Why just the other night I was going in circles till I bumped until myself!
Yeah I know, just what you wanted to hear…………….
Sorry,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 7/3/2008 2:56 pm ET by KiddervilleAcres
Replies
I'll guess you are talking about what I learned as Compound Curve or Double Curve work. An example would be an arched head door and frame that are in a curved wall. The door and frame will be curved in both plan and elevation. Curved in 3 dimensions.
If that's what you mean, the answer is yes.
No, we don't use any computers or CNC to do the work. It is merely old school, mill man type layout.
We also do twisted work like curved stairs, but that is curved only in two dimensions.
Dave S
http://www.acornwoodworks.com
I'll assume my previous assumptions hold. Radial in plan and elevation, fr'instance.
No electrons used for layout. Old school works just fine and is more direct. Easier to visualize and execute.
The real space, 3-d layout is the trickiest part. Draw in plan and also in elevation. Then make templates for each of the two major radii. We determine how to get there once we see the actual scale of things, where it needs to do what, profiled, veneered, or whatever. Stack laminations usually come into play, if not for the actual workpiece, then for a form/template. Depending upon the final product, if it gets molded, there are usually glue lines to deal with, and therefore laid out so as to diminish.
I am trying to attach a photo of a simple project. A stock half-round head window in a curved wall, with extensions and casings in compound curves.
Dave S
Bent lamination of curves means springback until you get enough laminations to overcome same (lots and lots). The popular 'calculators' don't really work except in giving one a false sense of security.
From what you propose, I would want to eliminate springback from the scene entirely. Trying to out think all those laminations will make one crazy. You need predictable, testable curves that will not move.
One way to insure no springback is to stack laminate, then face with thin solids. We do arched door jambs with a stacked, bricklaid lamination, and add 1/8" or thinner to the sawn curve to present one piece look. This also stiffens the bricklaid assembly, more so if you add thin solid to both inside and outside of the curves.
Depending upon the sizes of your parts, you could go as far as stabilizing the parts with cross banding under the face veneers. This woulds render the part stable, like a cross banded veneered panel. Just a suggestion.
We have built several passage doors in curved walls, with arched heads. It really is not that hard, but it does eat up some material and time.
I tried to post photos twice. I give up.
Dave S
I am not sure that I was following exactly what you are trying to do, but would be interested in seeing photos or plans. You can email them to me, or even to acornw without posting them on the site. Can you email photos?
Here is a sample of some of my work, if this qualifies for what you have termed double circular.
http://www.woodcentral.com/shots/shot728.shtml
You can email anyone on the site by clicking on their name.
Keith,Beautiful piece. You have good taste.John
A while back there was a post about what it takes to be a craftsman.You don't have to look much further than Keith's pictures to see what it takes to design and execute and to be a craftsman.This piece should be on the front and back page of Fine Woodworking!!Thank you for sharing these pictures,Vance
Vance,
This piece should be on the front and back page of Fine Woodworking!!
Yes I agree and I tried. Keith has a lot more too.
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
I sent them photos, and offered to write and article for methods on making and joining works with compound curved sides, but couldn't get them to go with it. They were willing to go with it if we only showed how to join the curved parts, but then nothing more about how to use them. I have tried several times to get their attention with more advanced projects, but they assure me that they know their market, and that the knots group is not the normal reader but more of a select group. So it really didn't matter how much complaining I heard on here about dumbing down.I want to thank you fellows for the compliments, but it looks like the information that I would like to share with you will likely go with me to my grave. Other than what answers I can give on here.
Keith,
I wonder how many folks in here saw your blog article? After seeing that and your work it dumbfounds me what FWW is thinking.
the knots group is not the normal reader Hrrruuummmmmpppph, guess it's time we all realized that it aint gonna be what made it what it was......... At least there's still Knots.
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Keith,
it looks like the information that I would like to share with you
Well, let's have at it!
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Love your work , Have you ever seen this piece.
Yes I have. I think Brian is the best, most creative wood / artist alive on Earth, and perhaps better than any over the last century. He seems to have the whole package. His designs are very original, well executed and finished out of wonderful materials. And he seems to have the marketing part worked out, which gives him the freedom to make his best dreams come true. I wish I could figure that last part out for myself.Here is a link to his site. http://www.briannewell.jp/
Kieth , thanks for the link . Truly amazing stuff. It dose not get better than that.
Would like to see more of your work.
Tom
Edited 7/10/2008 10:40 am ET by gofigure57
Edited 7/10/2008 10:41 am ET by gofigure57
I really like what he did with that cicada table, which is strongly influencing my thinking for one that I would like to do. Mine would be Dragonfly though. I have always like to let nature influence my work. I was out paddling my canoe around midnight Saturday and I took some wonderful macro photos of a dragonfly right after it emerged from its exuvia. The dragon was only a few inches over the water, so I had to kneel cross-ways in the canoe, leaning over the side. I had to hold onto a little root of the tree with my left pinky, while holding a little flashlight on the subject with the rest of that hand, so my camera could find focus. Of course I had only my right hand for the camera and all its controls in this awkward position. I am nuts I guess, I had shot an alligator very near there only a few hours earlier. I was lucky to have gotten anything, but I have to say that i am quite proud of what I got, and some of the details from this would surely look good worked into a piece of that nature.
Hum,,,, I am really wanting to do some nouveau pieces, I have some ideas that are burning a hole in my brain. I keep trying to put the fire out by poring beer on it, so it is almost gone.
I would lean toward the pivot hinge if I were you. You can see what I did on the side doors of Coming Home To Roast. If you try to use them on the side, the bulge between the pin will be bulging out, and bind as the door opens. Unless they are close together, which will diminish any support that you would gain by having a wider spread.
If you are going with the brick-lay method, I would choose and match my wood, and not even think of veneering.
If you are stuck on using a really great veneer, I would be thinking about another approach. One that I have been doing mental push-ups on but have not tried, is to carefully make a pair of templates to clamp and hold the veneers for routing the ( ) sides like making a globe. I would then tape those together, and then lay on a thin already wet-out fiberglass cloth. I would v-bag them together, then build inward with more boat type tricks, like balsa core, more glass etc.
Beyond That, another approach to make the parts is to start green, as in the whole tree. Then turn out large shallow bowl shapes, or whatever shape you need the parts to be while they are still green. I built myself a 3000# 5 hp lathe a few years ago which makes this part easy. Then dry the parts using the normal bowl drying methods, and make parts from them later.
I offered to teach a class on that method last year, but only had one person sign up for the class, so it didn't make. I guess I am not well enough known to draw like the big name guys. Since I earn my living as a woodworker, I have to take what my market will stand, and lately I am in survival mode, with very boring, un-challenging work.
OK Dude, what time will the porridge be ready?
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
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