Replies

1. 
   Crunk | Oct 30, 2003 06:42pm | #1

   Make sure that you flatten the backs of your chisels.  Register the chisel's edge in the incised shoulder line,  tilt the chisel about five degrees off vertical (undercut the socket) and give the chisel a firm tap to deepen the incised line.  Go all the way down the incised line on both sides of the board.  Now go back and do the real chisel and mallet work while remembering to tilt the chisels so as to **undercut** the sockets.

   Trying to chop, pare, or otherwise arrive at perfectly flat socket bottoms is a fool's errand and materially impacts the speed at which the joints can be produced.  Don't use a coping saw to remove waste - the only tools you need to cut dovetails are your layout tools, your dovetail saw, chisel(s) and mallet.  Keep the extraneous contraptions off your bench and out of your shop.  Save the coping saw for, you guessed it, coping mouldings.

   If you undercut the sockets, you eliminate the idiocy of **paring them**  the bottom of the socket never shows, it's end grain so doesn't glue well, there's no reason to spend a lot of time dressing and paring and prettying up socket bottoms.  Undercut them so blips of wood don't get in the way of the joint as you tap it closed.  That really should be your only concern.

   
   

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   Edited 10/30/2003 1:58:13 PM ET by BossCrunk

   
   

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   Edited 10/31/2003 7:25:47 AM ET by BossCrunk

1. 
   wgsdvm | Oct 30, 2003 06:51pm | #2

   Thanks BossK..

   I never use a coping saw for dovetail work, I'll try flattening my chisels a bit.

2. 
   BobSmalser | Oct 30, 2003 06:54pm | #3

   Agree.  Sounds like you're trying to take too big a bite...pare to a square shoulder after deepening the line rather than treating a paring chisel like a mortise chisel.

   And Skil # 1 is sharpening and flattening those chisels...how ya doin there?  Can you cleanly and painlessly shave your arm hair with them?

   
   

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   Edited 10/30/2003 11:56:05 AM ET by Bob

1. 
   Dan019 | Oct 31, 2003 04:30pm | #8

   Welcome Spitfire,

    

   I agree with Bob: And Skil # 1 is sharpening and flattening those chisels...how ya doin there?  Can you cleanly and painlessly shave your arm hair with them?

   I screwed around with a lot of different methods as far as sharpening goes, and by far , the quickest, easiest and most foolproof way of doing it is a method described by Mike Dunbar in FWW (don’t recall the issue) that he called the “Scary Sharp” system. You could read the article, it’s very informative, but basically you use a piece of ¼” plate glass as your known flat standard then affix various grades of sandpaper to the glass starting from 120 up to 600 or 1000 grit. Just don’t skip grits as you sand. One grit polishes the scratches out of the previous grit until you get up to 600 or 1000 and has that mirror finish that you’re striving for. It’s a very short learning curve and you don’t have to buy a bunch of fancy jigs and stones to do this. As a matter of fact, except for the glass you probably already have the materials on hand to start.

   Four things: Don’t skip grits as you work your way up.  

    Sharpen with a side-to-side motion (not the circular motion you use for a     plane blade)  Don’t change the angle of bevel while you’re sharpening And don’t forget to do the back of the chisel also

      Try it, it really works!

   Dan

    

     

              

    

    

    

1. 
   BobSmalser | Oct 31, 2003 05:30pm | #10

   All that and having the 8" hard felt wheel on your buffer-grinder loaded with some Knifemaker's Green Rouge for the final stropping.

   I find that whether you use sandpaper, water stones, fancy circular machines or Arkansas stones don't make a whit if you understand what you're doing.  My half-dozen Arkansas stones in 4 different grades were ancient heirlooms left to me 3 decades ago...never felt the need to swap them out and they are still going strong.  Just use lots of cutting oil.

   Although I use glass plate and alum oxide paper too for larger surfaces like plane bottoms and plane blade backs.

   Edited 10/31/2003 10:32:03 AM ET by Bob

2. 
   wgsdvm | Oct 31, 2003 06:09pm | #12

   Thank you, I was going to have someone at a Woodworkers Warehouse locally sharpen them for me, but the process you describe sounds fairly easy and I may give it a try.

1. 
   BobSmalser | Oct 31, 2003 06:24pm | #13

   As they should be touched up at the end of every session with them, doesn't pass the common sense test to send them out.  Mount your sharpening system whether stones in a board or glass plates semi-permanently at one corner of your bench so's you can't procrastinate.

3. 
   alanplanesaw | Oct 30, 2003 08:35pm | #4

   Bevel should be facing what you are removing.

   Alan - planesaw

4. 
   BG | Oct 30, 2003 09:23pm | #5

   Spitfire,

   I began practicing cutting dovetails about a year ago because, like you, I wanted to get better.  I bought Ian Kirby's book which was very helpful and gave me a process to follow ...from flattening the face side of the board...to finish planing.  Ian scribs a line that is just a hair short of the thickness and planes the non-face side down to get a perfect fit in the draw opening. I also picked up some good technique from the video on this web site. 

   As I practiced I noticed I had certain tendancies that needed additional attention to get better outcomes.  The nice clean shoulder and scribed line is a good example.  After I make the line, I put my knife in the line pull the starrets up to the knife and recut the line a bit deeper...makes a nice groove for the chisel.  I then actually put my board in the front vise of my workbench (upright)..putting the scribed line even with the shoulder of the vise.  I can then lay my chisel on the vise shoulder and tap away ...the chisel has to go straight...after half way I flip the board around and come to the center that way.  I take small bytes at a time..going in about 1/16" and then removing the chunks from the top..works well. 

   Another trick for a clean soulder is to use your router...   
5. 
   Alan | Oct 31, 2003 02:13am | #6

   Spitfire,

   You can also clamp a piece of scrap, that has a square edge, along your scribed line and use that to guide your chisel.

   Alan (the other Alan)

6. 
   DaveBarker | Oct 31, 2003 03:25am | #7

   I use the James Krenov method of clamping a straight edge board over the chisel line to guide the chisel. I think it works great. I do use a german coping saw with a very fine blade that fits nicely in the narrow kerf to cut out the waste.

7. 
   b1gcountry | Oct 31, 2003 04:44pm | #9

   Your chisel will naturally want to chop a line that is half way between the bevel angle and the back angle. That is just because the wood that is left in front of the bevel forms resistance to the chisel chopping straight down, and pushes it backwards towards your shoulder line. In order to get the chisel to want to follow the back angle, you have to occasionally remove the wood that is exerting pressure on the bezel. In other words, chop down lightly at first (on the shoulder line), then remove the chisel and pare/chop out the waste (you'll be coming into the dovetail from the front at an angle.) This way your chisel will be able to follow the line that you want it to follow. Under cutting the socket is also a good idea, but you should have control over it, and be able to chop whatever angle you want.

   Tom

1. 
   wgsdvm | Oct 31, 2003 06:00pm | #11

   Tom,

   Great tip, I tried your method last night.  I lightly chopped on the scribe line then carefully pared some wood off of the watse side, THEN I used more pressure to cut along the shoulder.  It worked very well.

   And yes I need to sharpen these chisels some!!!!!!!

   Bill

8. 
   bill1951 | Nov 01, 2003 12:35am | #14

   I finally had a chance to cut dovetails by hand at a course taught by Rob Cosman.  Rob is the Canadian distributor for Lie-Nielsen tools.  His video is available through Lie-Nielsen on their web site.  I was amazed at the quality of my first hand cut dovetail drawer.  I bought his video and refer to it when I cut dovetails.  Rob suggest certain tools to cut quality dovetails, usually tools made by Lie-Nielsen.

   Hope that helps.

   Bill