I’ve had a fire going in the fireplace for several days now.. At first I was just burning chunks of oak with a little eastern white pine. I spent one whole day burning cherry, followed by the two black walnut days. Yesterday was tamarck day and today I think I’ll burn maple..
That’s all fine and good but it’s getting a bit boring,, any suggestions for variety or special effects?
Replies
Suggestions?
Hell yeah, dedicate a decade or two to burning fir!
Hah, ha, ha...
Lee
Furniture Carver
Throw a little Catalpa on the fire!
PlaneWood by Mike_in_KatyPlaneWood
Why catalpa? I thought it doesn't burn very well. Not a lot of it around here, most is in someones back yard.. Not really native.
Frenchy -
Catalpa will smolder for a week without burning and the stink will make you retch. Was a joke.
PlaneWood by Mike_in_KatyPlaneWood
Frenchy, don't burn money. At hight temps the ash vitrifies. I've seen a jack hammer used to break the grates free again.
BJGardening, cooking and woodworking in Southern Maryland
You have that much money that you need to burn enough to have to jack hammer the grates open? Would you please adopt me?
The experts, the REAL experts, the guys who make a living logging native timber in South West New Zealand, say that Southern rata is by far the best firewood.
It's dark red. It splits like high-grade coal. Its as dense as. And it smells nice. Or is it the rimu that gives the west coast in winter that nasal-clearing smell? Help me, kiwis.
I once used some to decorate a workbench, and the forest guys came around to look and marvel. What a waste of really good firewood was the usual reaction. Bloody townies, what do they know. Cheez!
Nah, far as I know its Rata. From memory is No. 2 on the hard scale, next to lignum. My father in law burns the stuff all winter. seems like it is almost hard currency. <G>
Shocking shrinkage rates though, and an awful job getting it to dry out enough to keep still. I always though it would make great mallets.
Wood Hoon
Hey! Go Kiwi!
For us mere mortals, (New Zealand) east coasters (although I'm from Central Otago, go here for all the detail you could possibly want: http://www.macpherson.co.nz), manuka is about as good as firewood gets. I've seen it turned. It never grows big enough to make anything useful from. But boy, does it burn well!
I remember as a boy, the early 60s, working all one weekend with my dad and a bunch of fundraisers cutting manuka firewood. We cleared a little gully by the side of State Higway One near the yellow shed at the Waimate (South Canterbury) turnoff, filled enough trailers to reach Timaru end to end, and all went home Sunday sore but happy. Even now, mumble years later, when I drive past that little gully (it's burned into my memory, guys) I can feel the blisters.
I took delivery of a load of firewood last weekend - mostly old-man willow - and in it were a few bits of Russian (black) olive. Beat that!
Well, last Sept we had the grandaddy of all Nor' westers blow through. flattened trees all over the place. A mate had approx 30 gums blow over, some were about 12" through and only 9 years old.
I helped him cut them up, get them off fences etc, and replumbed a bathroom for him. I now have 2 1/2 cords of beauuuuutiful eucalypt stacked under the pines to dry. all for free too!
Wood Hoon
>> ... all for free too!
You have a very unusual understanding of "free."
Edited 1/29/2003 9:55:03 PM ET by Uncle Dunc
Give him a break Unc, he's a Kiwi (and it sounds like a South Islander as well).
We think differently down here!
I'd love to give him a break. :) In fact, I'd be delighted to give him 2-1/2 cords of mixed North American hardwoods, absolutely free, if he'll come and replace my garage floor. And if he doesn't mind burning elm, I'll throw in the elm in my back yard, if he'll fell it and cut it up. And all the cottonwoods along the fence line, same deal.
HAAHAA, time I have, money ..........not so much. My mate wanted to pay me for my work, but as i needed wood, I said howsa bout a trade.
It needed cutting anyway, so he helped me and i helped him. see?
If I lived a bit closer I would take your wood too!
I would rather work for something than pay in money. I get more pleasure out of it and the $$ get to go on something I cant trade for.
Wood Hoon
>> It needed cutting anyway, so he helped me and i helped him. see?
Oh, yes. I see very clearly, I think. I'd probably make the same choice if I had more time than money. But, having paid dearly for the wood, I wouldn't describe it as free afterwards. Unless I was talking to the tax authority. :)
I've a question for you...I was in ChristChurch in '94 in July for a few weeks...everyone was burning word in town (suburbs of the city)...and I guess there was some form of inversion later and all the smoke just clung to the ground. I couldn't drive it was so bad...even if on the wrong side of the road! Is it still that way? Or was it a freak thing? I recall hearing about burn bans and such because of the problem.
Beautiful country down there...nothing like wide open places! Made it out to Arthur's Pass one afternoon...someday I'd love to backpack through the bush.
It was an inversion, it's uncommon for it to be that bad, it is a public health issue and has been the subject of much controversy over the years.
The Christchurch City Council is trying and has made some real progress - and things are very much improved. But even with no wood fires, there will still be vehicle exhausts, other forms of heating and so on.
We have a similar but much less severe problem in my home township (Alexandra, Central Otago) and will eventually have to do something about it. Here it's only bad on a few days each winter, and it is usually short-lived (early evening, early morning), and the health risks are minimal. But it looks bad - especially considering New Zealand's "Clean Green" international image!
BTW, people here in Central Otago burn mostly pine and willow, some fruitwood (this is an orcharding region) and small amounts of eucalypt and other plantation species. European hardwoods (oak, ash, walnut, cherry and so on) are only rarely used as firewood.
Glad it is getting better. I literally had to stop once...my eyes were burning so bad! Only had to do that once in LA in the smog...sorry to make the analogy!
It is lovely down there. There's a zoo someplace in Christchurch...I don't remember were now, but I was able to feed a giraffe and pet his head when he was eating. It was an AWESOME experience...one that my kids hear about everytime we see a giraffe anywhere!
I have 44 acres of woods with my house in the center...and I'd guess about 20% of it is red oak. Maple is second most common hardwood. Some white pines...and a few spruce. We burn oak and maple and cherry up here for firewood all the time. Tops and culls.
Nice to meet ya!
The zoo is called Orana Park. So far as they go, not a bad one.
The giraffe is still there, plus a couple of his mates. pretty neat set up for them and very popular.
There is another place very close to there called Willowbank. It's primary aim is to save endangered domestic breeds. They also have a kiwi breeding programme. Neat spot for a visit.
The Christchurch air is a problem, but is being worked on. Coal fires were to be banned in an effort to help, but that idea was withdrawn. (?) New house can only have woodburners if they meet the clean air requirements, and restrictions are coming soon on what can be burned in the open by farmers etc. It will all have a good effect.
There is a guy near me who has designed and built a woodburner with zero smoke output. Be interesting to see if it is taken up by the "powers".
Wood Hoon
It's primary aim is to save endangered domestic breeds. They also have a kiwi breeding programme.
I knew the country was sparsely settled, but i had no idea things had come to such a pass! IanDG was telling me that when kiwis read, their lips move, so with that in mind, i offer to send some instructional videos on the correct form and procedure. It's sort of like crocodile wrestling, come to think about it...
"IanDG was telling me that when kiwis read, their lips move," I didn't say "when" -- I said "--if they can"IanDG
Well, everything was ticking along just fine here, but then there was a large influx of Australians, and, well, it all sorta went downhill once intermarriage took place. Its going to take a good long while to get the dud genes out of the population. However thanks to heroic efforts on the part of a few dedicated souls we will overcome this calamity.
Come to think of it, we had a fair few Yanks here during the war too. Hhhmmmmmmm, that could explain a few quirks we cant pin on the Ockers......
Wood Hoon
If this was a moderated discussion, the moderator would have been smacking us around the ears long ago. We're a long way from any possible link to FWW. But it's not ... so I'll continue.
A previous New Zealand Prime Minister once famously said that every time a New Zealander migrates to Australia, the IQ of both countries increases.
WHAAHAAHAAHAAHAAHAAHAA
Priceless!! Good onya mate, that was my second laugh today in the day from hell.
Anyway, as the expression goes..................Stuffem!! <G>
Wood Hoon
Sadly I was born in the North Island. Now live about 40 mins Nth of Christchurch. WAY better than the top half. can safely say I have no urge to go back.
Central is nice, would like to live there, the winters are just my thing. Got a BIL in Queenstown................would move there tomorrow.
Wood Hoon
Talk amongst yourselves, you North Americans, while us Kiwis catch up on the local gossip!
Why has THIS topic run to >>30 posts!? It's not just the Kiwis.
Is it because "When to burn" is something we all worry about?
Here's an example of the dilemma. I just bought a truck load of recycled kauri floorboards, a commercially unavailable heritage timber that came from a local bank that dates back about 140 years. Between the nails, it's lovely wood - honey-coloured, fine-grained, carves like ivory, takes a gleaming finish straight from 0000 wire wool, stays where you put it ... not very exciting, but it's an icon timber. Everyone warms to kauri, it's a big part of this country's social history and culture.
In the truck load, which both me and the merchant guess is about 3.5 cubic metres (if I've got the sums right, about 900 linear metres, which I paid $US0.35 per metre for) there's about 15% waste. It's got worm, it's been split and munted during demolition, or it's got too many nails to sensibly denail.
Here's the point. When is it firewood? Forget what I paid, this timber is effectively irreplaceable. I'll never come across such a truckload again. Not with this heritage and provenance. Do I short-up and burn the 15% waste this winter, or do I spend days picking through it, cutting out a metre here and a half metre there?
I have to decide this weekend. Cheeze!
It's going to make great kindling, but am I gonna hate burnig it!!
AHH, a wise guy! Just for that I won't save you any of the good stuff! (I really hate to burn black walnut crotch wood , but you've been naughty so you must be punished!)
;-) (little sideways smiley face)
Lee,
fir would be expensive. Most of it growes out west and needs to be shipped here.. frankly I'd rather burn money than fir!
For us "westerners" you are burning money! Funny about this shipping and handling. Here the fir grows in the back yard and the hardwood comes from the specialized lumber yards.
Jim
What I don't understand is they build houses here with fir and think nothing of it, yet black walnut/ oak /ash etc. which is cheaper they would never build a house out of it!
I bought 1500 bd.ft. of 5/4 ash and paid $150.00 for it.. That's 15 cents a bd. ft. My sister sent it into a cabinet shop and made some wonderful flooring.. Yet that went upstairs and southern yellow pine is planned for the living room..
I gave her 500 bd.ft. of really wonderful cherry and now I hear she's planning on using it for shelves...(in the closets)
Can I live in her closet?? I just paid about $8 a bf for 4/4 stock. (The one odd piece I needed to complete a project and did't shop around.)
Jim
Edited 1/28/2003 7:08:49 PM ET by Jim in CO
Frenchy mate, you send all that loverly walnut an cherry to me, and in exchange i will send a similar volume of Manuka. No pretty flames, but it burns sooo hot and the smoke makes fish taste really good.
Wood Hoon
AJ buddy,
Those tiddly little piece won't be worth your time. I'm saving you some nice 8 foot pieces to make decent stuff outa! 3-4 feet is just scraps.
Frenchy, 3 to 4 foot bits of walnut or cherry is cabinet sized wood round here!
No wonder i drink....................
Wood Hoon
AJ,
Oh, I forgot, fine wood working really is fine box and cabinet makin' Opps!
;-) (please note the little sideways smiley face)
Wow, I envy you the variety of wood. I can get lots of pine, and some fir here. But even when I go to the local yard it's $.25/ bd. ft. for their scrap pile stuff. Still plenty good for many projects, particularly since they'll let you pick and choose pieces.
Where exactly are you? It might be worth a drive out there to get a load of that if you'd show me where to get such deals. I could bring back a ton of expensive lumber with a pickup and trailer.
1500 bd. ft. of 5/4 cherry or ash around here would probably run at least $6-9,000 ($4-6/bd. ft.). Might even be more then that as I think it'd have to be special ordered.
Where are you again????
I've been told Frenchy when a new chimney is installed it is customary to burn part of the roof sheathing/flooring that had to be removed in the first fire...otherwise I don't know of any burning rituals.
I really hate to burn all of this stuff, I know that I'll regret it in the future when I actually start to build furniture and stuff rather than a house, but right now it's damage control. I have a few thousand bd.ft. at my elbow as I type this plus several more thousand bd.ft. scattered in every nook and cranny in the house.
Outside I look like a lumberyard and my neighbors are getting tired of the look.
I was hoping that a local wood worker would see these posts and decide that they could use the cut-offs for projects etc. Heck it would save me the price of a match and I'd get to bore some schmuck into taking a tour of the barn, er house...
All my friends and relatives are wise to my invite gamit, since I usually con them into taking several pieces with them when they leave.. Now their homes are looking like mine!! (heh, heh!)
I've got a lot of Black walnut and most is 4 to 6 inches thick and 4 to 8 inches wide. lengths vary from short stubs to 4 foot pieces. The White Oak is a little larger. Most wood is pretty dry , It's been air drying for as long as 4 years now. The tamarck was burned last week as was most of the cherry cut-offs. (tamarck is really the prettiest wood of them all in my humble opinion) I've got a lot of tamarck left to use though so I'll have plenty in the future..
Heck, it will save me the price of a match....
<sob>
WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
When will the hurting stop?
Wood Hoon
I'm on lake Minnetonka, just west of Minneapolis Minn. give me notice before you come and I'll call the sawmill and see what he has a deal on.. normal price is around 80 cents a foot for most wood, but periocially he needs to get rid of a bunker or two of something that someone ordered and didn't pick up. when that happens he gets pallet wood prices for it and that right now is around 20 cents
I might just come see you. I'm dying to see your house anyway. That is if you're the same frenchy from Breaktime, but I assume you are.
Lake Minnetonka. Somewhere in my reading of US history something signifigant happened there, but I can't remeber what it was. That name's very familar to me, have to do some research.
My wife and I are planning on taking a road trip this spring. Leaving the kids with some relatives and spending a week touring around enjoying America.
MapQuest shows it as only being about 1300 miles, thought it was further then that.
I wouldn't be able to bring back a ton of wood, but some 5/4 or 8/4 cherry would be wonderful. Would like to build a bedroom set. Would love to do it out of solid wood. What woods are commonly available? I'd rent a small UHaul trailer and tow it back behind my Caddy. I'd bring my Suburban, but that'd add at least $200 in fuel costs to the trip. Depends what projects I plan.
Yeh, that's me the wacko!
The song of Hiawatha was based on the lakeshore of Lake Minnetonka (Tonka, =big sea waters)
The sawmill will usually cut me whatever I want out of whatever grade of wood I want to pay for. typically no minimum charge. (they just need a fair amount of notice) so 5/4 or 8/4 cherry should be no problem,, are you sure you won't take home a few free 4x8 pieces of black walnut? Same price (free) for 6x12 pieces of white oak..or 6x9's how about some 4x4 black walnut heartwood? save some space in the trunk for the tamarck too!
OK, here's some trivia for you: the meter for the poem "Hiawatha" by Longfellow was based on the Finish national epic poem "Kalevala" which is an account of a murderous, rapacious brute, sort of like your Paul Bunyan, come to think of it.
I'm burning the board sheathing i sawed off my house in order to replace it with OSB so i could dense-pack cellulose in the walls. Once a week, i haul out about ten pounds of nails from the stove and carefully straighten them so they can be recycled to hang siding next summer. Then i use the ashes along with the oil i drain out of the Toyota to make laundry soap. It doesn't lather too well on my steel washboard, but it's FREE!
Edited 1/31/2003 4:28:04 PM ET by SPLINTIE
splintie,
kiddo, I'm impressed. starighten nails, make soap.. what next? hunt bear and tan hides? Plow fields and can pickles?
I haven't hunted bar, but i once took a road-kill racoon and tanned it. After all that chewing, i rubbed tung oil into it and it went all stiff again. Obviously, i was a pre-woodworker in those days, didn't know my earls...
ROTFLMAO
I would gladly come to your place and take that wood off your hands. The problem would be driving home with the back bumper scraping the ground. Sounds like I just need to visit frenchy's lumberyard. Then I have to figure out where to store it. I could put it in the attic, but Boss Hog would laugh at me when my trusses came apart.
Making anything out of anything hardwood around here involves making a serious financial committment, but I love to work solid lumber.
I floated the idea of going over to the great lakes for our road trip to my wife at lunch. She liked the idea. Didn't tell her the reason I got the idea though. Have to go look at furniture, then price some wood, then wonder if I could get the wood cheaper near where it's grown, then mention this crazy guy on the web who's building a timberframe house, and she'll think it was her idea. Yeah right, she'd see right through me as usual.<G>
We'll probably be doing it in early June. Right after school get out, but before tourist season begins (I dislike crowds, and hotels are cheaper). In like way, if you ever want to go to Yellowstone, hit it before Memorial Day or after Labor Day (it's about 70 miles to West Yellowstone, 100 if you go through Jackson Hole from my house). Much more enjoyable without all the waits due to traffic. And, in the spring it's cool to see all the baby elk and buffalo.
Hey, any suggestions on some neat places to explore between Idaho and Minnesota? Particularly things reasonably close to the major roads. I'll probably bring camping gear. Just can't get too far off track, or I'd lose too much time to driving.
You keep offering all that free wood and I'll have to bring the suburban. Then I'll take a couple tons home and I'll be building a storage shed next summer. So far I don't see a down side to this equation. Love to build things.
Billy,
remember green wood is twice as heavy as dry wood, so don't think about the car, use the suburban! The added fuel costs will be offset by the wood you bring home. Plus I hate looking at squirrel nests when the bumper is rubbing on the road...
If you pull a trailer you can bring home evan more and if you select a wood that I've got that is already dry I won't mind trading a little green for dry.
figure a bunker of wood is around a thousand bd.ft. seven pounds per bd.ft. is 7000 pounds. trade some of that for some dry and you have a decent trailer load...
Lee, confession time,,
do you feel about fir they way I feel about elm????
> ....any suggestions for variety or special effects?
Yeah ... send me all those neat scraps I can use for segmented turning projects and I'll send you a crate full of cedar. Cedar is a very user interactive firewood, in case you've never had the pleasure of sitting around a nice, noisey fire. (grin)
Dennis in Bellevue WA
[email protected]
we have cedar growing here (a little) But I haven't bought any. the tamarck pops and sparks almost as much..
I'll let you have any and all the pieces you want, frankly anything less than 4 feet winds up in in the fireplace and it's a pain in the rectum to cut it all to fit in the fireplace. However packing and shipping will cost you big......... ;-)
Frenchy -
If your sign-in name is any indication of your location, perhaps the shipping would be a bit more than the cost of running down to my neighborhood wood supplier and purchasing same! (grin)
Still and all, though, it seems a shame to burn what sounds like useful material. But then, we have to stay warm then, don't we! (grin)
Where, perzactly, *are* you located just out of curiosity?
...........
Dennis in Bellevue WA
[email protected]
By the shore of gitcheegoomee by the shiney big sea waters lies the home of frenchy..
(well sorta from the song of hiawatha, which indicates Lake Minnetonka Minnesota)
actually most of my burning is to get room to work without tripping over scraps..
Actually, VG fir (very good (grin)) is getting harder and harder to find. It's out there (or here) but costs as much as some exotics if you want the really nice looking stuff.
All the really big old growth fine growth-ring wood is about a thing of the past. The house I bought last year and am in the process of remodeling has all beveled cedar siding - nary a knot in any of it. I have some areas where I'll be needing to patch in some new siding and I'm not looking forward to the cost involved.
Back to the buring issue ... hehe... Don't know what UPS freight costs would be but if you throw away 3-4' long pieces of stuff, weigh a small stack of it sometime and I'll call them to see what it would cost to ship it out here.
...........
Dennis in Bellevue WA
[email protected]
well the ashes wiegh next to nothing,, I could send several bd. ft. in an envelope and a regular stamp would pay the postage..
Oh you want pb wood? (preburned)
Take a 12 inch piece of copper pipe, wrap it with electrical tape, and toss on the coals. I don't know how it works or how environmentally friendly it is, but it produces some nice multi-colored flames (mostly greens).
Cherry burns with a very pretty blue flame once it's down to coals.. but wouldn't it be cheating to use metal for theme burning? besides I have a use in mind for my copper scraps...
Copper wire and electrical tape in the fire makes the pretty colors because the chlorine from the burning PVC tape reacts with the copper at hight temps. It is called the Beilstein Test for chlorine.
Invironmental effects? Weeell.... I don't think that you want to stand directly down wind of it and hydrochloric acid going up the chimney could contribute to acid rain. But a short piece of copper wire and tape probably don't contribute very much to whats already in the atmosphere.
BJGardening, cooking and woodworking in Southern Maryland
You could use the oak to smoke kippers.Very tasty!
Regards Len
I dislike the smell of Oak,, it's too acidic for my taste. I don't like the smell of Black walnut burning either.. In fact only Cherry and apple impart an oder that I like..
Larch.
Edited 1/30/2003 12:59:42 AM ET by Glendo
?
Frency,
Havn't talked to you for awhile. Looks like I might actually be heading your way. My wife has a buisiness convention she's been thinking about going to. Found out today it's going to be in Minneapolis on June 20-21.
My first thought was to fly out with her and rent a small U-Haul to drive back. Airfare + $891 for their small truck changed my mind quickly. Guess I'm back to driving the suburban w/ a trailer behind.
Does your offer for wood still hold? You mentioned trading some wet for some of your dry wood. Is this still possible?
Can you email me some contact info for the woodlot you use? Or just email me and we'll see if any of this will work out. She has to pre-register in a week or so if she decides to go.
What woods are available? You've mentioned black walnut, white oak, tamarak, cherry, and maple. Are there others? I've never built anything out of any of this wood except for some very limited maple use.
First, check with expedia.com for cheaper fares.. (including rentalcar/truck) I was amazed at the money I saved!
Woods available,
Oak red and white, ash, hickory, elm, hackberry, maple hard and soft, cherry, box elder, butternut, cottonwood, poplar,pine, eastern white and norway,black walnut,basswood,birch,beech.
depending on what you need and my needs for it sure! I have a lot a hard maple and some cherry, the tamarck I have is all 8/4 and some of the oak I have is larger, thicker stuff. the black walnut is pretty much gonna be used in the next year or less so I won't have too much extra of that..
the sawmill is Johnson logging in Cannon Falls Minnesota if you want kiln dried stuff and don't mind paying extra for it Northern hardwoods in cannon falls will sell you anything from a single board up..
as for working/ color proerties I'll be glad to give my opinion but I warn you, I'm very opinionated and there are certain woods that I'm very bigotted about..
Wow, I'm gonna have to do some wood research. Don't know anything about some of those.
I'd really like to get a good variety.
I did check out the web-site you listed. Good airfares. Nothing on U-Haul type rentals. Looked into renting a SUV w/ a hitch. Every low rate they listed didn't pan out though. $300/wk, but can't drop off at another place. $344/wk (why is a week 6 days?) but when I tried to confirm it went to $499/wk. Then they added fees and taxes and it's $650/wk.
I'll probably have to drive up and meet my wife.
If I can trade you for some dry wood, that would be fantastic. That trailer's gonna get awfully heavy awfully fast.
I'll email you, so we can take this discussion offline.
Thanks
BillyG
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