Replies

1. 
   Michmesquite | Mar 09, 2004 08:57pm | #1

   In California it is a couple of bucks and the time to fill out the lien notice and have it acknowledged (notarized) and recorded.

   Simply filing a lien does nothing, and in California there are stiff penalties if the lien is not removed after the 90 (?) days it is valid unless the lien is perfected through a court action, in Muni or Superior Court depending upon the amount.

   Again, in California, if the amount of the lien is small, say less than $5,000, a strategy for the property owner would be to post a lien bond ($10,000 cash for a $5,000 lien) and have the lien removed. The lienholder can still make a claim in court against the property owner, but the threat of the lien is gone.

   My suggestion would be to call legal aid in your locale. They my advise you to go to small claims court. Cheaper and you don't need an attorney.

   __________________________________________________________

   Michael in San Jose

   Freedom from mental disturbance is the very most for which one can hope.

    Epicurus (341-270 BCE)

2. 
   Mackwood | Mar 10, 2004 08:03am | #2

   I can only concur with Michael except in one case.  That being when the owner is trying to sell the property.  The sale cannot take place until the lien is resolved and the lien will usually be paid out of funds in escrow.  This happened to us last year when we had a guy try to stiff us on an exterior paint job.  Other than that, small claims court is the way to go.  Sorry you need to go there!  Good luck!

   Mack

   "WISH IN ONE HAND, S--T IN THE OTHER AND SEE WHICH FILLS UP FIRST"

1. 
   scooter1 | Mar 11, 2004 12:08am | #3

   Mike had a typo. The lien disappears after 90 days and is invalid unless a court action is commenced to foreclose upon the lien.

   I would add that no AIA standard contract has an attorney fees provision, so you are on your own when filing suit. It is on your nickle.

   Regards,

   Boris

   "Sir, I may be drunk, but you're crazy, and I'll be sober tomorrow" -- WC Fields, "Its a Gift" 1934

1. 
   BarryVaBeach | Mar 11, 2004 01:50am | #4

   Bob, In Virginia the lien must be filed within three months from the last day of the month that work was performed and expires if suit is not brought within 6 months of filing of the lien.  The cost to file the lien is fairly small in comparison to the cost to enforce it which can run in the tens of thousands.  While small claims court is often quicker and cheaper, the lien can work very well if the owner is trying to refinance or sell the property - which will be held up until the lien is resolved or bonded off.  The costs to bond off the lien are cheap ( owner may have to hire an attorney and go to court) so you do get some leverage.   Liens are at their best when the owner has no money but there is equity in the property.

3. 
   vacabby | Mar 11, 2004 02:07am | #5

   New statute in the Commonwealth of Virginia requires that a mechanics lien be placed on a property within 90 days following the last day of the month in which the work was completed.    The cost to place the lien varies with the local jurisdiction in which you file.    The lien must then be followed by a civil hearing where the amount due can be paid in full or contested.   If a judgement is realized then that is all you have is a judgement.   It is still up to you to collect it by any legal means available.   The court system is not a collection agency.    However, the property cannot change hands(be sold) until any and all lien judgements are satisfied.    Usually if I do work on a home that I know is being sold I will let the Realtor know in writing that I have not been paid.   They must then inform the closing attorney of the current debt.   In Virginia this is done to protect the purchaser of a property from assuming a debt owed by a previous owner.   The debt follows the property as the lien is against a tangible asset(land, home, farm,etc.).   For this reason the old statute that allowed you to file a lien up to a year later was removed from the books.    Because a property could exchange hands and then you file a lien against the property you did improvements on.   Then the new owner had to hunt up the prior owner and sometimes legally get them to pay off the debt owed to removed the lien from a property they no longer owned.   This created a legal mess in some instances.    New homes require that all subcontractors on the project sign off that they have been paid and that document presented by the general contractor prior to closing.   Sorry for the lengthy answer to your short question.

   jb

1. 
   gdavis62 | Mar 11, 2004 09:11pm | #6

   But if you had no contract with the GC and no signed change orders, only bills presented but not paid, how strong would your position be if you liened the property?

1. 
   BarryVaBch | Mar 13, 2004 04:28am | #7

   Bob, I don't know about other states, but in Virginia, it doesn't make much of difference in filing a lien whether you have a contract in writing or just a verbal arrangement.  In Va. if the general agreed to pay you a certain amount and didn't pay you, you can sue him in court for that amount or you can file a lien against the owner ( or maybe both) .  If you bring suit to enforce the lien, you are asking the court to sell the home, pay off the mortgage, and the excess applied to your claim, and if there is any left over, it goes back to the owner.  Most of the time, the property is not actually sold, if your lien is perfect and there are no defenses, you get paid, normally by a title insurance co.  The theory behind the lien is that the owner should not wind up with a new ( or better) home without paying for it.  One major defense is that if the owner paid the general in full and the gc just spent your portion, your lien will not be valid.  While it is much easier to prove your case if you have a written agreement with the general, a verbal agreement will work if the judge believes you had an agreement, you did your work properly, and the jedge thinks you are owed the money.  In an earlier post, I referenced 90 days form the last day of the month - there is an even shorter time if it is new residential construction and a mechanic lien agent was appointed.  If your are out more than a few thousand dollars, it is probably worth talking to a lawyer to see if he or she can help. Good luck Barry