Replies

1. 
   douglas2cats | Oct 09, 2005 04:21am | #1

   Dye stains dont have pigment suspended in solution. Those pigment particles settle on top of the wood and mask the figure somewhat. Dye stains are more transparent. The original grain figure will still be visible. Makes for a bit more visual depth to the wood. The gel type stains (still a pigment stain) work a little better on pine than regular pigment stain, but pine is especially difficult to get an even color with pigment stains due to it's tendency to have a case of the blotchies. That problem wont totally go away with dye stains, but IMHO it's not as apparent. BUT - (there's always a BUT) - since it IS more transparent, you're still going to see pine grain/figure/knots. Using a walnut color dye would give you the walnut color but pine knots are still going to look like pine knots. Might not be the look you want. A pigment stain might succeed at masking those enough that you wouldn't notice it's pine unless you started looking at it a bit more closely.

   Waddaya mean it wont fit through the door?

1. 
   Yogi | Oct 09, 2005 09:14am | #3

   So in this case the pigment stain might have been the right idea afterall, but for reasons I, as is so often the case, didn't know-  Thank you-  What dye stains have you had the best luck with?  Much obliged-

1. 
   douglas2cats | Oct 09, 2005 03:06pm | #6

   I've used the TransTint dyes, Mosers, and another whose name escapes me at the moment. I've had good results with all of them. They're all usually offered in water-based, alcohol-based, or oil based versions. I think the water based are supposed to be more color-fast over time but they'll raise the grain so you've got to do some pre-wetting and sanding first to knock down the fuzz before applying the dye. The alcohol based dyes can be added to shellac which is kind of handy. I haven't personally used the oil-based type so I'm not sure what the plusses/minuses are there. You probably want to choose a type that's not re-dissolved by the same solvent as what's in your top finish coats or you can get a little color bleed. Ex: dont use water-based dye under water-based poly.Waddaya mean it wont fit through the door?

2. 
   BG | Oct 09, 2005 05:22am | #2

   Yogi,
   One of the advantages is you can achieve any color with the three primary dyes...if you want to....cuts down on a lot of half cans of stain.
   http://www.homesteadfinishing.com/htdocs/tech_dyes.htm#Transtints

1. 
   Yogi | Oct 09, 2005 09:16am | #4

   BG-  Thank you-  Are there dye stains you personally prefer to use?  Whyz that?  Much obliged-

1. 
   BG | Oct 09, 2005 01:08pm | #5

   Yogi,
   I'm too new to the finishing process to have a preference based on performance. The TransTint Dyes appear to offer quite a range of solutions and lots of flexibility....while keeping costs and repeat trips to the store down.

2. 
   LarryMartin | Oct 10, 2005 01:51pm | #10

   That was a very helpful link. Thanks.

3. 
   Jfrostjr | Oct 09, 2005 04:44pm | #7

   I like to use dye for the reasons mentioned. The pigmnent particles in stain tend to produce blotchy finishes. Dyes penetrate the wood fibers and result in a more even coloring. Two or more colors can be mixed, or applied in succession, then sealed before the 'wear coats' are applied. I prefer the liquid TransTint dyes.

   Good luck.

   Jerry

1. 
   Yogi | Oct 09, 2005 06:38pm | #8

   My thanks to you guys-  It's all much appreciated-

4. 
   HowardAcheson | Oct 09, 2005 06:46pm | #9

   Just a comment, most oil based stains--and all Minwax oil stains--are a combination of dye and pigment.  When you open the can, the gunk on the bottom that you must stir into suspension is the pigment.  However, the dark liquid on top before stirring is dye stain.  I have occasionally just decanted the top liquid when I needed a dye stain.

   Howie.........