This is directed to mainly cabinet / furniture and other related shop business owners .
This recent down turn / slow down is to me much more devastating then in the early eighties , the housing starts were off then but you could go out and get a job . Now we have few starts and fewer jobs to be had along with the many unemployed . I have been busy for the last 27 years with little down time , the last 10 years have been fabulous until a few years ago it slowed a bit and each year since .
I do mostly custom cabinets on the high medium to upper end of the price spectrum locally and the phone has stopped ringing . I know this one shop in town was doing very large jobs one after the other and top notch designs .
I am about ready to make a calling list of past clients and give them a call to round up some work , I had the idea to give the busy guy a call ,, I did and we had not talked or seen eachother for like 8 years maybe but he remembered I have survived like him for close to 30 years , he said the fact that we are still here speaks volumes .I had sent him a job or two over the years when I could not handle the work , I think he remembered that.
Well I told him I was slow and looking for work and told him I would appreciate any referrals he could not get to or whatever or if you could just throw me a bone . He said he was in the middle of something and he would call me back . He called in an hour and asked me to stop by his shop and check out a job.
I am looking and bidding on a 15 or 20 thousand dollar wine cellar set up , I have a good chance of getting the job and sure need the income and may strike an important relationship .
So what I realized is the market this guy is in , he was working on cabinets for a house over 10,000 sf , he has job after job lined up and has to be turning down more work then I could ever do .
So instead of calling all the builders who are slow and my past clients I went right to the source of the top of the local market and found more opportunity there than on the street .
Talk to other shops see how you can help eachother , if one shop is busier see if he has any overflow show them your stuff , good luck .
dusty , a boxmaker
Replies
This is unscientific but I asked a couple of day laborers in a HD parking lot what they were seeing and they said contractor activity has dropped off almost completely. There must have been 100 guys standing around at 10 in the morning. I'm still seeing some remodel activity but fewer teardowns and a frightening number of houses (including a +10k square foot monster in a very wealthy town) where work has clearly shut down abruptly.
On the other hand, there is another multi-structure residential project that I drive by daily and I know for certain that there are 16 different contractors working on it and on any given day there will be 40 cars and trucks in the job site parking lot so I guess it's a mixed bag.
Wood,
I think what I'm saying is the high end is the only segment of the market that is still flourishing , the normal regular jobs are few and far between right now but the huge over the top and total high end is still alive and well even here in podunk Oregon , so I would have to believe this may be true in most all parts of the country . Some may need to change their marketing strategy, get in touch with designers and the folks who draw the plans for the big jobs .
dusty
Dusty,
I agree with you for the most part. The high end is the market because those clients want quality and will pay for it... or put another way, there simply is no market for custom cabinetry anywhere else but the top end, the economics simply don't work unless you have a lot of $$ invested in CNC machinery and can drive a high volume.A good indicator for me is housing stops. Keep in mind that I live on the Peninsula in the Bay Area so all home building is essentially custom or 2-4 home projects, and there are some very (persistently) wealthy communities like Atherton, Woodside, Portola Valley and Hillsborough. For the first time since the 1980's, I am seeing a number of large custom homes in these communities shut down construction abruptly. The house project I referenced in my previous reply is easily 10k square feet with a separate pool house structure that is being built on a half acre that likely sold for $4m with an existing structure that was fully torn down. It's been stopped for about 6 weeks and the roof hasn't even been put on yet. I also mentioned a super large 60 acre project in Woodside that when eventually completed will be a $100m price tag. It's enormous and the amount of materials and workers is staggering, so yeah the super top end is strong but the competition there is fierce. While the dollars spent on these projects are large, the number of projects compared to the $1-3m homes is really really small.Every part of the country is different so my perspective is just one from a very small part of the country.
The days of easy credit and McMansions are over to say the least. This is going to weed out a whole lot of guys, unfortunately.
So True , but the McMansions still exist and always will . While it is fact not as many are currently being built or many others ,the high end of the market will always be there imho , it's there now when almost all else is shut down.
We need to market our craft to folks that collect wine and maybe even have a cellar , that market is still alive and well .
regards dusty,just a boxmaker
It is slow for me too dusty. I have been taking in repair work, which I had been refusing to do in the past. I may be building a deck next, after this small kitchen, if I can still get that job. It is a shame to spend a lifetime building skills, then not getting to use those skills, only to have to be groveling for crumbs at the bottom of the skill level. In times like this, I will take whatever comes along. I sure wish I had a patron wanting my best dreams. It is a shame to let those ideas go to waste.
Hi Keith ,
Our ideas and dreams cannot be taken from us , it may just take longer to realize .
Yes when we are hungry it is amazing what we will do , at least me .
After the many years of business and experience learning our craft if we have stuck it out before and watched many shops come and go over the years and are still here , that must mean something ( we are stubborn)
Hang in there
dusty
Dusty - Good to hear you found a path out of the darkness. I have talked to few customers that have told me with their investment money out of the markets, and in hand, the best thing they can do is build personal real estate. The land, or old tired McMansions, or whatever will never be cheaper. This is the time to build or buy and remodel.One guy is out of prison and building his dream house, another is adding 10,000 s/f onto a 28,000 s/f house for staff and guests. Top quality is the place to be now, if you have the prior reputation to wave around. If not, you will do best to try to ally with the top shops in the area and work with, not against. These folks (customers) were the first in line when Gov't said 'we are buying toxic assets." Dave S
http://www.acornwoodworks.com
Dave ,
You have also seen the light , the is considered a time of opportunity to those with any money left to spend , bargains galore mixed in with the foreclosures and such .
As I have said after 27 years in business I have done well to create a reputation that typically will keep me busy , this time I'm having to knock on doors which is new to me .
There are 2 shops in particular that have been staying jampacked with high end work while the rest of the shops are dead .So I took a chance and called the owner of the best biggest shop and as the gentleman he is he seemed to understand where I was coming from . The truth be known this wine cellar is going to be hard for his shop to get done by early spring so I would be taking part of the load off this guy while staying alive and possibly getting my foot in the door with his circle.
thanks for your thoughts
dusty
Dusty,
I was recently contacted by a furniture designer who wanted me to make some high-end pieces for him. He asked if I were a one-man shop and I told him that I was. He said that that was no problem...most of the high quality furniture being made in the US these days is being made by people like us. It's nice to know that we are appreciated for what we do. The furniture we make isn't for everybody, but there are customers who understand the difference between factory-made stuff and hand-made quality.
Jim
Jim ,
Hang in there and keep doing what sets you apart from the production shops .
dusty
Dusty,Glad to hear about the wine cellar project. As they say, it pays to be proactive about finding work when the phone stops ringing. It also pays to do the high quality work that you do. I believe that the guys competing on price alone do not have a place in the high end market.Up here in Portland new residential has slowed way down as well, but I'm surprised at how many commercial projects are still going.Keep a positive attitude,Matthttp://www.oldgreenwoodworking.com
Dusty,
I'm glad to hear that you seem to have found some light at the end of the tunnel. I'm still looking around for something hopeful. We bid on a very large job - over $500K of office desks and cabinets for attorney's offices - that would keep us busy for 6 months. But it doesn't look very good because the competing bidding is fierce. Everybody is hungry it seems.
I think you're right about the approach, although I had a different idea yesterday. I thought we might go visit every client who we made kitchens for in the past 2 years and "tune up" the doors and drawers for free. I'm pretty sure that in the process they would ask about other jobs, nothing major but just enough to keep the wheels turning. We have overhead and salaries that come to some $20,000 every month. If the phone isn't ringing that digs a hole really quickly....
Keep thinking, and trying new approaches. There are people who will come out the other end of this depression in a much better position. Maybe us too?
regards,
David Ring
http://www.touchwood.co.il/?id=1&lang=e
David ,
Thank you for the positive words , how you can be so optimistic in this time of unrest in your country us beyond me . You are a true inspiration and a very wise fellow .
I think it is worth the time to go and adjust the doors and replace the bumper pads and give them a tack rag or other polish cloth er sumthun . The calculated odds say a few of the clients will want more work , also you will be fresh in their minds so they can refer your name to others .
God Bless dusty
Dusty,
I'm a part timer who currently has a full time job to pay the bills. All the woodworking earnings are used on kids collage at this time. My primary employer will be laying off hundreds next week, so I may be a fulltime woodworker soon.
Demand for my woodwork has slowed. I'm doing about 20% of the work I did last year. I have many irons in the fire, and if I read my customers right I'll be busy after April. These are folks who want to wait for now, but have said they won't wait past April no matter what the economy is doing. For now I'm beating the bushes, and doing some small jobs, and workshop upgrades. I like to idea of the kitchen tune-ups. I might make some calls there.
For now I'm hoping I don't get layed off next week, and that everyone's workshop will soon be busy again.
GRW
Dusty, I found this close-up of the X-type wine rack made with oak veneer.
David Ring
http://www.touchwood.co.il/?id=1&lang=e
A picture is worth a thousand words .
The idea is the same but these Xs will be like 23 " X 23 " with only four triangle compartments in each cube . Still a diagonal to each corner .
Thank you David
d
Dusty,
Ironically, I find myself in a similar position of having my workload (and income) slow down - but as a result my woodworking jobs have increased.
My main work, until about 18 months ago, was doing architectural photography for builders and developers. That market is really in the tank; when builders aren't building new homes they don't have any need for my services.
But I'm taking on some cabinetry and light carpentry jobs here and there and getting back into that type of work. There are a lot of little one-off projects out there that people need - a dining room table, bookshelves, nightstands, a bed. Now that I've started doing this stuff again I'm getting more calls for it.
If I had the overhead that some bigger shops have I'd probably be a lot more worried than I am. But if you can lean out your operation you can find ways to get by.
Good luck to you in this downturn..
ZoltonIf you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
I got into the wine cellar business to avoid competing with all the other "Cabinet shops and furniture makers". I work out of my home shop and Have done 6 figures in sales in the last 14 months. with one part timer as help. I am the only one doing it in a 100 mile radius. Thats not to say that i dont get beat from time to time from the national companies but i win most. the only advertising i have done is some phone calls to contractors/ country clubs and left my card at every wine store in the area.
803-617-8182
Mark Rhodes
Vinworx.com
Edited 2/18/2009 10:00 pm ET by vinworx
Mark & All ,
Well , I didn't end up with that cellar job , easy come easy go .
January was a financial disaster for us
I am glad to hear of your recent successes' in these market times imo that is a good sign .
Several jobs have come in the last few weeks and am looking and bidding at more , I am not turning anything down for sure .
This week on hump day it's been like the good old days darn near already this week a little cash flow and all .
There is nothing different here , may just be when it's your turn .
regards dusty
I realize i have been lucky. i would love to say its my brilliant business plan or marketing skills, but its not, I was just lucky and being in the right place with the right product. The truth is If I had a more than just me and one part timer with a shop that wasnt here at the house that i had to pay for, i would probably be looking for a "job".
I have a friend helping me develop a "franchise" type plan for small home shop owners to get into the wine cellar & wine cabinet business, geared toward the home shop owner that wants part time work. I am hoping that will get off the ground by the end of the year while making me some extra income and also help the home shop owners make some $$ as well.
I gave up corporate America 5 years ago with the idea i could tinker in my shop making furniture while scratching out a living. I realized that trying to be everything to every one was not working so i figued if i got good at one thing and worked at just that it would help. It has worked for me and while i will never get rich, i have managed to make a living.
Dusty, on a lighter note i noticed your from OR. what is the going rate on western cedar a BF ?? if someone was buying 4-5K feet.Mark Rhodes
Vinworx.com
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