To all those plane users,
Sometime ago I bought a Stanley Type 11 Smoothing Plane (#4) with the intent of replacing the original iron with a Hock iron. I read in Highland’s catalog that the A2 (cryo) iron is more wear resistant and holds an edge longer than a high carbon steel iron. The description went on to mention that “they are a little harder to sharpen…”. For those of you who have used (and sharpened) this type of iron, how much more difficult were they to sharpen? (I sharpen my chisels and plane irons with sandpaper.) Also, I realize that the cyro blades are only a few dollars more, but are the results significantly better? Thanks in advance for your thoughts/comments.
Regards,
trusche2
Replies
I have both ?standard? A-2 blades and the cyro treated ones. I can honestly say there is no difference in them, so I?d say the cyro is maybe a gimmick ( as far as woodworking is concerned).
I found the Hock blades only marginally better than the standard equipment blades. The A-2 blades on the other hand are nothing short of amazing. As far as sharpening is concerned, I too use sandpaper, and I?ve not noticed them to be any more difficult to sharpen.
Rob Millard
Here is a study on blade life done by a hand tool afficionado.
It compares old (sweetheart era) blades vs the cryo blades on a piece of hard-to-plane wood
I thought that the results were interesting and worth publicising.
eddie
edit: if hyperlink broken, address of site is:http://host65.ipowerweb.com/~traditi2/forum/viewtopic.php?t=242
Edited 11/26/2003 5:23:04 AM ET by eddie (aust)
I didn't see any mention of it but crygenic tool treating has done for years in the metal working industry so I'm sure there are more detailed scientific studies available in that industry.
Eddie
The review was very interesting. I had A-2 blades made for all my plane several years back, before they were commonly available. I should have used D-2 which has an even finer grain structure. I'm surprised that M-2 is used for blades, since I believe it is a high speed steel.
Rob Millard
Hi Rob,
I use the M2 blades referred to in the study - they're a bit pricey but I don't have to sharpen anywhere near as often.
Yes, they're high speed steel, cryo treated. Not too difficult to hone, but an absolute bear to grind the primary bevel. A minor advantage is that, being HSS, they are not affected if you accidently 'blue' the edge in a minor way when grinding. Can take up to 15" to regrind the bevel, by the way.
They work really well - keep an edge for a fair while. I was working some really hard timber a couple of months ago, and I was getting two strokes of the plane before blunting the edge with a standard iron, and got about 20 minutes work out of the M2 blade before I had to resharpen.
D2 apparently also works well, but I thought the size of the chromium carbide in this would cause problems with chipout.
Cheers,
eddie
I put one of the Hock cryo A2 irons in my grandfather's #5 jack plane and it's great. I'd opt for A2 over a standard blade without a second thought. The cryo treatment is a bit controversial, but from the info I've picked up from being a bit of a knife collector, the knifemaking community seems to have embraced it as genuine. If the price is within a few dollars, I'd say go for it. I'm a sandpaper guy, too. No problems there with sharpening.
Miles
If you sharpen your own blades, you will realize how hard A2 can be the first time you stroke one on a stone or sandpaper. Will definitely make you realize just how really soft original Stanley blades are.
I have no experience with the modern high carbon blades.
I've made blades for small block planes from 1" wide A2 and they are much harder than any of the original blades in my Stanley's. If I had a furnace I'd try making bigger ones.
The only problem is flattening and putting the polish on the back side! Dang stuff will work you to death!
PlaneWood by Mike_in_Katy (maker of fine sawdust!)PlaneWood
Trusche2,
IMHO, it depends on your work habits. I sharpen my tools after every use and during heavy use anyway (ok, not my scrub plane)... so I don't have a need for the cryo stuff. I replaced the irons in my Record #5 and standard block planes with high carbon Hock replacements, and they are outstanding. World of difference. Maybe I'm missing something and I'm behind the power curve, I don't know...some people rave about the cryo irons and blades.
I agree with you about the hardness. They are significantly more difficult to do a major reworking of the bevel. I'd recommend using a corse diamond stone with oil or dishsoap as a lubricant. It may take a while. Don't be impatient, hurrying things won't really help. I use a veritas honing guide to make sure I maintain a consistent bevel angle. Once the bevel is consistent ( as I said, be patient) switch to something more fine for honing. I use 1000, 1200, 4000, 6000, then 8000 grit waterstones one after the other. Doing the preliminary work on the diamond stone to get that consistent bevel makes the waterstone steps fast and the result is very professional looking not to mention the amazing performance you are then able to obtain with handplaning. A garage sale Stanley #5 with a flattened sole will sing and shoot out thin shavings...I like the look of dressed pine construction lumber.
One strange thing about the cryo blade however, even though its extremely hard and shines like a million bucks, I chewed one up pretty fast will trying to clean up some weathered picnic table wood I was trying to re-use. The standard hock bench plane blade that I have in another plane (not cryo) held up better and was slightly easier to sharpen.
TRUSCHE2,
From my experience I have been amazed at how long the cryo A2 irons stay sharp.. I must tell you that the only cryo A2's I have are Lie-Nielsen, maybe others vary.. I use scary sharp and it does seem like the A2 does take a good deal longer to sharpen (anecdotal evidence only), than say a Record plane iron or even a Japanese chisel. So far I have been pleased
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled