CLAMPS: sale on Jorgenson Cabinetmasters
forestgirl
| Posted in Power Tools and Machinery on
Another goodie gleaned while lurking elsewhere. On Friday, 12AM EST (that’s late Thurs. nite), Woodcraft is having a sale on the Jorgenson Cabinetmaster clamps (similar to Bessey K’s). Incredible prices, limited to 4 each per person. Click here for the link!
I have NO K-bodies of any sort in my clamp collection, so am going to jump on this opportunity, and get Nick to order 4 also. Eight?! Yipeeeeeee!!!!!
forestgirl — you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can’t take the forest out of the girl 😉
Edited 10/15/2003 1:48:24 PM ET by forestgirl
Edited 10/15/2003 5:33:01 PM ET by forestgirl
Replies
I saw that yesterday and made sure to stick my name on the mailing list for renotification, i can't wait to get some of those Cabinet masters at that price.
The only problem I see with the email notification is that the sale starts at midnight, LOL. Don't want 'em to all be gone when I get there. Fortunately, since I'm on the left coast, I can do my orders at 9pm and still have time for evening TV.
Have put a big sticky on the computer "CLAMPS -- FRI PM!!!" forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Having been through a few "Jorgy orgies" this year, you'd do well to hit it hard and fast. My guess is that they will all be gone within about 15-20 mins. I know this sounds quick, but with each successive Jorgy sale, more people become aware of what a great deal it is and of how quickly they go. The web site may get jammed with traffic.
And forestgirl, you may want to change that sticky note to Thursday pm. I believe the sale starts at the midnight between Thursday and Friday, not Friday and Saturday.
Edited 10/15/2003 3:37:27 PM ET by COLEMAN654
I quickly edited my first post to read 12AM Friday, which is just after 11:59pm Thurs. You're right, I need to change my stickie note. Now I'm confused, but then that's nothing new. Thanks for giving me a Click 'n Clack "dope slap." I needed it!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
There is no 12am or 12pm. Am is ante meridian; pm is post meridian.
Each day has 2 12am's. One is a 000 hours. The other at 2400 hours.
Some times are more difficult than others.
All I know is, my VCR and alarm clocks consider 12:00 dark-time as AM, LOL! forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
One of my VCR's displays "_ _:_ _" and the other flashes "SET TIME" :o)
Thats a reasonable size question. You would think from the advertising out there that Bessey makes 24" and 25". I've seen it both ways many times.
When I bought my first set of 4 K-body's this summer from Rockler I wanted the 24". They were on backorder, I was itching so I went for the 31" or 32" (Hell, I don't know anymore). Sure enough I needed the larger size just a couple of weeks later.
Size does matter! :o)
And potato chip bags claim the half bag of air is for protection.
Enjoy, Roy
Yep, I never trust numbers in ads. Although, last night I went back and looked at the ad again, and it says specifically that the 24" 36" etc. are jaw openings.
Haven't set your VCRs yet, eh? Glad to hear you don't have any "compulsive behavior" problems, LOL!
Man, I hope the Woodcraft web site is working tonight. I couldn't even get in a few minutes ago, and it was reallllllly slow last night.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Thanks forestgirl,
First the PC sander, now the Jorgenson Clamps. I'm on the right hand coast so I'll just have to stay up a little later Thursday night. I've been wanting to buy some of these clamps for a while, at these prices I can't afford not to buy them.
Thanks for the info, but 12AM EST? Were still on EDT till the 26th.
So what time do we all jump!
Wow! Great prices, 55% off, so what if they don't match my K bodies.
Enjoy, Roy
Jamie,
I don't know if this is what you meant but you can order 4 of each size per person for a total of 12.
TDF
FG
Thanks for the tip. When ToolCrib cleared the same 24", 36" and 48" a month ago, they were sold in a few days. I was going to order 4 24". I have 4 30", there most popular size. I do not see them anywhere at this point. Not sure what the story is.
The 30" is the most versatile, but that is a fantastic price. You will love them if you get them. I prefer over the Bessey as they have a sliding foot at the end that allows you to sit it on a clamping table and the rear jaw slides back and forth without having to hold and lift the clamp. Quite a convenience. If you are glueing something large alone (like a work-bench..ha..ha..) that is a major plus in my eyes.
If anyone reading knows where I can get 30", please e-mail. I want more and will pay full price if necessary.
Regards to the "Alert Lady of the Forest"...
sarge..jt
Sarge, does the 48" actually have a 48" capacity. I'm really struggling with which ones to order. It would seem to me that other clamps could substitute for the 24" ones pretty easily. I always envision the cabinet-style clamp being used on pretty substantial pieces of furniture. I was thinking of getting 4 36's and 4 48's (or 8 of each).
However, if the 48"ers don't actually have a 48" capacity, I'll get 24" and 36" and save up for the bigger Bessey K's. I dunno....forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
JAMIE: ToolDoc takes his litl Forest Friend on the side & explains 48" Jaw opening means just that 48" in plain terms yup 48" fits between the jaws..LOL ok got it?? soo go with your plan get the 36" & 48" ones its a good price go for it..
Hope that helped,I hate seenin confused Women..<G>
ToolDocProud Member of the Delta & Klein Tradesman Club & Milwaukee HD Club & Knots Bad Boys & Girls Club..
A Non ~ Member of the Knots Bandsaw Guru Club..
Forest Girl,
Actually, the buyer is limited to four clamps per size. Three sizes available - twelve clamps to add to your collection!
Dan Kornfeld, Owner/President - Odyssey Wood Design, Inc.
Oh Wise First Lady of the Forest: Thanks for the Heads up,I had already seen the Advance Notice bout this Sale over at WoodNet..those Guys are always on the Prowl for Bargains..when Tool Crib had there Big Clamp Sale it was like a Orgy of clamp buying..Guess this is going to turn into a Cluster too..Hey Good Luck on trying to get some..Me IM already stocked up on Jorrgys from the Local Big Lots Saleathon..LOL...I bought every Blasted Clamp they had in 3 Local stores..<G> Glad Im not the only one scourin the Forums for Bargains..its a tough Job,But some of us have to do it...
Take Care Little Buddy... ToolDoc
Proud Member of the Delta & Klein Tradesman Club & Milwaukee HD Club & Knots Bad Boys & Girls Club..
A Non ~ Member of the Knots Bandsaw Guru Club..
Edited 10/15/2003 11:46:46 PM ET by TOOLDOC
Tom, Dan, thanks for providing the small print alert! I didn't really read very carefully did I?? Sheesh, between myself and Nick, I could pick up 24 clamps!!! Holy Smokes, not sure the wallet can handle that!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Jamie: was just yacking with a few guys from over at WoodNet--there all buying or shall I say trying to order Clamps now..LOL..
ToolDoc
EDIT==> they Sold out in a matter of less than 45 minutees..LOL
Proud Member of the Delta & Klein Tradesman Club & Milwaukee HD Club & Knots Bad Boys & Girls Club..
A Non ~ Member of the Knots Bandsaw Guru Club..
Edited 10/17/2003 12:54:36 AM ET by TOOLDOC
Wow. I wasn't going to order any clamps, but I just visited the web site about five minutes ago, and they were already sold out. Hope all of you were able to get your orders in...
Man! That site was Slow! About 40 minutes.
I have an order number, I hope its true.
4 24" in the bag, I hope.
I'm tired.
I feel old.
Go Yanks! But I'm an O's fan! The under 500 club!
Only caught alittle of the game, I was in the shop waiting for midnight for some strainge reason.
Good night all!
Enjoy, Roy
Humph! Now I know who got my clamps, ROFL!!! Sorry to hear you're on the right coast for this sale. I'm beat, and here it was only 9:45 or so when I finally got done!
Can't wait for 'em to get here. Now I can finally justify building a clamp rack! Cheers!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
On the website at 12:05 eastern, ordered 4 of each, got a confirmation that my order was accepted.
Twenty minutes later I got a "confirming" email showing all of my order lines as "Cancelled".
So much for that sale.
-M.
Uh-Oh, that's scary. Guess I'd better check my email. (At least I got a good night's sleep last night, thinking I'd gotten mine. Given how much work that ordering process was, I'd have been real grumpy to get bad news before bed!)forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Hope you were first in line for the clamps. There is a kind of dark side to this story though, from what I have heard.
Irwin has purchased the organization that made the Jorgensons and is taking them off the market as Jorgensons and reintroducing them as Irwins. They apparently are giving markdown allowances to the retailers to get them out of stock so the Irwins can fill the empty spots on the shelves. The first clamp I ever bought was a Jorgenson and there have been many that have joined the family over the years. I hate to see such a well respected name disappear.
It will be interesting to see if they continue this practice with other products such as Vice-Grip.
John
Dr. Watson, where'd you get your info about this acquisition? According to Don C. in another thread, this is not accurate, and I haven't been able to track anything down on it.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
I heard this from the manager of a local woodworker's store that had just attended his company's annual managers meeting and 30 some odd vendors were there including Irwin. He had no reason to give me inaccurate information and I believe he stated the situation to the best of his knowledge. Maybe he misunderstood. I know him well enough to feel certain he didn't intentionally lie.
At the time I was buying 4 - 24" and 4 - 36" Cabinet Masters at a great price so I went away happy. Since I had seen only good reviews for these clamps, his explanation seemed more feasable than them discontinuing the product. After all, they have not been out too long have they?
Quite frankly, I hope he was wrong. Irwin (NewellRubbermaid, Inc.) has made a few acquisitions in the tool area; Record/Marples, Lenox Blades, Speedbor, etc. Their financial results have not been promising lately. I have seen a few post on Knots asking what is going on with Record.
Maybe next week I can do a little research to clear this up. I would be interested to know more about what is going on.
John
Hope you can get more info, John, it'd be good to know for sure. BTW, it wasn't that the product was being discontinued (hypothetically), it was that they were changing the sizes. Who knows....hopefully we'll find out.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
FG,
This clamp thing is driving me crazy...went over to Woodcraft at about 2:30 pm to pick up some star handles....they had a ton of Jorge's there and the staff is all eyeing it cause they can't buy any till tomorrow. I did not even want any..but I bought 4-36" just cause...after last nights game I needed to feel like a winner...instead of a whiner...lol
Chack this explination out
http://www.forums.woodnet.net/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=handtools&Number=658118&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=all&vc=1
I'm one of the many--I'm sure--who did not get in on time for the dea. What a shame!
Thinking about it, however, I suppose that now that Woodcraft has our personal information they must have come out of ahead--regardless of any loss they may have taken up by the sale. What will they do w/ my home address, email address and any other information now that I've had to register in order to purchase (unsuccesfully) those damned clamps.
Here is an excerpt from Woodcraft's Privacy Policy -- anytime you access a web site and are worried about what they might do with any information you provide, you should read the privacy policy. I have added emphasis below, and the email address they refer to is [email protected] . [PS: here's the link to their privacy page: http://shop.woodcraft.com/Woodcraft/assets/html/privacy.asp?Gift=false&GiftID=
PPS: Hard for me to imagine being on any more tool-junk-mail lists than I already am. Comes with the territory, and gives me somethin' to read at night. They clearly state they don't share phone numbers, and that's my biggie.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Edited 10/17/2003 8:03:13 PM ET by forestgirl
Edited 10/17/2003 8:06:42 PM ET by forestgirl
Oooh! Oooh! I need 4 24" ones! How much is the shipping? ROFL, Oh well. The only way I can go to a B&M store is to get on the ferry and fight the Seattle traffic, it would take about 4 hours... something I'm waaaaayyyyy to lazy to do.
BG, you are a winner, always! Don't need no stinkin' clamps!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
To all my friends, I got my automated shipping notice in the email. Yeaaaaaahhhhhhh!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
I thought I'd wait to see other posts before sending in mine but I'll not wait any more. I got to the site about 12:05 and went for it. The second page had my order at $455 worth of clamps. It had me down for about a dozen of one of the sizes. It took me a couple tries to edit the order, and then to the "secure" section where they recognized me as someone on the other side of the country. The second time I was confused with someone in So Cal (gave me names and addresses of both parties). When I finally got all that sorted out, they began to cancel some of the sizes, and before I could remove the cancelled items, all were gone.
I went into this half heartedly, knowing that I am well tuned into the clamps I have. It's the lack of security I was exposed to that got my attention, as I am a big online shopper. An e-mail to customer service was brushed off as if it were no big deal.
Anyway, congrats to those who scored.
Richard
For anyone that has got clamps coming and are not satisfied with the defective Cabinet-Masters, I will offer you $10 apiece until I run out of money and pay the shipping to my shop. That would help take a bite out of the loss.
Just in case they were not to turn out defective, actually work and you decide to keep them.... Well, ENJOY!! he..he..
sarge..jt
Despite telling myself ALL day yesterday that I didn't need any more clamps, (yeah, right, as if that's really possible) I jumped in at 12:03 am ET last night and got into the same creeping site as everyone else. In the best of times, their site is SLOW, but last night, I think every clamp crazed woodworker in the US was trying to get into the site. It took me about three tries before I finally got an order to go through. All in all, about 35-40 minutes. I've been burned by a florida based mail order tool supplier on a "limited supply" special before, so I figured I had a 50-50 chance at best. I took an early lunch and drove over to my local store (only five minutes from my office) and snagged four of the 36" as a hedge. There were a couple other people there, but not the stampede I was led to expect. I hadn't gotten a confirmation on my order, so I stopped by the store again at the end of the day and was told that they sold out by 11 am, about 90 minutes after I had been there. I just logged into my mail account and found a shipping confirmation on the order I placed last night which came as a great surprise since I figured I had missed out since the website had SOLD OUT plastered over the sale announcement by the time I logged in this morning. I'm glad to have the new clamps on the way, those pipe clamps have done their duty. Congrats to all the other folks who managed to be lucky enough to get through. Hope you enjoy the new clamps!
Wild thread, ain't it. I Love it.
I'm thunking, I MAY (MAY) have gotten my order in last night. I have a printed conformation from the web page, but no emails. I never registered at all, hit quantity and went for checkout, never provided my email address. All seemed cool. My bank (on the web and slow posting real info) shows no record of any transactions yesterday, Woodcraft or the quick stop I made at Giant Food on the way home from work. Miles said 50/50, I have a conformation and thats what I'm still thinking. I'm hope-ing.
Thanks FG for the tip, and congrats to all that scored!
When Sarge runs out of money, I'll take over. Hell, lets play ebay, I'll pay 12 bucks.
Not giving Woodcraft my email address may be a plus. I hate it when Rockler sends me an html email that takes several minutes to download. I have news for them, every one of them has been deleted unread since the first one. I'll get my web pages on the web and not in my email.
Forward! Cut wood!, er Tomorrow! Nap time!
Enjoy, Roy
Roy, I know what you mean about "nap time." Think I'm goin' to bed early tonight.
Rockler: Why dontcha click on the link at the bottom of their email to "leave" the list. No reason you have to keep receiving them. I don't ever do this with spam from people/companies I don't know, but Rockler's legit, so you should have no worry opting out.
I hope you get your clamps too! What a riot this was. The Adjustable Clamp guy over at Woodnet said they and the distributors (Tool Crib, Woodcraft, etc.) had absolutely no idea the sales were going to be this popular. The sale was to celebrate ACC's 100th anniversary, they took all the orders from the distributors some time back and manufactured to order. Zillions of clamps, it sounds like.
I've written him and invited him to stop by, but he probably didn't get the message before he left for the weekend. Maybe he'll come by next week. forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
It appears the info I got was way off base. I felt that an explanation was important so I went by the store and the manager told me he put together his conclusion from separate conversations at his meeting. Sounds like so much BS to me. I am more than a little miffed and embarassed!
Is there any doubt that Adjustable Clamp got a lot of publicity for their Jorgensen Cabinet Masters? Good for them!
BTW - I spent the last little while comparing the Cabinet Masters I bought to the Bessys I already had and can find no major differences. I like the end stop/support. It keeps the clamps level and can be removed so they can be used as spreaders. They are both great clamps.
"...comparing the Cabinet Masters I bought to the Bessys I already had...." Ok, keep flaunting that clamp supply of yours! I feel like a 6-year-old a week before Christmas -- I can't wait!!!! My very first K-style clamps, and 8 of them no less! Too funny.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
It's amazing how this thread keeps going and going. I live in northern CA. and 6 months ago a private company finished laying fiber optics in the neighborhood. 2 months ago I convinced my wife that I would die a slow death if I didn't get fiber optic broadband. It has been pretty amazing, but I can honestly say that last night it paid for itself twice over. I'll admit, the Woodcraft site was bogged down, but I was through the finish line in 5 minutes. I can only imagine the wait on a dial-up connection. After reading all the horror stories I wasn't sure about my order until I received my shipping notice this afternoon. This will be my first go around with cabinet masters so I'm looking forward to the arriving package. I got 4 of each size.
P.S. I beleive at the beginning of this upcomming year Bessey's patent they have on the K-body runs out. Lots of knock-offs are going to be flooding the market, and from this ordeal I can see it's a crazy market. It'll be interesting to see if another company builds a quality clamp, or if we'll just see cheap imitations. I've been told that Bessey still wont be lowering their prices.
Ryan aKa Norm..
your experience was almost exactly like mine- was the wrong name/address in california someone named John Peck or Beck by any chance? also, when i went to checkout, my order had a bunch of router bits in it. then after straightening that out, every time i tried to go thru to final checkout, it would give me a "your basket is empty" notice. AAAAAAARGH!
finally quit in disgust after a half hour and sent several nastygrams to their customer service yesterday.
m
Based on what Clampman said over on Woodnet ..there are some interesting lessons to be learned.
Jorgenson was out to do a nice thing...offer us a discount to celebrate the 100 years. However, they also kept their employees busy in a down market...its cheaper to give up profit than lay off tallented employees...you don't see a lot of companies doing that anymore...hooray!!
Second, the internet was a much more powerful tool than the local Woodcraft in marketing the concept. We have seen this before with E-bay and most recently with the Democratic canidate form VT. Is this a meanful trend that needs to be exploited more?
Third, with an easily understood product, ie. clamps, the market is extremely price sensitive...good news for the Chinese maybe?
Fourth, and what all are griping about, the industries understanding of the woodworker marketplace...and the pent up demand, is really quite weak. Both Jorgenson and Woodcraft messed up.
BG, I'm with you throughout your above message until the last sentence. I don't see where Jorgensen messed up. They produced clamps to the orders of their distributors, and those orders were huge, so I really don't see where Jorgensen caused any problems.
BTW, have you read the message from the Customer Service Manager for the company (click on my link) that Hitter alerted us to? It provides 1st-hand info (albeit in rosy terms) about the history of this sale.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
FG,
Yes, I did read the post you linked to. But I still claim that Jorge and Woodcraft messed up in their ability to determine the demand. Although they, perhaps, tried their best to avoid what is happening....its not enough to say we gave Woodcraft as many as they wanted....Woodcraft has a number of product lines and tries to project demand on all those lines. Jorge, on the other hand, has fewer lines and should understand the demand and price sensitivity of the customer...marketing 101 so to speak... Jorge, if they did not agree with Woodcraft's projections could have said we'll back you up with additional stock if you run out with your on-line sales....
Now the Chinese will come in with a look-a-like for $10 bucks and take the market away....and Sarge will be out $100,000....sigh, poor Sarge
BG: Hey Buddy don't be feelin sorry for poor old SARGE.. cause he gots money up the WAZZOO..LMAO..
ToolDocProud Member of the Delta & Klein Tradesman Club & Milwaukee HD Club & Knots Bad Boys & Girls Club..
A Non ~ Member of the Knots Bandsaw Guru Club..
BG
Would you buy a Chinese made clamp over a Jorgy if the holder of the Jorgy reduced retail and sold at their $10 cost to recover the initial capital investment?
And what you don't know is ToolDoc backed the venture with his collateral. That wouldn't be a big loss. $100,000 to him is "pocket change". He burns that much each year just lighting Cuban cigars. ha..ha..
I think I might design my own Chinese clamp. To get me in the mood, think I'll run and grab some Chinese take-out. I don't use those chincy Chinese chop-sticks thought, I prefer two Jorgy's held in the right hand in the same manner. More clamping power. <o)
Have a nice evening...
sarge..jt
Sarge, Tooldoc
I'm not sure which of you is the most loaded...
Ya got Sarge down there in Atlanta with his cocktail lounge and parking meters...
Ya got Tooldoc up in Poke-in-the-Nose making heart shaped beds and hot tubs for all the kiddies to buy...
BG: ROARrrrrrrr You won't find me making anything as Nice as those Heart shaped Beds & HotTubs for those DAMN Tourists..LOL still trying to train all the Black Bears in the area to Eat Em on sight..<G>
ToolDocProud Member of the Delta & Klein Tradesman Club & Milwaukee HD Club & Knots Bad Boys & Girls Club..
A Non ~ Member of the Knots Bandsaw Guru Club..
After reading all the messages about orders being cancelled, etc., I almost feel bad about this...
Went down to the local Woodcraft yesterday, cuz I needed some stain. Not many people in the store at all, started bs-ing w/one of the employees about the Jorgy-thing. He said when the store opened, he couldn't believe the crowd waiting at the door. Then he tells me they still had a lot left. What? Points over by the table saws where they had big stacks of them.
So I picked up my stain and left.
With four 48" clamps as well. Wasn't really in the budget, and I wasn't going to order any online, but those things were just too cheap not to buy.
RR
I got my order shipped but I called the local WC yesterday just to see if they had any. Yep, but they said the sale was one day and the price was back to retail. You got lucky as I found out WC is franchised and that was a local store decision to sell them at the sale price the day after.
Have af good day...
sarge..jt
BG
Of course it's Doc who gets the IRS's attention first. But either way, if things go sour in your area you always have a job waiting. Just depends if you like Philly Cheese-Steak or Southern Fried Chicken and barbeque better. If you go south just bring all those planes your accumulating. Those tables have to be re-flattened often as the stiletto (sp) heels wear them un-even. he...he..
sarge..jt
BG
Well said. I called WoodCraft local this morning and they still had some in stock. The bad news is at the regular price. I had four my company purchased for me at regular price. I hate to spend $36 on a clamp, but if I need more of the Jorgy's I will if that's the fair-market price. They're still a few dollars cheaper than the Bessey and I feel the clamp is that good from my year's experience with it.
Have to agree with FG on Jorgy messing up. I think what may have happened is a new market has been created for those that only have used Bessey. The Bessey's are great clamps, but they are a few dollars more and they don't have the tail stop that acts as a base for table-top use. Through the mass movement of info on inter-net sites like Knots and Wood-Net, a lot of people are going to discover what some already know. A lot of user knowledge has been brought to light in these sites. This knowledge will lead some to try the Jorgy instead of Bessy in the future. And it did not cost ACC a penny in advertising. Even thought not intentional, I feel it's the bottom line. That's my take. Others opinion may vary and that's what makes living in a "free-speech" country great. ha..ha..
Have a good week-end...
sarge..jt
Edited 10/18/2003 1:16:41 PM ET by SARGE
Mitch,
If your name begins with an m, we were probably crossed at their site. I had a mitch m..... in NC as my I.D. The next time I had someone in Pasadena as my I.D.
I can live without the clamps ok but their attention to the security issues disturbs me.
I'll continue to monitor these two threads and keep after their customer service for some understanding.
Thanks for your response,
Richard
that is weird- you probably did get mine! i am definitely a "mitch m" in NC.
i've given them a couple blistering missives over not so much the slowness of the site and how fast they sold out, but how badly their system malfunctioned.
m
I still have a question that may be quite pertinent: Had you registered (with a user name and a password) before you began the ordering process, and if so were you Logged In before you started the ordering process?? I'm not trying to lay blame, just figure out if there might be a difference between the way the data was being handled, and it would help the webmaster to know.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Edited 10/18/2003 11:11:52 AM ET by forestgirl
FG,
I have purchased from Woodcraft before on the site and this time asked for the notice of sale to be sent to my e-mail address, so I know there is some kind of cookie to identify my computer. For this purchase I used the link that you provided (thanks). I made my choices from that page and pressed the buy now (?) button. The next page had my order at $455 worth of clamps and forstner bits(?), way more than I wanted.
After getting that part straightened out I went to check out, into the "secure" section. This is where I kept getting identified as someone else (from their cookie ?). I really don't know that much about computers but I'm disappointed that someone's personal info was sent to me. Was mine sent to someone else?
Anyway, I'm not heartbroken over not getting the clamps. Truthfully, I like getting more like 2000# pressure from pipe clamps.
Thanks for your interest and if there is more you would like to know I'll try my best to provide.
Thanks again,
Richard
Richard, thanks much for the info. I agree that the mix-up in identities and exposure of information is most worrisome, and for those who want to get the sincere attention of customer service at Woodcraft, that lapse holds the most leverage potential, so I speak not just to you, but to others also here.
I wandered over to Woodcraft just now hoping that they were a member of one of the web privacy assurance groups. The only affliation I could find was the Direct Market Association; went to their web site, thinking there might be a place to report to them. Nothing really appropriate; however, there is a link to the Better Business Bureau, where a complaint can be filed. I see this possibility as a negotiating point to mention to customer service at WC and get someone responsible and responsive to correspond with. Here's the link: http://www.bbb.org/
Cookies and ordering, etc.: This is total speculation on my part, but here goes. There is a "Log In" button at the top of the home page. I am theorizing that by logging in before starting to shop, the whole shopping spree is firmly connected to a Customer Number that would have been assigned when the user first registered. It is possible to shop at WC without registering, or even if you are registered, to shop without logging in. My guess (guess) is that by pre-registering, and logging in before starting to shop, the order is anchored to a customer number and less likely to get mixed up in whatever floating data base is functioning for those who are shopping simply as "Guest."
Even if this theory were accurate, it in no way excuses "the system" (and WC) from having your personal information relayed to another person. I would think that the techies would no of the potential of that happening under extremely high volume, in which case it should have been required that shoppers at the clamp sale pre-register and log in before beginning their trip. Come to think of it, the potential for that privacy lapse probably exists under any high-traffic situation, so WC should either fix it or require the reg and log-in at all times. Hmmmmm, something to think about.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Dr Watson
I have used the Bessey's also. They are very powerful and the jaws are square like the Jorgy's. I agree that both are great clamps. I prefer the Jorgy's for two reasons. The little end-clamp you mentioned which supports the clamp on a table-top allowing the rear jaw to move without having to hold and lift it. Second reason is the Jorgy's at retail were about $4 or $5 cheaper than the Bessey's up front. When buying four or more at a time, that difference pays shipping.
Have a good evening...
sarge..jt
Roy
$13..... This means price-war. ha..ha..
All kiddin' aside, it is amazing to see the demand for the clamps. Knowing what I know now, if I had the opportunity to purchase 10,000 Jorgy's at $10 a clamp, I would be at my bank early tomorrow morning to sign the loan for the $100,000. All could be sold at $20 bucks a pop plus shipping over the course of a year. Probably a lot less than that.
I hope you get your clamps. I got a confirmation on e-mail this morning and a shipping confirmation later in the day. I have never ordered anything on-line before, but it would not let me enter purchase till I entered my e-mail address. At least that's what I think I remember as I was frustrated at that point. Good luck with the order.
Have a good week-end Roy...
sarge..jt
Wow, that stuff about having other people's names and addresses pop up is worrisome, to say the least. Had you registered and logged in, or were you going through the shopping process as a yet-to-be-registered person?
There's an awful lot of feedback here if Woodcraft cared to listen.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Here's more than you probably ever wanted to know about who makes/sells clamps: "Jorgensen" clamps are manufactured by Adustable Clamp Co., Chicago, Ill (http://www.adustableclamp.com). According to another post, it's a privately held company. Newellrubbermaid (http://www.newellrubbermaid.com), which is a publicly-traded corporation listed on the NYSE, now sells clamps and other tools under the Irwin brand name. It's Irwin Group inludes QuickGrip clamps, vice grips, Lennox bandsaw blades, to name a view. The Irwin Group includes Record and Marples products. I believe that Newellrubbermaid acquired all of these brands by purchasing American Tools, which was the prior parent corporation of Record, QuickGrip clamps, Vice Grips, and other brands. Other manufacturers and/or distributors of clamps are: James Morton Group of James Morton American Clamping (http://www.jamesmorton.com), which is the U.S. sales and marketing company for Bessey clamps, made in Germany by Bessey und Sohn; WMH Tool Group, the privately-owned company that owns Jet Tools and Powermatic and which sells clamps under the "Columbian" brand (see http://www.jettools.com); and Westzler Clamp Co. (http://www.wetzler.com), which still makes clamps in the U.S., according to its web site.
JD, wow, you're smart! Seriously, thanks for the info -- I'm so clueless about corporate things -- just makes my head hurt, but I like finding about the ins and outs of an item I actually use.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Hey, thanks forestgirl.
Missed the PC router, PC sander.....
Maybe, just maybe. (Sound like the California Lottory Ads, LOL)
Len
It says:
Orders are limited to 4 clamps per size.
Yep, Tom and Dan got me straightened out on that back on #8 or so. I'll be going for 4 36" and 4 48"forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
FG,
I hate to say this...but I dislike my 48" K bodies....too heavy and unmanagable, for the longer clamps I prefer the pony's. I really want the 24" and 36" for draws and cabinets...maybe it's just me...
BG,
Sometimes you just need a big one. Buy 4 of each. The price is just too good.
TDF
Oh, BG, please don't apologize. I need all the input available before 8:55 pm PDT! Am I succumbing to a "Norm" thing? Do the Ponies work as well for keeping big things square? I guess I was going to go for them because of the huge price difference at that length, and figuring there must be a bookcase or entertainment center or something like that in my future.
Nick had the nerve to go hunting 2 days early, so I have to stick to the 4/size thing (instead of 8). I'll check in when I get home and see which way your advice might lead me (I always reserve the right to ignore advice, ROFL!!)
Hmmmmmmm, the way the wind's blowing here, there may not be any computering power available at 9pm. Yikes!
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Edited 10/16/2003 7:55:26 PM ET by forestgirl
FG
As others have stated, the size is the jaw opening. For instance, the 30" I have will clamp to 30". The actual lenght of the entire thing is about 34" or 36". The bar is longer to accomodate the jaw being able to open to that width.
If you don't have any, go for the 48" and 36". You can always slide the jaws down to a smaller size. But, you can't make a 24" clamp work on a 25" wide glue-up. The 30" are ideal size to start, but you will need longer on ocassion. If I didn't have any, I would go long first and then come back and fill in the short for the above reasons. These things are super heavy. They have some major clamp power and they are square. The jaws allowed me to glue a 3 1/4" work-bench top with room to spare. I think they are 4" deep.
I hate sales where everyone is lined up at the door ready to trample each other to get what is available. At this price though, better stay out of my way as the savage beast does come to the surface for certain instances. Clamps are an instance that might arouse the beast. ha..ha..
Good luck.... are your fingers on the key-board ready.. if so us slow typers are SOL! < G >
sarge..jt
I'm with you, Sarge, when it comes to those "stampede" sales -- I never go! But since I can do this one from the comfort of my keyboard and sooooo much is at stake, here I am. I'm logged in and warmed up, just waiting for the magic hour to arrive. Gonna get me one of them there $5 ogee bits too.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
To the lady of the forest:thank you!
I live in Maryland, at 11.59 pm the price for the Jorgensen clamps was still the regular one. At 12.00 midnight the prices changed and I immediately placed my order, 39 minutes later I confirmed the purchase. I believe half the country must have logged on Woodcraft, to go from one screen to the next one it would take on the average 5-7 minutes.
There must be a better way next time.
John Cabot
You are right there must be a better way. I was on a high speed line, did the same thing at the same time - order had 5 extra items that came from I know not where. Resend, it locked up - and at 20 minutes a screen comes up they are all sold out. I would really be curious as to what their stock on hand was. Glad I am traveling on the West fcoast and did not lose any sleep over it!! And then the Yankees had to win also - that was probably the curse..............
Dale
I live in Maryland too. I logged on at 12:15, all sold out already. So back to bed I went! I hit my local store this morning and bought 4 of each size!!! No big rush or crowd either. Probably took less then 10 minutes in the store. Of course the store is 50 minutes away. Anyhoo - I got my clamps!
Randy
FG
It took me 41 minutes to set up an account and get a confirmation on 4 -36" orange thangs. Shipping to my distination was $9.90 ground surface. The four won't weight 70 lbs. but close, they are heavy. Like I stated, the little foot on the end that allows the rear jaw ot slide is great. You can set them on an assembly table and use them like you would a clamp rack with that feature.
Forty-one minutes. Did I mention I hate computers. If I didn't like to talk to ya'll, I would take this d**n computer and place it in a Jorgy and set the jaws so tight it would look like a hand scraper when I was done.
I don't get up-set often but as I stated, this computer stuff has a way of bringing out the neanderthal in one. Forty-one minutes.... I could have run a load of "moon-shine" from the N. Georgia mountains down to Atlanta in that amount of time.
Back to the cave to await arrival of the clamps or an e-mail saying they're sorry but they ran out b-4 my order was filled. Nah, I don't want to go there. I'm over it now. ha..ha..
BTW, thanks very much for the tip-off.. Ya da "Babe of the Forest".
Neanderthal Man < G >
Sarge, I have a feeling you just baaaaarrrely scraped through before they ran out! They were definitely out of the 24" clamps by that time. I'm glad I wandered around Woodcraft yesterday and noticed the "Log In" link -- went ahead and set up an account then, which saved me alot of grief tonight.
I love your fantasies about the computer -- will have to relay that one to Nick, as he gets real upset with our periodically.
Well, I guess I earned my keep around here this week, yes? Cool!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
FG
You're probably right. In 41 minutes I still got them. I wonder if there computer picks up the inventory of the closest store to your location and sells from that source to keep shipping cost down. There is a WoodCraft here in Atlanta. This is possible.
You have earned your keep. I was glad to get them even though I wanted more 30". I feel bad for those that found the cup-board empty. Since I already have some, kind of guilty to tell the truth. I see it as a fantastic buy as was the one at Tool-Crib, but a dis-appointment that not all that would like to have taken advantage of it couldn't do so.
Anyone out there that came away empty-handed, drop by and you can use mine. That's the best I can offer.
Regards to all... Enough of this for one nite. I'm beat!
sarge..jt
I feel for you MarkH. I was on at midnight got my 12, checked out, and had my credit card confirmed and I to was booted back and told "No clamps for you!!!" (last phrase must be said in heavy "soup n**i" accent" I must say that I understand the popularity of the sale but I am still p****d off at Woodcraft. Come on, 24 minutes??? They knew what was going to happen so they should have stocked up. I tried this morning to call individual stores and have them ship them to me but they wouldn't do that. Congrats to those who got them, best of luck in the future for those of us who didn't.
Edited 10/17/2003 10:20:08 AM ET by ECBNTMKR
Well, called in at midnight eastern, and got a We're closed message. So much for ordering through phone. Called at 8am and it was already sold out (much sooner apparently). Got on my boots and trekked to the local store. Cool BEANS! Got my dozen clamps. When I left there were about five dozen left at the STL store. They had 5 doz of each size at this store. About ten people there before the store opened.
Tom
Haven't been able to connect with my email, but have finished reading the posts here, and starting to GRRRRRRRROWWWWL. Is there any chance this understocked web-site sale is a simple ploy to get us into the real-life stores???? [Edit: obvious from info on web site that this is not the case. See my next message]
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Edited 10/17/2003 11:53:59 AM ET by forestgirl
Ok, no definitive "cancelled" email, and I checked the order history. The order is "Being processed by warehouse."
There's a "Special Offer" link for those who missed out on the clamps, with a note stating that they sold through a five-year supply in less than one hour. OK, so I guess they did "stock up." They offer a coupon for 10% off any purchase of $50 or more this month only, excludes power tools.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
I just called my local woodcraft caused i figured i would run up there at lunch time. They said they sold out a little after 7 this morning..
The rep told me as a "consolation" that the reaseon the clamps were on sale so cheaply was because "may of them were defective and would not open. He also said "they were not good clamps anyway" .
I cant imagine a salesman at store saying this even if it were true. Seem realy strange to me.
Hitter
If the salesman told you they weren't good clamps anyway, I would suggest you do business with Highland Hardware where they actually have people that know tools. I will say and defend that the salesman that told you that is "full of dung". ha..ha..
Off to work.. you guys have fun...
sarge..jt
I think he was saying that there was a bad batch of clamps.. That the company "jorganson" was trying to clean them out of the stores.
That logic makes some since to me. Sell the product and hope you dont get too many returns. Especially if as said in an earlierpost that they were going to change the name of the product anyway. They dont have to worry about a tarnished reputaion.
It would be nice to hear from people that actually got the clamps how well they worked out.
If Woodcraft is selling a known defective product, they better expect a whole bunch of returns and a tarnished reputation. Us Knotter's never forget, and we talk, archived on the Internet for life. I suspect that was just a dumb @$$ salesmen with too much coffee in his blood.
I turned my computer off right after ordering and posting last night (I mean this morning), I hope not to have a cancellation tonight when I get home. I'm interested in comparing them to the K bodies, refering to Sarges' comments.
I've been wanting to visit my local store since they opened a couple of years ago. Its on the other side of Washington in traffic hell territory.
Hit my first ever Big Lot Store this summer while on vacation in Williamsburg VA. No Clamps for You! Several other great buys. I'll have to visit the local store every so often.
Edit: Did it again! You have to spell Dumb @$$ as two words or you get an Knotter's email address.
Enjoy, Roy
Edited 10/17/2003 1:51:02 PM ET by ROY_INMD
Hitter
Sorry, just got home from part-time work and started a week's vacation. Tough life. < G >
I have confirmation that my clamps have been shipped. I will let you know how they work. I highly expect they will work the same as the other Jorgy Cabinet-Masters I already have and love with a passion. My personal dealings with WC have not been great. I have called to check out items on four occassions and have not yet spoken to anyone that has a clue about WW tools. Maybe it is a co-incidence. I have never said anything persoanlly about them one way or the other, as I know many buy there and seem to be content.
I suppose I am spoiled as I live within 30 minutes of Highland Hardware where the employees are all WW's. Some on the teaching level and most are accomplished locally. If they can't supply an answer, they get someone in the store who can to answer it properly. I don't expect anyone to know it all about every tool. But I do expect them to have a general knowledge.
An example. I called WC last about two months ago and asked the phone rep locally about their vises. I explained I was building a work-bench and needed front and tail vise hardware. I told him I wanted heavy duty hardware and what did they have that would fit that shoe. He wandered over to the vises with the phone and recommended the 7" Columbian Wood-Workers vise at $19.95. End of conversation as I told him that sounded good and I would be right down. < G >
Just my take on what I have encounted with the people I have encounted at a local store level. IMO, they could grab more market share if the sales employee's were a bit more saavy than the ones I have dealt with so far. I hope this is just local and everyone else gets great service. I'm not complaining, just pointing out what I have experienced. They have the right to run their business as they see fit. I have the right to buy elsewhere, so it all works out in the wash. ha..ha..
Thanks for the link on the other site to clampman. I thought Irwin had taken over and wondered what was going on. That post he made went a long way to explain the situation.
Regards...
sarge..jt
Edited to correct typo or what-ever you call it. he...
Edited 10/17/2003 11:42:33 PM ET by SARGE
Sounds to me like the salesman was just trying to cut the griping before it got too intense. That's a made-up rationale if I've ever heard one. There is a trick, I've heard (Sarge?) to opening them up under some circumstances. Don's theory that they were overstocked on these discontinued sizes makes more sense to moi.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
FG,
No, the clamps are fine..best to help square up..but i like the pony's for several reasons ...the K bodies or Jorge's are better...I'm really responding to the size.
I tend to think like Sarge, more it better when it comes to clamp size. However, that can be a real pain...there heavy and take up a lot of space...and get topsy turvy on smaller clamp-ups. So I was really suggesting you spoil yourself a little and get smaller ones..24',36" and save the big clamp jobs for ponys which you can elongate cheaply by buying longer pipe ... I have done some huge glue-ups but the vast majority is 36" or less...I'll also use cauls which change things also..
I wonder if 4 each of the 2 biggest weight more than 70#...not sure what the shipping is going to end up being on these puppies.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Gee Wizz............Got my clamps ordered, only took 29min! Every one and their brother myst have been on the site ordering them! Oups! I guess Your sweetie (FG) was on there also working to get you another 4 of each! The price is sure worth it.... But these people that are on Dial-up, I don't think I could have stood the wait, the 29 min was on cable modem! But it sure acted like an old 14.2k dial up line!
Thanks for the Head's up Young Lady (FG) or I would have never known about the sale till to late. Now all I have to do is find time to build something again!
Good Night all.
KK
KK, John and Dale - I am on a dial-up and it took about the same amount of time. I tend to think their server and site are just s-l-o-w under the best of circumstances, and tonight probably about fried it!
I did two orders, the first one for 4 each of the 36" and 48", that one went through in about 20 minutes, maybe 25 (I had alread registered an account yesterday, so didn't have to fill out all the name/address junk). Then I went back to do a second order for the 24" clamps and some of the router bits they have on special for $5. (Separate order was so I could use a different debit card, LOL). When that one finally went to the Shopping Basket (15 mins or so), the 24"ers were sold out. Grrrrrrr. Oh well, I got the biggies, and I ordered 5 of those $5 1/2"-shank bits.
Whew, I'm beat! Now, I must come up with a project to justify those clamps! Chances are, they're not necessary for Christmas ornaments!!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Many thanks Forestgirl!!
I ordered 4x24" and 4x48" since I got enough standard shape 36".
I must have been lucky yesterday since it took me 17 minutes to complete the order.
Thanks again,
Eric
After waiting 39 minute, the sale was confirmed and I got an e-mail to that effect. Today I got a second e-mail cancelling the order for the 36" clamps without any explanation.
I really believe that Woodcraft must have had very few at hand and as someone else already said they were practicing less that a serious promotion. ( My lawyer advised me not to use the word "deceptive").
Will I buy something else from them? I doubt.
John Cabot
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