Has anyone (other then Sam M) done a wood circ. stairs? I am THINKING about this. I need a circ stair in my library going up to the office, but I am not sure if I want to buy something for several grand or try and make something out of wood.
Any clues would be a help as I start the research phase of this. I figure I would not even start working on this until next fall. But this is something that will take a lot of research and design time if I even go that route.
Doug
Replies
I have done some, but it has been a while, before I got into digital photography, so I don't have any photos in my digital photo library.
You should check over in the FHB forum. There is a fellow, Stan, I think, who regularly post shots over there.
I vacuum-bagged all of the curved parts using epoxy for the adhesive, and got great results.
Have you been vacuum-bagging any curved parts yet? It seems that most of the articles which I have seen in magazines are always showing methods where the form is in the bag, but for this, you only put the laminates in the bag, then bend it all around the form before pulling the vacuum.
I have not tried to vacume form any curves yet. And I was thinking about going over to the "other side" to see what they have to say.
Doug
Doug, your question does not make clear whether you are thinking about a spiral, which winds around a central column, or if you are wanting one which is a curve but is attached to a wall, or even free-flying. If you like challenging work, this is a very fun project.
Doug, I was crusing in FHB last year and there were several guys that were showing off some heart stoppingly beautiful open structure circ. stairs. There were two basic types , metal welded core with attached wood risers/steps/ rails, and the wood core bent/laidup bent to forms wood parts. In both cases the finnished wood was high level select and very well matched/finished.
The two dificult aspects to me were first, the geometry of the layout is different and dificult, second is the structural/engineering (weight-load-span) analysis. I have no doubt that your wood skills would prevail nicely if these two aspects can be accomplished. I think these cause many to buy the basic structure. Good luck,Paddy
Edited 12/21/2007 11:08 am ET by PADDYDAHAT
I have built one circular stair -- the kind with a central column for support -- out of wood. I used a 6"X6" that I rounded off with a hand plane after I cut the corners off with a CS. Then through mortised for the tread supports. I built up the outside stringer out of bendy ply formed in place. Turned out just "OK", and for the work involved, I'd buy one of the pre-mades before I ever did it again. YMMV.
Mike Hennessy
Pittsburgh, PA
DougMeyer,
Circlular stairs don't have to be a major hurdle and yes you can build your own for less than they can be bought.
Now some cavots
they are strickly for people.. even carrying a few books up them can be difficult. Let alone anything of size or bulk. they take up a surprising amount of space for how compact they seem and the cental pillar needs to be on something pretty substantual or deflection will occur which will cause other problems..
Build your center core.. you can use either one solid beam or post, a tree trunk or you could build it up using multifacited wood. The tidiest approach is to have mortice slots cut for each stair. I would screw or otherwise fix the inside of the stair really solidly.. project each stair out and make sure it's level and start wrapping your outside stringer to each tread. That too will be a glue up
Your treads will be roughly triangular shaped and should be really substanual. 2 inches is about the minimum thickness and if it's a softer more flexible wood go even thicker, remember you won't have risers to stiffen things up..
The only complex part is the hand rail and there are a lot of solutions to that. Most involving glued up laminations..
It can be relatively easy to form once the treads are in place. Simply clamp it over the outside edge of the stair treads.
but I am not sure if I want to buy something for several grand or try and make something out of wood.
Cost you more than several grand for the wood clamps and the glue just to start the project!
Edited 12/23/2007 7:29 am by WillGeorge
Now Will, I know there is no such thing as having too many clamps, but my first question to Doug was about v-bagging. THis takes care of most of the clamping the way that I did it.
Doug, there are some really good pictures in this post for part of the process. I believe that staircase is for a boat (sorry: yacht, at that level). Don't know if they're applicable, but I think you might enjoy reading and seeing.
Thanks all for the answers so far. To clear this up I am thinking spiral. As to the cost I figure it will not be cheep, but I hope to have a nicer stair for the same cost. I love the old fashioned "cast iron" stairs but they cost a fortune, so the other option is the cheaper look that I don't really like or built it myself out of wood. Being as this is in a library going to an office and all of it will be wood (as soon as I built the cabinets, which will be as soon as I finish the trim, that I will have done once the kitchen is finished. Oh did I say I still need to decide on the type of wood for the book case, and while I am at it I need to do something with the fireplace? :) )
Right now I am just trying to decide if this is practical or not. I mean if it is really hard to do or all but impossible. Then I need to figure out if it is cost prohibitive (assuming it is doable) But I do not plan to even start this until next fall.
As for the space, yea I understand that, I have tried to explain that to more then one client over the years (arch design) and eventually the house will have two stairs one "normal" and this one. And the house was designed for the stair so the support is already in.
Doug
Doug,
There is a very famous wooden spiral staircase that was made by the sculptor and woodworker Wharton Esherick:
http://www.gophila.com/C/Things_to_Do/211/Philadelphia_CultureFiles/210/U/The_Wharton_Esherick_Studio_Museum/39.html
It's not far from Philadelphia; if you want to see it, make sure to call ahead because I believe that you have to reserve a spot, and tours are only given on Sundays.
-Andy
I have never made one by hand but I have assisted in the installation of a wooden one made by the following company. It went together without any issues.
http://www.theironshop.com/home_01.htm
No I do not work for them..
I mention because the product was well made and installed easily (In relative terms).. I do not know what the stairway cost.
They have a interactive program you can use to design a staircase..
Just a thought.
Having looked into this a bit most of these start at about 2000 and head up from thier, to get the height I need (About 10') take it to about 3000, add some things to make it look ok and it goes into the 4500 range. If you want one of those nice looking victorian jobs you see in the mags they are in the 6 to 7 grand range. thus I am looking for options.
Doug
DougMeyer.
You can do it but it will take you a lot of time. Don't think about buying plans. Think about what you are trying to achieve. Work it out, figure out how high you want your steps to be and then divide that into the height you need. If it comes out wrong (it will) just adjust the height of each step in order for it to come out right.. next figure out where you want to end up, work it backwards and that will tell you where to start. If you are unsure make a scale model from something easy to work with something like balsa wood/ even foamboard
I buy my wood very cheaply and yet I would expect a nice one that size would take north of 350 to 400 bd.ft. so materials will amount to at least $160 and go up to $1000 at my cost, if you buy retail you could expect to spend between $2000 and $4000 just for materials..
Tell me what you'd like to achieve, something plain or elaborate? rustic or sophisticated?
I can then take a guess as to time involved and material costs..
I've seen a wonderful one created in a day by a log home builder who really knew what he was doing to a horrible nightmare that took the better part of three years of spare time work.
Just so you understand I have a buddy who does nothing but draw stairs and provide details for them.. a basic circular stairs takes about $1800 for him to draw up..
Frenchy in truth I am not sure what I want to do. Being in the design business I tend to work a problem from both sides in that I tend to think about what I want on one side and what I can do (with resources, time and money available) on the other. And someplace I will figure out what I am going to do. In this case I am looking at if I even want to try this or not. It seams like it should not be that hard, but then again it looks like the kind of thing that could be a real night mare. So that is why I was wondering what others have found out. Heck I am not even sure what look I am going for at this point. The house is a bit of an eclectic mess. In fact it is what I call (for lack of a better term) a cross between loft style and a modern take on the old arts and craft, but using more modern types of materials in place of all the old oak and such. So it has a bit of a hand crafted flavor just using more industrial materials.
I would not even mind a combo of wood and metal, in fact that would fit in very well, so this is one of the things I have been thinking about. I just don't want to pay 2 or 3 grand and get a very plan blah looking "modern" staircase.
Oh well we will have to think on this. In truth the hard part to me looks to be the center column and the stair interface. The railing looks complicated but it seams pretty straight forward.
Doug
Doug,
I would think more about what you want to achieve than how to make this at first..
Is this stair a potential crown jewel in the house where real quaity could enhance the whole house or is it a simple way get to the next level piece where costs (time and material) are important. If it's the latter then purchase a prefab and move on to something of importance.. If it's the former then consider your options..
One really nice look was achieved when someone put a large tree in place and drilled holes for the stairs to go into in a sprial around the log.. the tail of the step was fit into the holes and then lag bolted from the other side. Once each step was in place and tightened down he went at it with a chain saw and leveled everything back up, and trimmed each stair to the right shape and set back. That way he didn't worry if it went in a little crooked. He ran up and down it during construction and let everything dry out.. periodically retightening the lag bolts as everything dried. After a year or so he put plugs in the lag bolt holes to hide them and sanded the whole assembly and varnished it. I doubt he had a days worth of work initially and I know most of the stuff was free or near free.
There are those here who would be able to build a formal circular stairs and charge north of $50,000. and even at that price it's worth it..
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