I need to replace my hearing protection. Reviewing the possibilities I saw a noise attenuating, pair of muffs. The propaganda sounds good but I have no experience with them. Would be interested in feed back accordingly. Is the extra $10 warrented?
Thanks, Dave
Replies
How loud are your machines and how large is the room where they're located? If it's a small room, you need more attenuation because you're always close to the sound sources. You can also treat the walls and/or ceiling to reduce the reflected sound and this doesn't need to be expensive. The silicone rubber or foam ear plugs actually do a good job of reducing the sound to a less dangerous level but some aren't very comfortable.
You're worried about $10 when we get one set of ears? Once they're toast, they don't come back. If your ears ring, you already have permanent hearing damage.
I'm not concerned about the $10, I just don't want to spend money on somthing that is useless.So back to my question, is the noise attentuation you get for the $10 worth the additional funds over the unattenuated ear protectors?
Are they saying these are attenuated and everything else isn't?
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
I think we're have a communication problem. The attenuated ear muffs are electronic. They put out a signal that negates or amoreliates the noise coming from external sources. That is in addition to the normal muffling effect one gets from the static muffs. The static muffs only reduce the incoming external noises via insulation.
Yes, active electronic noise reduction works, there is a noticeable reduction of noise, if you can afford them, and your work habits allow you to get away with just having one pair, get them. My tools are scattered and some are portable so I try to have a pair with each workstation so that would be pricey if I went with noise canceling ear muffs, so I use the cheapies myself and hope it's sufficient.
I've bought several pairs of ear muff type ear protectors over the years, and from my experience, they are labeled with information on how much sound they cut. I would just look for the most efficient pair you can find and buy them. The last pair I bought are better than the previous, but I kept the old ones. Now, if I have visitors while I'm working, I can offer them something to wear. And, I keep several pairs around the shop anyway so they're always within reach and tend to get used more often. There are a lot of safety practices I ignore (probably unwisely so), but I always put on the headset -- as highfigh said, once your ears are toast, you're not getting them back.
I haven't used that type of ear protector, however the ones that I have seen advertised for shooters and high noise environments cost 1 or 2 hundred dollars. So based on your cost difference of $10.00. I would be sceptical of the performance unless they are made by someone like "Peltor". Here is a link to a safety company to give you some idea of the range of what is out there, and it's by no means complete. (Don't take it as an endorsement of the company.)
http://www.labsafety.com/search/Default.htm?N=4294966963+4294966962+4294964079&Nu=dept%5Fid
ThanksThe one's I'm referring to are sold by Lee Valley, Woodcraft, etc. The plain one's are 20, the electronic ones are 30.I've used the plain ones for several years working in industry and recently broke them. So I thought someone might have some experience with the others.Dave
wow, how cool, it looks like the price has dropped to everyday use levels. I trust Lee Valley to sell good equipment for what it's worth; I've yet to be let down by something they sell. The link is here:http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=49918&cat=1,42207,42227
"The attenuated ear muffs are electronic. They put out a signal that negates or amoreliates the noise coming from external sources." (This from post 5 of 10.)The difference between the above and the ear protectors you are looking at is, the cheap ones have a microphone/speaker system that "plays" the sounds that it picks up in the speech frequencies in the headset at a volume that won't damage the hearing. They do not have any noise canceling properties so the rating of the muff is important. They just modify what you hear to make conversation a bit easier to understand. I have a pair of the Peltor PTL's that work in a similar fashion. When the mic is on someone speaking is easier to understand and a loud noise is clipped. When nobody is speaking all the other noises in that range are amplified and I find that annoying. The Peltor cuts out after 30 seconds but that means you have to switch it on over and over if the conversation is longer, which is also annoying. When I do put them on it's when I have to do something where a machinist may come up and talk to me for a moment and it's too loud to take them off.http://www.labsafety.com/search/default.htm?N=4294966963+4294966962+4294964079+4294950967&dept_id=42678The muffs that I like the best and wear the most are the Peltor Optime 105. Plain, light, and with a 30 Db rating.http://www.labsafety.com/search/default.htm?N=4294966963+4294966962+4294964079+4294888738&dept_id=54572However on Monday nights I like to listen to the Blues when I'm at work and that's when I slip on the Peltor Worktunes.http://www.labsafety.com/search/default.htm?N=4294966963+4294966962+4294964079+4294950935&dept_id=14123If you do get a pair of those "orange ones" please report back with your impressions of them since I recall the same question coming up in the past.One other thing. In extremely loud environments (jet engines at run up for eg.) use plugs and muffs to increase the protection. Just know that the plugs only add about 5 Db more protection to what the muff is rated for. A 26 Db muff + 26 Db plugs = 31 Db max protection, not 52 Db. Sound measurement is logarithmic and not added together.
thanks QCI, I hadn't heard of this kind of muff before so I assumed it was the same as the noise canceling muffs. Very nice to learn more about hearing protection.
I found that the peltor's (the black with the red stripe) were the best db. reduction for the price from most of the on line tool sellers. In considering those other foxy models, do you really need to hear the radio when you should be looking not to cut your fingers off or just focus on the task at hand, no pun intended. These are simply so good that a friend put them on and said "I can hear my heart beating" and nothing else.
I also use them at the rifle range shooting my 54 cal. Hawkens black power type. No problems, even if I have a yuppy with a super magnum monster in the adjacent station. ps he ain't hitting the paper and I can hold a 4" pattern-Ha.
Look to protect your ears. The noise is insidious and subtle, it hurts you a little bit at a time and you don't realize it. You can get replacement hips, knees etc. but only one set of ears/eyes-same problem. Be rabid about protecting yourself. It's a PITA but the author of this worked in the ship yards as a coppersmith as a young man , rode nuclear subs, strong like bull and DUMB like bull and at 65 has a 25% hearing loss-a real bummer for a musician. i HAVE MY MUFFS AND EYE PROTECTION HANGING NEXT TO THE MAIN POWER SWITCH FOR MY SHOP. Regards. Pat
Are shooters ear muffs suitable for a shop environment? I know that with shooting you are blocking fast, impulse sound rather than a continuous sound found in a shop.
I bought the black Peltor model with the thin red stripe from a wood workin site because of the high db rating and took them to the range when my very old AO tan muffs died. The Peltor's shut out everything -even the girlfriend- they were not a lot of money and they are comfortable too. I wish I could give ya a model # but they moved with the 13" planner, the TS and the DC in my last trip to the new shop in TN. Pat
My personal preference is for ear plugs over ear muff/headset type.
With these plugs, one can carry-on a normal conversation; but the wafers inside the cylinder "slam shut" when a loud, harmful noise occurs. With these, you do not experience that "underwater" feeling.
Since my hearing is still excellent at 60, my product choice must have worked, as advertised.
See them at http://store.yahoo.com/earplugstore/sonicvalveii.html
No financial connection, whatsoever; just a satisfied customer of 40 years.
Practice...'till you can do it right the first time.
I buy silicon ear plugs from the drug store. I think they're intended for swimming, but they work really well for blocking noise.
I worked on a seismic vessel for a time, and there were crew members that swore by these things. They had noise cancelling earmuffs, noise cancelling earphones for their MP3 players... I've never used the ear muffs but the ear phones were amazing. It would completely eliminate the noise of the ship as well as the seismic airguns.
Stay clear of the 'electronic' ones they sell at LV. Not worth the box they come in. I found that the electronocs were a little slow. When I first powered up a noisey machine it would blast it into my ear for a split second... As well the microphone would allow some noise through.
I've been using the ZEM hearing protectors and in my opinion they work better than the muffs. Most of my friends have moved to them as well. As an added advantage they don't interfere with my safety glasses. I work in a garage and am able to leave the door open, at least on nice days in the summer.
Good luck, and let us know what you decide.
What brand did those crew members wear? I've a pair I got from a local department store that are OK but don't block enough outside noise. I'd like to get something that blocks at lease 30db, blocks electronically, and is comfortable to wear for long (hours at a time) periods. I've got a significant loss of hearing...... have had, since my teen years. Probably was shooting induced, not rock music. I wear protection like a religion. I don't want it to get worse. I can't hear birds sing or the ring of most cell phones. Worse, I miss major parts of conversations.Those who are ignoring this thread should be slapped into reality.Norm talks about shop safety, but seldom is seen wearing hearing protection. And I've never seen Tom Silva with it, nor his crew, on This Old House. A shame.
Maybe Silva, etc didn't use protection but on one 'Inside This Old House' episode, they had an OSHA inspector on and he demo'd different sound sources and forms of protection, as well as covering the fact that impulse is extremely harmful. A hammer striking a nail at 1/2 Meter was in the 130db range. That's a very common occurrence for a framer and I almost never see those guys with plugs or muffs. I always have a set of plugs with me and when I go to see a band, I get a lot of strange looks when someone sees my bright yellow earholes. I don't care.
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
Sorry I don't know what the brand of muffs were.
I'm fairly religious about hearing protection as well. Genetic hearing loss run's in my mother family, so I don't think I'm going to try to speed that along if I can help it. So far so good.
Lots of woodworkers seem to treat noise as more of an annoyance than a danger.
My 2 cents...
I recently broke 2 pair of cheepies that I have had for many years - something better than nothing - and started looking for a replacement. It occurred to me that the old ones, though somewhat effective, were not effective at all when I did not wear them. Unfortunately, I often did not.
Solution? I bought a set of "Work Tunes" hearing protector muffs with a built in AM-FM radio. I'm sure you can find more effective muffs, but you won't find any you'll wear more regularly! An that's the key.
I find myself wearing these between tool uses whereas I used to get out from under the old muffs as soon as I turned off a tool and then sometimes forgot to put them back on. The FM reception is quite good (stereo), though the AM is subject to changes in reception when moving around and can pick up some static from machines, though rarely and only a little.
Bottom line, they're no good at all unless you wear them, so why not buy something that you're more likely to wear?
Regard it as just as desirable to build a chicken house as to build a cathedral.
Frank Lloyd Wright
I just received a pair of ZEMS earplugs from Lee Valley. I was a little dismayed by the cheap quality of this hearing protection device. That is perhaps secondary to their performance. Has anyone had real life shop experience with these? If I don't get some positive feedback, these are going back north.
Yes, I have a pair. They actually work very well. They seem to cut the noise by as much as my muff style protectors and those are rated at 31db I believe. I wear mine with the band below my chin where they don't rub on my head or neck. If they do rub, the rubbing sound is transferred to the ear...... it's muted but a little bothersome. You'll find out. What you do not want to do is give them a tap with a hammer or mallet while they're in your ears. They direct that knock directly into your ear..... ouch! I repeat...... Oh S***!!!!!!Despite this shortcoming I still like them, I'm just more careful. I don't wear them anymore when hammering. But they fit easily into an apron pocket to be ready for machine cutting as I wander through the shop.Keep them, they aren't a cure-all but still a nice part of the protection package.
I purchased headphone style hearing protection from Lee Valley. LV's standard protection #22R1001. I like them. They're comfortable and you can hear normal conversation very well - yet the irratating machine pitch is muffled.I have never been able to tolerate ear plugs very well. They don't do the job that muffs do and they're uncomfortable.
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