Replies

1. 
   xmike | Mar 10, 2007 06:44pm | #1

   It sounds cool, but on the other hand, every "traditional plank door" that I've ever encountered has a twist in it.  In fact, I have two in my basement family room - one has a clockwise twist to it, the other counter clockwise.

   I grew up in rural Georgia where lots of folks made all their stuff.  Traditional plank doors abounded.  They alllll had a twist in them to some degree.  Quaint.  Rustic.  No Scottish.

   But, since you will make it yourself, that'll be charming, yes?  Better check with SWMBO to be sure of that.

   (Hummm, I seem to be in my crudgemudgeon role this morning).

   Now that I've been astoundingly clever this morning, on to your questions.

   "Where are the cleats? Are they horizontal members?"  - Yes

   "Why use tapered dovetails? "  - because Tapered dovetails don't tighten up until the last half inch (hopefully), so you have some chance of actually getting the cleat and vertical members joined across the entire scope of the door before something sticks beyond redemption.

   "Do the trunnels attach the planks to the cleats?"   -  yes they do

   "Could someone send me a sketch or a good written description of this construction?"  -  Do a general search of Fine Homebuilding articles.  I seem to remember one on just this subject sometime in the last two years.

   Here's one that uses vertical panels, but looks more traditional...

   http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/SkillsAndTechniques/SkillsAndTechniquesPDF.aspx?id=2534

   Here's another that's a little more to the point - in fact, specifically to the point...

   http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/FWNPDF/011145078.pdf

   Hope this helps, and good luck with your project.

   Mike D

    

1. 
   Noll1962 | Mar 11, 2007 03:59am | #2

   Thanks.  I guess this isn't what I imagined.  The description sounded very interesting.  I think I'll go with my original idea of a single panel door with wide frame and good old mortise and tennon joints.  I plan to carve the entire door including the frame.

   Carving is my strength.  I am a fair woodworker too

   Thanks again

1. 
   Rich14 | Mar 11, 2007 11:13pm | #3

   Noll,Frame and panel construction is the most successful kind of construction for a door. And mortise and tenon joinery is the strogest over any other kind. There have been several articles in FWW describing door construction, but none in recent years of the quality of Ian Kirby's and Tage Frid's writings.I can't remember the FWW issues in which they appeared, but they're contained in Taunton's, "Fine WoodWorking, on Joinery" publication. Ian Kirby's article, "The Haunched Mortise and Tenon, How to Strengthen the Corner Joint," explains the haunched M&T joint and why it is so useful in door frame construction. In a large door, the tenons of the horizontal members are wide enough to cause problems due to wood movement and the haunched variety solves that problem. Tage Frid's, "How to Hang a Door" and "Solid Wood Doors, How to make Them and Keep them Flat" in the same issue are invaluable. The second article answers your questions about how to properly make a "plank" door.There are many other pertinent articles in that publication including "Entry Doors, Frame-and-Panel Construction is Sturdy, Handsome," by Ben Davies and "The Frame and Panel, Ancient system still offers infinite possibilities," by Ian Kirby.Last, while frame and panel is the way to go for a door, the most successful way to make the frame members themselves has not been solid wood, but "stave core" construction, probably the earliest example of "engineered" wood methods. This method uses "skins" of "show wood" over a glued-up inner core of quarter-sawn members which can be of lower-quality, in terms of appearance.Of course, to be able to carve the show veneer, it would have to be thicker than normally engineered.Rich

   Edited 3/11/2007 4:15 pm ET by Rich14

   
1. 
   bszydlo | Mar 11, 2007 11:48pm | #4

   Rich, what is the std. thickness of the show veneer? Is it standard veneer or is it resawn thicker?

1. 
   Rich14 | Mar 12, 2007 12:32am | #6

   BSzydlo,I don't know if there is a "standard" to the thickness of the face veneers. Google on "stave core" and you'll get companies that offer custom work. They probably have a selection of measurements.Rich

2. 
   Noll1962 | Mar 11, 2007 11:48pm | #5

   Thanks so much for the additional info and the drawing. 

   Mark

    

1. 
   Rich14 | Mar 12, 2007 12:33am | #7

   Mark,Good luck!Rich

2. 
   JohnWW | Mar 12, 2007 05:03pm | #8

   There is no reason why a well made plank door wouldn't stay flat.  The doors described in the previous posting were poorly made by carpenters with no technical training.  With a reasonable amount of care you can make a plank door that will be as stable as a M&T door.

   John White, Shop Mananger, Fine Woodworking Magazine 

1. 
   xmike | Mar 12, 2007 08:07pm | #9

   Hi John,Actually, the two in my family room were made by an experienced finish carpenter who has made many, many of them.They were flat when they were made, but 52 years of seasonal humidity changes in Louisville have taken their toll.In the case of my two, the planks are still flat against the battens and against the diagonal. It's just that the whole assemblies have twisted - by one inch from the frame at one corner on one, and by one half inch from the corner frame on the other. The doors have not sagged on their hinges, and the lock still fits into it's strike when closed.Looking at the doors, I'm not sure that even dovetailing the battens would have made much difference - the door has twisted just as if it were a single large board with some small reaction wood still in it when it was planed. The assembly is tongue & grove, by the way.Mike D

1. 
   JohnWW | Mar 12, 2007 08:43pm | #10

   Mike,

   For a plank door to stay flat you have to view its construction as being a modification of a M&T door.  The two outer planks and the two or three horizontal battens are assembled to form a rigid rectangular frame, the rest of the vertical elements are just filler, working the same as a floating panel in a M&T door.

   If you choose good, straight grained, twist free stock for the framework, and join it properly at the corners, the frame will stay as flat as any M&T door. 

   The level of workmanship, and the amount of time spent, to properly assemble a plank door is about the same as required to build a M&T door, so there are no great savings in building a plank door, but it can be done and the door will stay flat.

   John W.

2. 
   xmike | Mar 13, 2007 05:48am | #11

   Terrific insight! I would have never thought of this door construction in terms of frame and panel construction.So I'm assuming that the problem with the doors that I've seen in the past is that the builder fastened the battens firmly to each and every board (this is, in fact the case with my doors). This effectively defeats the ability of the center "panel" to float. And, For a tightly fitting tongue and grove construction, I can see that this would be fatal over time. (edit - if you DON'T attach each vertical to the battens, what keeps them from wandering downward due to gravity?)However, if you were to use relatively loosely fitting battens floating in groves between boards, this (attaching the battens to each board) might not prove to be as great a problem, as each individual board would be free to expand/contract without impacting it's fellows, vis-a-vis the floating battens in their groves.The teaser comes with what to do with the diagonal. My thought is that, regardless of whether this diagonal is attached only at the edges, or to every vertical, this long board adds another element of stress to the frame if it chooses to flex in any direction. Yet it taken as a "given" that the diagonal is necessary to keep the heavy door from sagging over time.Isn't woodworking fun!Mike D

   Edited 3/12/2007 10:50 pm ET by Mike_D