Replies

1. 
   TJW | Jun 30, 2003 01:43am | #1

   BG:

   If you have to leave the column round, the dovetail shoulder has to be carved to match the column.  You can't test fit the dovetail until that is done.  So, cut the slot in the column first,  and then stand the post up on a piece of paper and trace the dovetail.  Use that as a template to lay out the tail on the leg.  You can saw out most of the waste but will have to carve the rest.

   Personally, I think shaping the leg to fit the column is harder than shaping the column to fit the leg.  If the design allows it, make a flat on the column equal in width to the leg, than cut the slot as you did before.  You can then easily make the tail on the leg to match.  When I make these I set a dovetail bit in the router table as high as the slot is deep and then cut the tail with the leg held vertically.  You can make it a little fat to start with and then take off small amounts until it fits perfectly.   I hope this helps.

   Tom Witzig

1. 
   BG | Jun 30, 2003 03:37am | #3

   Tom,

   It does help.  Strangly, the article does not address this issue at all.  They used 7/8" thick legs and cut the tail first with a 1/2" straight bit and then an oversized 8 degree dovetail bit.  That leaves an 1/8" hanging out there on each side...flapping in the breeze....lol.

   I'm using 3/4 stock and first cut with a 1/4" straight bit and then a dovetail bit regualr size.  I think it will be a lot easier to flatten a 1/4" on each side of the opening....and probably need to make the pin a little less long also.  I'll just fiddle a bit with a sanding block and a sharp knife.

   Of course, i still have the jig ...and hitting it with a 3/4" bit to flatten the top would be easy too...  Thanks

2. 
   ron61 | Jun 30, 2003 02:22am | #2

   I just built a 3 legged candle stand with dovetailed legs into the column- What I did was to get a straight bit in the router and made a 3/4 flat on the post where the legs meet the post It worked great & looks fine. Easy to do.

   I've seen in books where they carve out the legs in the dovetail shoulders to fit the dia. of the post

1. 
   BG | Jun 30, 2003 03:46am | #4

   Beans,

   Yes, I'm comming to the conclusion I need to address this.  Lke I just told TJ, I still have the jig and throwing the post back in there and running the router over it with a 3/4" bit would be the fastest.

   When and if I do this...I guess the mouth of the tail will open up a bit...but as long as the fit is tight and the pin goes all the way to the base of the tail ..the strength should not be effected much?

   Opps ! i think I just detected a problem.  When you flattened with the router, was that before you did the dovetail tail...or after?  

   I think if I flatten the tail portion now...I'll need to reset the pin cutter to reflect not quite as deep a pin..and thicker at the top.

   Edited 6/29/2003 8:55:24 PM ET by BG

1. 
   TomFerreira | Jun 30, 2003 05:22am | #5

   BG,

   I think your right. Now that you have the slot cut you cannot flatten the top without changing the geometry. If you have already cut the pins you will never get there from here. I think the best thing to do would be to chamfer the shoulders inward with a hand chisel to get a good fit on the out side of the shoulder. This may still cause a geometry problem but not as much as flattening.

   TDF

1. 
   BG | Jun 30, 2003 01:15pm | #6

   Tom,

   Luckily, I have not cut the pins yet to match the tails so I can make the column flat and then modify the pins to the new depth/height. 

   I'm sure the shakers carved the shoulders to accomodate the round column...one of those subtle ways of showing off to their friends.  While I prefer to stay away from the power tools, at this point, and make my mistakes more slowly by hand, the 3 1/2" pins could turn out to be a real mess if I tried to free hand 1/4" arches down their length.  The shakers probably had a hand plane profile for doing just this.

1. 
   TomFerreira | Jul 01, 2003 04:35am | #7

   BG

   Yeah, I agree that trying to make the shoulders curved or concave would be difficult, but I wonder if you could just undercut them with a chamfer so that the outside edges meet the column. The inside might have a little gap, but I doubt that anyone but you would notice.

   TDF

2. 
   BG | Jul 01, 2003 05:24am | #8

   Tom,

   The saga continues...

   I flattened the area around the tail with a scraper and a little paring with the chisel..came out okay.  I cut the pins on my crappy little router table and set it up so they would be tight.  After a touch or two with the file I was ready for sanding and glue up.....or so I thought.

   Interestingly, the 2 1/2" column that has the tails...ain't quite 2 1/2" over the whole 3 1/2"...so the pins stand a little proud of the tail slots at the top...back to the file and all came out okay...kinda.  It changed the angle of the leg ever so slightly...and the joint is a tiny bit loose at the top. 

   I'm learning  lot on this project.   If the dovetails were shorter I definitely would have tried to do it by hand and back cut a bit like you suggest.  I also would forget the 8 degree slope, cut a 1/2' slot and pare out 1/8" on each side in the tail...if by hand.  The pin would be much easier then and the back cut would be much less. If I do this again maybe I should consider one inch tennon and pin it through the column.  

3. 
   DonStephan | Jul 01, 2003 05:39am | #9

   Initially I used a straight bit in the jig to flatten the column around the dovetail slot, and it always came out a bit too wide, and it took too much time. Now I just use a card scraper to make the flats - comes out better at a fraction of the time.

   John Kassay's book of Shaker furniture has measured drawings of some beautifully proportioned candlestands.

4. 
   BG | Jul 01, 2003 02:55pm | #10

   Don,

   This candle stand is a copy of the Lebanon, NY shaker one.  The article never says how thick the top should be.  I just did a google on shaker furniture and none of he pictures indicated the top thickness either. Does your book indicate what the thickness should be?  thanks