Any and all,
recently I ebonized some oak hoping to turn it to as black as possible. The mixture of vinegar and rusty items I used was about a couple hours old. The oak did turn black but not the color of black as one would imagine to see in a bottle of black ink.
So, how does someone really ebonize oak?
Thanks
Replies
Ammonia will work.Be sure to allow proper ventilation when you mix with ferrous metals.
How long does that take? I fumed some white oak for two or three days, and the darkest I got was a medium dark brown with a green tint. Nice color, but nowhere near ebony black.
Uncle Dunc,
Fuming is done to create a rich brown color, not an ebony. Even with industrial strength ammonia, which is potentially dangerous to work with, a medium to dark brown is the darkest the oak will get.
Traditional ebonizing requires the presence of iron to get the black color and the solution must be applied to the wood.
John W.
It looks like I misread JACKPLANE's post. This is the first I've heard about mixing iron and ammonia. I guess the iron / tannin reaction wouldn't have as much work to do if the ammonia had already turned the oak dark brown.
That makes me wonder if the vinegar is really necessary in the traditional ebonizing formula or if just a solution of iron in water would do the same thing. Maybe the vinegar is just there to speed up the rusting.
I was going to suggest they guy use black ink, but I couldn't think of a way to word it that didn't sound snotty.
I'm also fairly sure I've seen black dyes from the various wood dye manufactureres.
I stand corrected; ammonia will produce,with the prescence of iron, a rich brown, varying in depth but not a true ebony black.As stated by another,alcohol or aniline dye is probably best for this.Although "english oak" by Watco/Minwax is about the darkest I've seen in a penetrating oil.
I HAVE EXCELLENT RESULTS EBONIZING WHITE OAK USING SOME MANNER OF SEALED CHAMBER, ANYTHING FROM A ZIPLOCK BAG FOR SMALL PIECES OF OAK TO A VIZQUEEN-FRONTED BOX FOR FUMING ASSEMBLED DOORS. YOU WILL NEED TO USE STRONG AQUEOUS AMMONIA, 27%. GET SOME FROM AN ARCHITECT FRIEND, FUME OVERNIGHT TO A GREYISH COLOR WHICH WILL BECOME THE COLOR OF OLD BLACK WALNUT WHEN YOU FINISH IT. THIS IS A PERFECT APPLICATION FOR SHELLAC. I've also used the solution from steelwool dissoved in white vinagar to ebonize white oak. Several applications produced a good black color with brown undertones, however, the finish will wear off since it's only a surface reaction like most storebought stains. The 27% ammonia treatment requires caution but penetrates up to 1/16 inch so leave your final finish sanding until after the fuming. Your nose will tell you when you're too close!
Edited 12/16/2003 8:32:39 PM ET by SAROUK
Jose,
The finishing section of Fine Woodworking in issue #162 covers ebonizing. The color is achieved with commercial dyes followed by black lacquer, no mention of the vinegar technique.
John W.
Simply use dye. I like to start with a water diluted analine followed up with an alcohol mixed analine. This works for me because my two dyes are different blacks and they combine together to a third which I like. Also, the alcohol dye seems to wet-out the wood, expecially in the open pours, where the water dye wont.
Jose,
Some years ago I darkened some oak to nearly black with brown undertones. I used a Potassium Permanganate solution as a primer, dissolved some iron (from nails and steel wool) in vinegar and applied a liberal application. When I first applied the Potassium Permanganate (a purple color) I thought I had ruined the wood but after the iron/vinegar and a coat of oil finish it turned out just fine. Also I increased the tannin content on some pieces by using tannin powder dissolved in water and applied before the Potassium Permanganate. Also I believe that I had some Potassium Dichromate for the same purpose, but can not be sure. Take care when using chemicals; they are poisonous
acytelene torch?..seriously. I have used lampblack dyes works well.
I needed to do this for a door to cover an electrical meter. Tried several dyes and other techniques, was unable to get the flat black that I wanted. In a moment of frustration, I grabbed a can of flat black rustoleum... it did the trick, a true black yet the grain came through beautifully, I topped it with a spray on satin poly.
The best and blackest dye I have run across so far is made by Hesse Coatings. It's a concentrate, but it works best for ebonizing if you spray on one coat, undiluted. If you reduce it and apply multiple coats, the color doesn't build. The container in my shop says "#10 LDC CN". There may be a supplier in your area that carries it.
Second choice for me is India ink or black drafting ink. It is made with a carbon black, and is a very true black, It also penetrates and lays down well, the few times I have used it.
Michael R.
Jose,
I've attempted to attach a snapshot of a piece of oak plywood to which I applied four sample finishes when I was taking a finishing class.
I've pasted some notes from my finishing notebook below.
After sanding, a mordant of acetic acid and iron oxide (vinegar and rusty metal) was applied to the two upper quadrants, reapplying as necessary to keep the surface fully-wet for twenty minutes. After 20-minutes, I applied black water-borne stain to the upper-right quadrant and left it to dry for a week (until the next class session). Creative C93085 Platinum pigmented stain was applied to the lower-right quadran, left for 20-minutes, and the excess removed with burlap. Quadrant four was left natural.
Next, nitrocellulose sanding sealer was applied to the entire piece, allowed to dry, and sanded smooth using stearated 220-grit aluminum oxide abrasive. Star oil-based natural wood filler, to which bulletin red japan color was added, was then used to fill the pores of the upper-left quadrant treated with mordant only. Star natural wood filler, to which burnt umber japan color was added, was then used to fill the pores of the untreated/natural lower-left quadrant.
After allowing the pore fillers to cure for a week, the pieces were lightly sanded using stearated 220-grit aluminum oxide abrasive, wiped, vacuumed clean, and sprayed with four coats of nitrocellulose lacquer, using an HVLP conversion gun, at half-hour intervals. The next week, the piece was rubbed-out: the entire piece was wet-sanded using 400-grit wet/dry silicon carbide abrasive lubricated with mineral spirits, then 600-grit, 0000 steel wool lubricated with Howard’s, and finally, Liberon Black Bison wax.
I hope this is helpful,
Paul
I HOPE THE PHOTO ATTACHMENT WORKED THIS TIME!Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, you're right.
I have ebonized oak with good results using potasium permangenate. The stuff is fairly soluable in water and I made a strong solution. I don't really keep notes on it, but it is, as I recall, several tablespoons in a pint of water. Also add a few drops of soap to the mix - it helps the permangenate solution flow into the large vessle elements - if you're using red oak. It will take a few coats to do the trick. The first coat or two will make the wood look muddy brown, but don't worry. As soon as the wood surface drys off, sponge on some more solution. It will turn black. Be careful with the solution - it will stain anything it comes in contact with.
I've ebonized oak (years ago in new england, I don't know which oak) using the steel wool - vinegar method and it blackened the oak very well, but was very unsatisfying. The lining of the pores is very hard and dense compared with the rest of the wood and remained light giving an ugly speckled look!
My solution was pure white vinegar 50:50 with water over steel wool in a tightly sealed jar for about 24 hours.
Now, if I want a real ebonized black, I use black walnut with the iron acetate solution (steel wool/vinegar) and it looks like Japenese lacquer work when finished. Before finishing, it's an ugly distressing light gray! Ebonized walnut is GREAT for accents. It is jet black.
By the way, make the solution up and use it - then, toss it. If you keep it too long, the iron oxidizes to Fe+3 and everthing it touches turns an ugly orange brown.
No help in solving your present problem, but a personal aside.
A couple of years ago I received off the back of a truck the stump of a evergreen oak - q. ilex -. large 1.4 to 1.7m dia at earth level and from historical accounts over 100 yrs old. The interesting point is that many of the roots are jet black - must have come into contact with some iron in the soil during its existance. The rays show more than you would normally expect so will always be identifiable. Anything more than 25mm in dia is being carefully saved, for I am certain it could never be replicated. To date have only used 6mm plugs for decoration, plus one frightened mouse trying to hide in a hole!.
Message, if you have an old oak at the bottom of the garden dig in some iron next to the trunk, someday, sometime someone may unearth a treasure .
From my experience vinegar and iron, brushed on over a period of several days will ebonise oak, but only the surface, do not expect deep penitration, not as these roots, continuous up to 100mm.
Years ago I made a table top for my mother in law. It was oak and she wanted it black. I didn't want to laquer it or paint it, so on lark I went to the local supermarket, picked up a packet of Rit black dye and went to work. After 3-4 applications I put a clear hard finish over it and it was absolutely beautiful. It popped the grain right out. That was almost 20 years ago and we have the table in our finished basement today. Dumb luck?....who cares, it still looks good.
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