend to your back-shape and the whole chair will flex just enough to fit itself to you.
After that comes a Windsor. I never made one (would like to) mainly because they seem like something that needs to be designed around a particular person. Many Windsors that I've sat on seemed uncomfortable in the longer term, because the back was the wrong curve or angle; or the seat-hollow too small/big.
Just some thoughts, really.
Lataxe
Edited 1/5/2007 3:55 pm ET by Lataxe
Youve just made a decision to do one of the hardest woodworking projects youll ever do ( Norm Abrams called it the Hardest ). Good luck.. Do a lot of reading and practice, practice practice. Being a guy who has built over 2 dozen chairs I will tell you the little things will drive you nuts. Thats why an experienced chairmaker has all sorts of " help me" gadgets and patterns.
Wicked Decent Woodworks
(oldest woodworking shop in NH)
Rochester NH
" If the women dont find you handsome, they should at least find you handy........yessa!"
One very good way to get into chairs is to start out by buying a used/antique chair that you like. It's best if you like everything about it -- the wood, the seat, everything. Take it apart and copy it, piece by piece. Then assemble it, followed by your copies. Assuming that you've prepared the original for a new finish, the fun will be to have others try to spot the orginal from your copies.One way to really make this interesting is to scatter the original chair parts out between two, four, six, or eight chairs.Rp
Good point about finding a chair he likes and copy it. But won't he have to spend alot of time finding the maker to ask his permission?
Hope this doesn"t lead to 200 posted about plagerism! There really is nothing new under the sun. Use what others can teach us, thank them by doing your best work!
Unless you are in a position to work under the guidance of a talented and experienced woodworker -- at a workshop, for instance -- copying a real piece is one of the best ways to learn. The first time out, it's a good idea to be rather slavish about the copying. Same wood, same grain, same dimensions, same joints ....Rp
I think the Windsor is my most enjoyable project, having just finished my fifth chair, all of them different. I would especially recommend the book by John Kassay, his braced fan back arm-chair is my most recent. It's a great way to hone the spindle-turning skills. It's fun to go to the woods, split out the spindle blanks, shave down the sticks, and assemble something that is devoid of 90 degree angles. A course would be nice, but there are enough books available to cover most problems. Another very helpful book is "The Chairmaker's Workshop".
Tom
You've picked a challenging and rewarding project here.
My approach would be to seek out as many different styles as possible through magazines, catalogs, the net, even furniture stores and antique shops. Sit in and measure the ones you can.
Sketch, sketch, sketch. You'll be surprised to find that certain themes will repeat themselves through this process. Make at least one (usually many) mock-up out of in expensive lumber . These can be screwed together and easily changed.The goal is to find forms, dimensions and proportions that work. Trust your eyes and your back side. Don't get bogged down in small details here. Paint with broad strokes early on and refine as you go.
The process is a slow one, especially at first. I believe that, like any project, preparation is the key. By the time you get into building the actual chair you'll see that the time spent was well worth it.
Good Luck,
-Paul
Paul,I agree with everything you've said about chair design. This is the right way to work up a sort of "perfect" chair (perfect being a relative term). But I don't think it's the best way to go about making one's first chair. The first chair needs to be a get-on-with-it and get-it-done sort of project, with a pay-off in the near term.Just my opinion. Rp
To expand on my previous comment: a truism about mastery is that every x has a thousand bad y's in him or her, and the thing to do is to get to work making those thousand y's so as to get to a good one. Drawings, paintings, chairs, bowls, whatever.I'd hate to have to make a thousand bad chairs before making a good one, so I hope the quantity in the truism is off by a couple orders of magnitude.Even so, I think that the biggest mistake a beginning woodworker can make is to aim for perfection straight out of the gate. Make imperfect things! Live with them for a while. Continue to make things that are less imperfect. Make LOTS of things, getting better as you go along. Keep at it until, one day, you pass the chair or table in your room and say, gosh, I can do better than that! Then do so!Try making a chair in a day. Rough stock in the morning; a chair for drinking a beer by evening. Then make a better chair in a day.There has always been too much perfect-talk among FWW readers. I think perfection is great. It just shouldn't be where you start out.Rp
Edited 1/6/2007 6:58 am ET by Riverprof
Rp,
Yeah, I can see the value in your approach. For me, chairs had been such a departure from the mostly rectilinear cabinet forms I was used to. The approach with mock-ups is in a way similar to the approach you suggest. I just prefer to not launch into the final ,often expensive, material until my understanding is clear.
I suppose, in a way, all of our first attempts are the mock-ups for what is next.
Thanks,
-Paul
Paul,Agreed. I suppose that what you called a mock-up, I've called a chair. You also raised the $64K question: how do you learn without spending a fortune on stock. I think that's really the first lesson a woodworker needs to learn, a lesson that I'm still trying to learn. It's not: I want to work with walnut because Maloof and Nakashima work(ed) with walnut. Rather, it's: what's cheap today, where I live, that will look good enough. And how can I buy lots of it for peanuts so that I can afford to make mistakes.Rp
I have been taking chairmaking classes for the past couple of years. While I think it's possible for a person with some experience to learn to build a decent chair it was very helpful to me to go through the more formal classroom process and in the end saved a me a lot of time learning by trail and error.
My first chair was a Queen Ann style at North Bennett Street School followed by a Windsor Combback with Curtis Buchanan at North Bennett Street School and then a Chippendale with Phil Lowe at the Furniture Institute of Massachusetts. This summer I will be taking two new classes one with Brian Boggs at North Bennett Street School doing a more "contemporary" style and the other a Sheridan style at Phil Lowes Furniture Institute of Massachusetts.
Building a Windsor Chair is somewhat different then the more formal styles and if you do it the traditional way it uses tools that are a bit unusual. It is helpful to take a class to better understand the tuning up and how to use these tools. There are a few books to help with Windsor chairmaking and Mike Dunbar's are a classic though hard to find. I found that The Chairmaker's Workshop by Drew Langsner ISBN 1-57990-230-8 is much more detailed and broader then the Dunbar books along with being somewhat more readily available used.
I am attaching a picture of the Curtis Buchanan and the Windsor chair that we built. Curtis is giving the same two week class this summer at North Bennett Street School and I would recommend it highly.
A couple of sources for classes are:
http://countryworkshops.org/schedule.html
http://www.nbss.org/workshops/schedule.asp
http://www.furnituremakingclasses.com/home.html
I have really enjoyed all of the classes that I have taken and I'm sure if you decide to go this route you will also enjoy it.
Sorry the Picture didn't make it to the first message
Ron
Sounds like you have hit all the chairmaking classes available. I have not done any formal chairs for myself but made a few Virginia chairs years ago to match a set of 18th century pieces. Having an example made it possible for me.
Windsors: CB is the best in the business. That's his only business. What chair did you make?? I see the photo of curis with the Philly leg in the comb. Nice.
One from NC.
Wondering what chair you made eventually?? Did you go the windsor route?
A couple arm chair photos:
Rhode Island leg on comb
New England leg on continuous arm
Edited 10/31/2007 8:41 am ET by danmart
Danmart,
Many, many months may turn out to be many, many years. But I did decide on a Windsor and want to build a Combback. And may I say that those are some beautiful chairs you included in your email. I did find the Windsor and Langsner books - more than I wanted to spend but I'm hoping that if I ever decide to sell that they may hold at least some of their value. Plus I've enjoyed reading them.
Two small kids, new house, new job - those are my excuses and I'm sticking to them. My goal this winter is to clean out and organize my garage and get my shop up and running. Then I will have a heck of a time deciding what to build first.
Woody
woody
stick my name on the wall. if you don't have a lathe.. no problema. no steambox ... no problema. I have 200 legs, 100 spindles turned and ready to assemble. chair? plan, lots of combs in cherry and oak.
Time: its yours when you have it.
best
Edited 10/31/2007 9:10 pm ET by danmart
Dan, You may want to remove that last message before you get overrun with requests ;-) But I appreciate the offer. Your name is on the wall.
Bringing this back has sparked my interest. I think I'll go to sleep tonight with Drew Langsner's book.
Many thanks
woody
read the book again. after all of the chores look up Curtis Buchanan with google.
get back with your thoughts
later
I'm looking for a grand, but not too over the top appearance and COMFORT...
I would make two chairs and make the 'Lady of the house a bit higher" 1/2 inch or so.. If you ever get into a spat... Hand her a tape and tell her to go measure it... You were always higher en' me..
maybe hers? maybe your chair?? Make the next one shorter??
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