Claw and Ball foot inspirations needed.
KeithNewton
| Posted in General Discussion on
I have a client that wants me to design a cabinet that will need a claw and ball feet, with fairly short legs. Oh, I get to use my own creativity here, whatever that means.
Does anyone here have any photos of work that any other contemporary woodworkers have used this detail in a new way.
I am stuck, does anyone have suggestions or photos? Personally, I think there is too much stuff already out there, but would like to pick up this client.
Replies
Are you looking for whimsical ideas or traditional?
Non-traditional preferablly. Got any ideas to share?
Look on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/antique-claw-foot-metal-glass-ball_W0QQitemZ7347755741QQcategoryZ358QQssPageNameZWD10VQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItemI've got a few of these of various sizes. I'm planning some pieces for them, but that's been in the works for a while. This one on ebay is also available from Restoration Hardware. Or, you can create your own. I made a ball & claw that was modeled after a chicken. It was brass and bronze, built up from welding and brazing materials. The ball was a rough cut garnet stone --- purple color to match the dyed mahogany table. The claw can be from any creature including a human. The ball can be simply anything....even a sandwich. You have to read the client and know yourself.
Keith, do you like lion's feet or eagle's feet? You could also make some other animals feet. Taunton at one time had a video on carving these items if that helps. CNC is the fast way to go as you can well imagine. Or, make one and use a duplicarver..... aloha, mike
Adams Wood Products sells some short ball and claw legs done on CNC routers
Check out their web site.
I've used the Adams Wood product Queen Ann legs made of Walnut. Nice stuff...MarkVisit my woodworking blog Dust Maker
I've used them also. Very satisfied.
A bad day woodworking is better than a good day working -- yes, I'm retired!
You never stated if you are carving the feet or buying ready made...
Anyway.. I CAN'T carve well so I'd have to buy them...
How about something like the leg with a ball and claw on both ends.. One facing the floor and one with the claw grabbing the top slab...
You could sketch it out and see if you like... The claw at the top would have a modified claw area that looked like it was holding the apron / top..
Keith, it's a corner cabinet, but might help in some way.
Hey Mook, That is about the size and length and proportions that I am working with. It is a shame that Tyson isn't the customer, this would be easy, I would just do a chicken foot, grasping a golden egg. However, the customer is a builder that has about $10 million worth of work going. If we can get together, it will lead to lots of work in the future.I am currently thinking of making the leg somewhat of a stylized bird with both feet grasping the ball, and the apron or lower rail would morph into the wings. As I try to avoid making it look like the more traditional stuff, it is starting to look like Rene Lalique influenced it, which is OK with me, but I'll bet he will not like it unless I make it look like the standard, over-used, single foot, hard round ball, unrelated to anything else on the piece.
If I have to go that way, I would make the ball appear to be soft like a ball of clay where the talons are buried into it, and bulging out in the broad areas.I just hate it when I have to design something to meet someone's expectation which squeezes me into some box where I don't belong.
Keith, have you been to the house of this prospective customer. If you know how he ticks, and also what sort of management is currently operating (wife) perhaps you could get some clues towards the design. The fellow may be fanatical about something (whonosewhat)and if you come up with a design that ties in with this you are already in the pound seats.
I am beginning to see the funny side of this (builders, shovels cement mixers, ball and claws etc) so I better keep quiet now.Philip Marcou
Hey Mook, I tried getting that from him, and he wasn't willing to let me get to the end-customer. He assures me that I didn't need to worry about them. I was dealing with him, and I had a hard time getting any good usable feel for detail other than 5' W 3" H x24' d, with two pirs of pocket doors, and C&B feet, and some wiggle line across the bottom. I can knock myself out with the other details.I just don't know how this guy gets as much of the kind of projects that he does if this is the way that he works with all of the people that he deals with.
Keith, knowing what the fellow wants to put inside the cabinet might help.Philip Marcou
I just hate it when I have to design something to meet someone's expectation which squeezes me into some box where I don't belong. DRAWINGS DRAWINGS DRAWINGS.. If you can't hire sombody that can do your ideas.. That is if you really want the job and future work...Have THEM pick out what they want.. At least the drawings should be what YOU can do!
Did you make that?? Nice but a bit dark for me..
But Yours! Not mine...
Did I make that? Not quite-my father gave it to my mother when I was born.
It was "factory' made in South Africa. The timber is Imbuia-needs stripping to remove the dark shellac that is spoiling the natural colour....Philip Marcou
spoiling the natural colour.. ??Leave it alone! It may be worth a fortune! If ya as old as me!
keith,
Forgive me for asking, but I just read on your profile that you've been a pro for over 30 years.......so, why are you asking here for ideas? It seems to me that after 30 years you ought to have a handle on just what it is that you like to do. And it seems to me that if this potential client has asked you for a proposal, he must be knowledgeable of your work and want some of it. Or maybe I'm making a wrong assumption, maybe you have always supplied the marketplace and are just now trying to build one-offs. I'd love to be of some help, but you don't seem to know what you're looking for. Perhaps more correctly, you don't know what the client is looking for. Well, if that's the case, I'd suggest you ask him for some direction. I'd not suggest trolling here for ideas, there are too many fish in the pond and the only one with your head is you.
Not necessarily sapwood. I've been designing and making furniture for a living since the early 1970's, and I get stuck for ideas. Sometimes the inspiration just isn't there.
I have an ongoing design problem of my own. I have to design a project that incorporates both hand cut dovetails and a hand worked mortised and tenoned frame along with hand planing, and moulding, etc. It sounds easy, but I'm not making the piece, and all those making skills I can do almost in my sleep.
The piece has to be made by complete beginners to furniture making over a ten week period, and trying to get the balance right between technical complexity, aesthetics, achievability, and cost to the learners for the materials is giving me problems.
I can come up with all sorts of ideas that fit the bill, such as boring old dressing mirrors with a box underneath, or a cabinet with a drawer or two behind a door. There's a whole bunch of other stuff that 'would do.' But I don't want the learners to just knock something out because it 'will do.' I'm trying to come up with something that's contemporary, visually interesting, challenging, but not too challenging, and is economical on materials in case one of the learners really screws up.
So far, inspiration on my part is largely absent--- but something will suddenly inspire me in the next day or two. It bloody well has to anyway because a deadline's looming, ha, ha. Slainte.Richard Jones Furniture
Getting stuck for ideas is part of being in the creative arts. If one doesn't get stuck once in a while, or even very often, then that person isn't trying to grow. He/she is regurgitating past successes. And there's nothing wrong with that either, but it's called practice not exploration. My point for this discussion thread is simply that Keith doesn't seem to be clear in knowing what he wants. It's not that he isn't expressing himself well to us, it's that he doesn't know what he wants. I'm not talking specifics here, I'm talking concepts. Your situation is just the opposite. In regards to your case piece asignment you are very clear about the concept, but you just haven't figured out how to execute it.....yet. PS I notice that you haven't asked anyone here for ideas.....or did I miss that thread?
No, I've not asked for help sapwood, and I don't think I need any.
You're right in that I know exactly what I want to achieve, but I haven't yet worked out how to balance all the essential learning objectives required by the project.
However, an answer will be found. I just don't know what it is yet.
I also don't know how to help Keith at the moment, but then I do have my own design problems to ponder, ha, ha. Slainte.Richard Jones Furniture
<However, an answer will be found. I just don't know what it is yet.>I find this to be the most exciting part, the place between inhale and exhale. Allowing your learned behaviors to trust your creative instinct is our commitment to ourselves and our work. Would it be that we went crazy and never appraoched that edge again- the whole world would lose. haha, but I digress........ aloha
I find this to be the most exciting part, the place between inhale and exhale.Can I say in here when She says 'OH YES' ???
WHy don't you do a small (short) workbench with a couple of drawers with some cockbead or molding. Just hit me while I read it, Not that its any my business
So far, inspiration on my part is largely absent--- ??Oh Geeeeeeeeee you lie ALOT! I have seen some of the stuff you have posted...I am sort of like what you said.. I CAN do the WORK.. Just NOT a artist... OR FINISHER!
The inspiration came Will. The design is done and dusted except for thinking through some small technical bits. Slainte.Richard Jones Furniture
Pleas post when ya DONE!
It must be nice , and a shame ,to never need to ask for someone else's opinion. I think if you looked at some of Keiths work you would see he really doesnt need anyone's help but is just kickin ideas around. By the way ,I saw an idea where each leg was holding on to a different critter mouse ,fish etc , can't remember the rest . A little to far from traditional for my taste but a neat idea none the less.
Tim
Edited 9/7/2005 7:33 pm ET by TimLoupe
Sorry if I misled you. I never meant to imply that I never ask another for their opinion regarding my ideas or work. There are a trusted few of my friends and associates who I call on frequently for advice. It is true that I seldom if ever ask anyone for an "idea" even if all I want is a suggestion. I prefer to generate my own. But, or actually a rather big... BUT, I look at other's work all the time. I look at books, magazines, I read this forum, I notice stuff in client's homes, and on and on. I'm not saying that my methodology is the correct one or all that unusual, and actually now that I reflect on it, perhaps Keith's initial question is perfectly acceptable. (I'm thinking out loud here.) He is obviously quite comfortable asking relative strangers for ideas while I am not. So apologys all around to anyone who's nose I might have tweaked. Really all I was trying to do was further the discussion of design. A subject near and dear to me.
Sapwood,
I have to agree its important to have a good idea of what the customer is thinking of but sometimes they give us free reign. Personally I like more perimeters. .I build some pretty fancy cabinets and stair cases for some well healed people and my ideas and sollutions have come from unexpected places, like their kids or the plumber or what ever , not well rounded ideas, but something that gets the juices flowing another dirrection.Keith does some pretty kool curvy stuff and I hope he shows us what he ends up with .No offence taken
Tim
Sapwood, You are right, My crystal ball is a little out of focus. This is just not the direction that I have been going in for a long time, and I am sure that there have been a lot of claw and ball feet / legs since I have paid any attention to them. I know they are commonly used in production furniture, and normally if someone contacts me to make something that may be in production, I always encourage them to buy that. I can not possibly knock off someone's design for what it is being sold on the market even with middle men.However, I am sure there have been some fine artist craftsmen or women with enough creativity to take an old idea and re-cycle it with new insights that would give it a new look. I have not seen them myself, that is why I am asking here. I am sure some of you have your finger on the pulse of this development better than I do. I am not looking to copy anybody's work. If anything I would rather avoid doing that.Have you ever ponder something like the cabriole leg, and wonder just how it developed to where it has vs. how well it was accepted in the beginning and why it remains so now? You start at the bottom with a cue-ball grasp in a talon, attached to the shin and calf of an ostrich embellished with acanthus leaves and curlycues like cake decorations and embellishments that have no relevance to anything about the work. Yet somehow some things took root, and are commonly accepted as being in "good taste" simply because they have been around for 3 - 400 years. After that many years how do you think people will view your, / our work? will craftsmen be trying to copy any of it?I was at another client / friend's house for a party a few months ago who had a coffee-table from cast bronze that had legs which were somewhat cabriole except they were inverted. When the aprons met the legs at the corner, there was in inside corner, with very nice details on the inside that flowed out and onto the top. I don't think this is anything that could be achieved in wood, but it was the best thing that I have seen in a long time obviously had roots in the designs of our predecessors.I know that my verbal description is a poor substitute for a photo, but maybe it will spark a memory for someone else. K
Keith,
There is some interesting stuff with dragons about at the moment, and you can make body shape whaterver you want.
http://www.unclefesters.com.au/dragons_005.htm
is a ref to some lights / gargoyles etc, but you might also try a long Chinese dragon as the apron with her legs forming the ball and claw.
so, why are you asking here for ideas?I do it ALL the time.. I'm old and my brain hurts thinkin'.. Besides I LOVE NEW Ideas!
Keith,
Here are a few to look at. If you truly have cart blanch, consider carving a foot/claw and mounting something unique inside of it - billiard balls, solid glass/acrylic spheres, a steel ball, etc...
View ImageView ImageView ImageView Image
Dan Kornfeld, Owner/President - Odyssey Wood Design, Inc.
In the whimsical vein, how about the jaws of a bucket loader grasping a sort of hobbit house;)
I think I read the client was builder; Hmmm, on second thought that design might do more to offend than please;)
Just a thought <you see John ducking, waiting for the wise guy to remind him that not all thoughts should be expressed;)>
Good luck with the project!
< how about the jaws of a bucket loader grasping a sort of hobbit house;)>I think its a great idea and glad you expressed the thought. Anarchy rules..... aloha, mike
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