Replies

1. 
   Ricks503 | Nov 29, 2005 01:14am | #1

   Lots of suggestion, try the advanced search, this is a common question that has been discussed many times with many answers.

   Personnaly I Like my Freud SD508.

   1 - measure the board twice, 2 - cut it once, 3 - measure the space where it is supposed to go        4 - get a new board and go back to step 1
1. 
   Pippins | Nov 29, 2005 03:59pm | #3

   Ricks503, thanks for the feedback.

   Steve

2. 
   Troy | Nov 29, 2005 01:42am | #2

   ditto on the Freud Super dado I have the 8" version and it has worked well on birch plywood.

   Troy

1. 
   Pippins | Nov 29, 2005 03:59pm | #4

   Troy, thanks.

   Steve

    

1. 
   normite | Nov 29, 2005 08:18pm | #5

   Same here! The Freud dado is a great deal and creates nice flat bottom dados.

3. 
   forestgirl | Nov 29, 2005 08:43pm | #6

   The Freud SD dado sets will give you an excellent finish at a reasonable cost.  If you can fork out a bit more money, I'd suggest the Dial-a-Width Freud set.  It's doubtful you'd ever want to replace it.  A true stacked dado set, with adjustment via a dial rather than shims.  Scan the thread titles here in "Tools" -- someone else was asking about dado sets, and 1 member gave his feedback on the DAW set.  Ah! Here it is.

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
   Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

   
   

   ---

   Edited 11/29/2005 12:44 pm by forestgirl

4. 
   muleboy | Nov 30, 2005 04:18am | #7

   I purchased the Frued Super Dado last year and I have been very pleased with its performance.   Very clean cuts, very very little tear out with ply or solid wood. 

   Worth every penny.   Fine WW rated it best in an earlier issue.   I of course read this after buying it.   I just took a chance,  I got lucky this time.

   Only issue...   It tasks my contractor saw more than any blade.   The electrical in my garage is for the birds.     I tend to put myself in the dark when I use it.

   Muleboy.

1. 
   DaveinPa | Dec 30, 2005 06:04pm | #19

   The electrical in my garage is for the birds.     I tend to put myself in the dark when I use it.

   I thought I was the only one with that problem. I have a small shop limited to a t/s, scrool saw, drill press and 3 routers. When I start the table saw the lights go out and then slowly come on again. If I am working at night and I have the heater on and turn the t/s on the circuit breaker trips and its like the inside of a cave. SHMBO tells me "That's ok. You have been working in the dark for years." This spring there is going to be a serious upgrade in the eletric to the shop.

1. 
   muleboy | Jan 03, 2006 07:31pm | #20

   Be carefull...   with me it will be an expensive proposition.   I need a 100 amp sub-panel in the garage, this will force me to upgrade the house to a 200 amp panel.   This whole thing is going to cost me big.   

   I'm considering a seperate drop from the pole and having a meter just for the garage.

   I have to get numbers for both to figure out which is better.

    

   Good luck!

    

   Muleboy.

    

1. 
   John_D | Jan 03, 2006 10:50pm | #21

   Are you sure you'll have to upgrade the main panel?  I added five 30A/220V and two 20A/110V circuits to a 200A service after checking with an electrician and the city inspector.  PMBI if you're ahead of where I was -- I thought a 200A panel could support only 200A of breakers, but in reality it can handle ~200A of actual load, a far different calculation!My goal is for my work to outlast me.  Expect my joinery to get simpler as time goes by.

1. 
   tinkerer2 | Jan 04, 2006 08:41am | #22

        Count the amps.  If you have a 42 twenty amp breakers in your 200 amp panel, that adds up to 840 amps.  That is essentially what I have in my house. 

2. 
   John_D | Jan 05, 2006 03:52am | #23

   That is, as I think you're also pointing out, an essentially meaningless number -- actual simultaneous load being of much more interest.My goal is for my work to outlast me.  Expect my joinery to get simpler as time goes by.

3. 
   muleboy | Jan 05, 2006 08:18am | #24

   I should have been more detailed....  the house is presently only a 100Amp Panel...   I have to upgrade or have a line dropped directly to the garage.    depending on the costs that is the way I would prefer to go.  

   Honestly   I just don't want to trench...    I may end up trenching anyway for the gas line.   My lot is 135' deep and the garage is about 60 ' away from the house.

   I have lots of work to do.   We just purchased the house in the fall of '04 and I spent the first year working on the house...   Perhaps this coming summer I will have a little time.

   Muleboy.

4. 
   kreuzie | Feb 05, 2008 07:32am | #25

   Since you're going to trench for a gas line anyway, is it physically possible (i.e., are the gas and electric close enough to each other), and does local code allow, the gas and electric to be run in the same trench?

   You would eliminate the overhead electric cables, save money by not having to dig two trenches and possibly not have to install a tracer wire for the gas line (if this is OK with the gas company). The electric cables would act as the tracer.

   Just a thought...

    

    

5. 
   creekwood | Nov 30, 2005 05:00pm | #8

   Everyone touts the Frued, which I haven't used. But I have the Forrest dado set, and can't see how it can be beat. Also, it has always gotten great reviews.

1. 
   forestgirl | Nov 30, 2005 07:50pm | #9

   Hi, Creekwood.  I don't think anyone doubts the quality of the Forrest set, it is superb by all accounts.  Generally, though, Freud produces the same quality at a lower price.  There's about a 25% difference in the price of the Freud vs. the Forrest, and for the same price you'd pay for a regular Forrest 6" dado set, you can get the Dial-a-Width 6" set.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

1. 
   DougU | Dec 01, 2005 09:04am | #10

   Generally, though, Freud produces the same quality at a lower price.

   No offence but I don't agree with that statement. Freud does make a very good blade, I have several and am happy with all but the SCMS blades(I'd have to look at the #), I wouldn't buy another one for $5.

   But to say that they produce the same quality for less money is misleading. Which Forrest blades are you comparing to which Freud blades?

   If your statement were true I don't think Forrest would be in business very long.

   Doug

1. 
   forestgirl | Dec 01, 2005 07:37pm | #11

   Well, not being rich, I must say I haven't gone out and bought a bunch of Forrest blades just for the fun of comparing.  I pitted (bad choice of words?) my Freud LU84 against all comers at the Knots Fest last April and the crowd was completely wowed.  I tried to recruit, ahead of time, a Woodworker II, let everyone know that if they had one they really should bring it.  The Forrest owners let me down.  We ripped and crosscut with this blade, passed the stock around and the folks who do use the WWII couldn't find anything lacking in the cut.  Moreover, this isn't even the blade that's the main competitor to the WWII -- that model would be the F410, which I don't have (yet).

   The dado tests done by FWW for the current Tool Guide (no, it's not my favorite publication either) ranked both of the Freuds ahead of the Forrest due to the fact that the Forrest left scoring marks on multiple passes and the Freud did not.  They equaled each other on all other tests.  Their "street price" data lists the Forrest as $50 more than the Freud Dial-a-Width, $60 more than the standard 6" dado set.

   I'll put their Ultimate Cut-off Blade against anything in the universe.  The LU85 produces a finish that is, in a word, spectacular.

   Of course there's the matter of longevity -- time between sharpenings.  I can't testify there -- my use isn't all that heavy.  I've heard but put absolutely no stock in the statement, that the Forrest loses it's super-keen edge fairly quickly.  I heard that from one person and don't give it particular credence.  From what I can tell, Freud uses top-grade carbide carefully selected for the purpose the blade is designed for (impact strength vs. hardness), and plenty of it. 

   I really did not want this discussion to deteriorate into a Ford/Chevy thing.  Forrest makes great blades.  As far as I'm concerned, so does Freud (I own 3 of them).  Your claim that "If your statement were true I don't think Forrest would be in business very long" doesn't wash.  Forrest stays in business because they make excellent blades and, from what I've heard, provide excellent customer service.  They also have a ubiquitous marketing presence, with their "One blade does it all" ads.  (IMHO, one blade does not do it all, and they don't think so either, or they wouldn't make all those other blades, LOL. )  There are plenty of examples of companies who stay in business while charging more for the same quality as other companies -- Jet comes to mind. 

   In no way to I mean to denigrate Forrest, and I never have.  I just think that if there is a budget involved there's absolutely no reason not to choose Freud instead. 

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

   Edited 12/1/2005 11:46 am by forestgirl

1. 
   DougU | Dec 02, 2005 02:00am | #12

   FG

   Yea, the reason that I have the Forrests is because I'm rich and stupid!  <G>

   I think I own probably 6 Freuds and at least 5 or 6 Forrest blades, a few Amana's as well, so by no means am I dissing Freud.

   I have the Freud 508 dado and a guy I do a lot of work for has the Forrest, If for some reason I ever have to buy another dado I will get the Forrest. That's not to say that I'm disappointed with what I have but I don't think its as good as the Forrest. The Freud definitely does not stay sharp as long.

   I used to use nothing but combo blades on my table saw, most of them were Freud's, I'm very happy with them, unfortunately I never use much anymore. I gave a few of the combos away to someone on here so that they wouldnt sit around and rust!

   I have never put a lot of faith in the tests done by any of the mags, I prefer to use real world experience to make my judgements. I see woodworkers all day long, they can give me more info about tools then the mags will ever be able to offer.

   I've got two Freud LU91's, the most disappointing blade that I have ever purchased. They weren't all that cheap either. So no matter how much cheaper they were then the Forrest SCMS blades they now appear to be far more expensive because they are nothing more then a back-up blade. If they were on sale today for $5  you wouldn't see me in line to buy one! So budget really got shot to crap on those clunkers. I cant make that statement about any of the Forrests that I own.

   I, like a lot of others on here, use my blades to make a living, I use some of these blades to cut hundreds, if not thousands of cuts a week.

   I'm trying to get the most bang for my buck just like the next person but I don't think all the Forrest blades can be replaced with Freud blades and the only result would be more money in the persons pocket.

   I don't send my Forrests out to be sharpened near as often as I do my Freuds, that's just me but I see the same in other woodworkers so I only have that for a core sample, certainly not scientific but for my money that makes up for the more expensive blades. You know the saying, "you get what you pay for".

   My attempt here is to not say that Forrest is king of all blades and Freud takes a back seat to them. I'm happy with most of the Freuds I own, and I'm real happy with all of the Forrests that I own.

   Just my $.02 worth

   Doug

   Was just out in the garage, was looking at my stack of blades from the sharpener, Low and behold a LU85 Freud. Funny thing about that blade, I know its not mine! I haven't had to have mine sharpened for forever.

   It has so much damage to it that the sharpener had a sticker on it saying that it wasn't worth sharpening. I looked close at it and I think someone must have tried to cut there ax head in half! There wasn't a tooth on it that wasn't chipped or broke off completely! Must have gotten put in the wrong pile. I put it in the trash for safe keeping. I'm pretty sure the Forrest would have looked  the same if it went through the same punishment. :)

    

    

    

   Edited 12/1/2005 6:12 pm ET by DougU

2. 
   forestgirl | Dec 02, 2005 08:59am | #13

   Sad to hear about the LU91 being a disappointment, especially if you have 2 and they're both bad (can't attribute that to a lemon).  Sounds like they needed to go back to Uncle Freud!

   Most certainly I'll bow to your experience with toughness and longevity, 'cause you're the kind of WWer who can test the blades in that respect.  In your situation, it's obvious why you prefer the Forrest.  For those of us who are slowly building our tool "stable" and who don't tasks the blades all day every day, it can make more sense to buy a somewhat less expensive blade in order to invest in something else we need.

   I've bookmarked your post for future reference when this never-ending topic comes up.  Thanks for writing in more detail.  Have you tried any of the other brands I hear the pros discuss? Tenryu, Systimatic, and ?? can't remember...  Sounds like maybe not, having hit the motherlode with the Forrest.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

3. 
   DougU | Dec 03, 2005 07:41am | #14

   FG

   I've used Systematics and like them, same goes for Tenryu. Just seams like neither of them are available where I buy.

   I don't want to get into the Chevy/Ford thing either, both have their place and both make fine blades. I'm sure that Forrest has some blades that I wouldn't care for. NO company that I have had any experience with does everything perfect!

   If the worst thing that ever happens to me is that I have those two LU91's I'll consider my self very fortunate.

   My only point in bringing any of this up is to serve notice that there are choices that are not as apparent as the price tag on an item.

   I do like Freud router bits over Forrest's! <G>

   Best wishes

   Doug

4. 
   joespehar | Dec 11, 2005 12:07am | #17

   DougU prefers Freud routers bits over Forrest's. That's understandable since Forrest doesn't make router bits. There is a company called Forest City that does make router bits, but that's different from Forrest.

   Edited 12/10/2005 4:08 pm ET by joespehar

5. 
   DougU | Dec 11, 2005 12:32am | #18

   Joe

   I'm well aware that Forrest doesn't make router bits, I was just having a little fun with FG. I was just trying to make a point that I'm not totally against Freud products.

   Sometimes it difficult to convey the sarcasm that one is trying to project on here! <G>

   I've never heard of forest city router bits though I can see why the confusion.

   I own a house in the Amanas, in Iowa. Some people think that's the same Amana that makes router bits and blades.  But Amana refrigeration that makes refrigerators/microwaves/dishwashers/furnaces... is the same Amana as in Amana, Iowa and is located in Middle Amana, Iowa. NOW, I hope I confused you some more! :)

   Doug

    

   Doug

    

6. 
   nikkiwood | Dec 03, 2005 10:33am | #15

   We've been down this road before.With stacked dados (8") I have both the Freud and the Forrest. And in my experience, there really is no comparison. Clean cuts with no splintering is the main thing with dados. That Forrest has been through years and hundreds of cabinets, never been resharpened, and still cuts with nary a spinter -- even with the new plys with a microscopic veneer. I do like to keep the Freud around for whenever I have to run dados in construction lumber.********************************************************
   "It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."

   John Wooden 1910-

6. 
   QCInspector | Dec 03, 2005 11:47am | #16

   I'm not going to knock any of the major brand-name sawblade manufacturers, but to to find out how they stack up, (no pun intended) go find a good saw sharpening service, and talk to them. They will be able to tell you from real-world experience, which ones have the better carbide, and last longer after being sharpened.

   I didn't intend to buy a dado set when I was at my saw sharpener years ago. But while we were talking about blades. I expressed an interest in what was available that he could supply, and he showed me the blades that the commercial cabinet shops in the area were using. They were made by a company called Western Saw, located in Penticton, B.C. (I don't know if they're still in business however, as they were a small company at that time.) I bought a stacked dado set that was 10 inch in diameter. I don't use it for cutting sheet stock, very often, but I like it for cutting hardwood and especially like the ability to plow a 3 inch deep groove when I cut mortises in doors.

   What I'm trying to illustrate is that you can buy good blades, that may be made locally, as an alternative to the big brands.