Hello All,
I operate a one man shop as a hobby/ second-income source and have a very nice selection of tools that all work very well and are basically great! My problem is thinking about time that I have to accomplish things in the shop. Lately, I’ve been asked to do a seemingly unendless amount of cabinetry projects including a fairly large kitchen project.
Here come’s the question:
Would purchasing the Festool Saw, Routers (1010 and 1400), Rotex 6″ Sander, MFT Table, Medium sized vac, hole drilling kit, and accessories greatly improve my efficiency as a one man shop and off-set the expense?
Thanks for the input and any help in this matter would be great.
Replies
Personally, No. Buy the tools need for the profession, if you want to work in that profession. For a one-off type thing, then maybe.
I don't think that anything can replace a table saw, except for a sliding one(or a bigger saw). Same goes for most other machines. Cost does have to justify the means.
Sure...
Really, the question you're asking is a loaded one and will likely get no responses ('sides mine :) ) or many. Realistically, I don't feel that the festool equipment does anything that is superior to other alternatives that are available today.
What they DO do, is they offer simple, repeatability and superior safety or dust collection. The sanders are 2nd to none imo for reduced vibration and dust collection (assuming you use a very good vacuum with them Fein or Festool - Own the 33 myself and LOVE it). The routers are all very nice, but come with odd shank requirements so your cost for them could ROCKET since you have a well equipped shop already.
The MFT is excellent for simple repeatable clamping operations, but I prefer my workbench (size and sheer mass). Hole drilling kit? If you're referring to their drills, the offset head makes that a worthwhile investment in itself. the Accessories can be had or left just depends on how much you wish to invest.
my advice? If dust is an issue for you or your hands get tired sanding today, get the Rotex 150 (on closeout currently) and the 150/3 sanders with either a CT22 or CT33 vacuum. The saws are very nice also, I have the ATF unit (predecessor to currect TS) and it cuts very well... but not necessarily superior to any other unit with a proper ZCI and great blade. It simply works very well as a system and sets up fast.
Would you recoup your costs? Maybe. I break down all of my sheet goods with that saw, and that is the only thing I use it for... wouldn't trade it for anything. I wouldn't give my sanders up for anything, they both rock. The routers? eeeh.. I have a LOT of bits that wouldn't work in the 1010 and I am kinda partial to my Bosch for the 2ish hp router. the MFT, see above.
Are they nice? No doubt. Well engineered and well thought out. Are there alternative methods to getting these tasks done? You betcha.
g'luck
michael
Michael, I agree with most of what your saying but I want to clarify that the festool routers do not require the use of 8mm shank bits, which is what I'm assuming you mean by "odd shank requirements". The OF 1010 EQ comes with both 8mm and 1/4" collets. The OF 1400 EQ comes with 1/2", 1/4", and 8mm collets. If I was looking for a new router I would definitely stay away form something that only took 8mm bits so I wanted to clarify so people aren't lead astray and exclude these great routers from their choices.
True, sorry I wasn't clear.
Just comfortable with my current routers, but you're right. The 1400 offers the flexibility needed for an existing bit collection.
They are great products, no doubt about it.
michael
I only have Festool sanders and a CT33 sucker, all of which I rate very highly in terms of sanding performance, ergonomics and dust collection. It took me many sanding hours to wear out a medium pad on the 150/3 random orbital sander - about 500% better than a previous sander of similar type. I replaced the medium pad (that came with the sander) with a hard pad that works very well with the flat-surfaced furniture I mostly make.
You don't have to use Festool sanding discs, by the way. Although they have an unusual 8 + 1 hole pattern, there are manufacturers (at least in Europe) that make discs to fit. I would recommend Hermes discs, which seem to me to perform rather better than Festool's own. (And they're cheaper).
Incidentally, there is an alternative to Festool that seems to provide essentially the same engineering but is cheaper because it is less nicely finished. Mafell (another German manufacturer) make saws, routers and other items that look identical to Festool except they are red and more basic looking. The rumour is that Mafell and Festo share the same supply of tool bodies, motors and other basic parts. (Only a rumour). Don't know if Mafell distribute in the USA.
I have a Mafell biscuit joiner and I rate that very highly too - powerful, accurate and very adjustable.
In the Mafell range, there is a small circular saw (same spec as the Festool) that mounts on a steel roll up guide fence rather than the rigid aluminium extrusion of the Festool. You can carry the whole caboodle about in one of their systainer cases (another common feature with Festool). I don't know if the roll up guide works as well as the rigid version but its a neat idea, especially if you use a long one.
I notice that you are in the UK.It's interesting that there are an array of products that are not available to the US market, and I wonder why. Even Festool has stuff they sell in Europe and other parts of the world, but not here. Do you have a link on the Mafell saw system, so we could at least look it over?Thanks.********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
John,
A link: http://www.mafell.com/produkte/prod_saegen_fr.htm
Lataxe
Thanks for the Mafell link. I notice they don't yet have a US price list, but they do have an office here -- so I assume they are poised to get into this market in a big way.That should be interesting, since they clearly have some stuff that is extraordinarily innovative.********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
If you work with a lot of sheet goods, I would say the Festool saw (or the EZ Smart) are definite time savers. With either system, you will be able to cut your cabinet parts to exact size -- instead of cutting the ply parts to rough size, and then doing the final cuts on your table saw.
However, both systems are subject to your accuracy in marking each cut on the ply, and then consistently placing the guide on your mark. Whereas with the TS, you can set the fence to your measurement, and be assured that every cut for the entire run is exactly the same.
I just made two cabinet carcases using my Festool, and there were some very slight variations in the size of the parts. It wasn't a big problem working around these variations, but I think in the future I will go back to my old practice of running all cab parts thru the TS.
So for me, there won't be any time savings; but the saw does cut with virtually no dust when you use the vac attachment (I've got mine set up on a Fein), and I like that.
The Festool sanders are everything they are cracked up to be. I have two now, and I can only say the dust collection is pretty awesome. You must use their sandpaper, but I was pleasantly surprised that their prices were quite modest when compared to comparable discs.
I already have a flock of routers, so I have not looked carefully at what Festool has to offer. They might make sense for you if you do a lot of your cabinet joinery with a router (I use the TS), since you could then use their guide system.
********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
I agree Nikki. I like the Festool guide system for laying out cuts on sheet goods with the AT55, but you can have slight inaccuracies setting up because of the way the guide's tear away rubber pad meets the guide near the saw blade.
One work around that I have employed: Mark the cutline with a mechanical pencil. Lay and then clamp a straight edge on your line. With the saw on the guide, line up the blade teeth with the straight edge and clamp one side of the guide. Move the saw along the guide and line up the teeth with the straight edge (at the end of the cut)- clamp the guide. Return the saw to the other end of the guide and make certain it hasn't shifted- your saw should now be set to cut true to your line. Remove the straight edge and make your cut.
This procedure works well- any variations I have seen in cuts are usually ¡Ü 1/32". It is easier to do than to describe, and less trouble for me than flipping a 4'x8' sheet of hardwood ply onto a TS.
I'd be curious, however, if anyone else has thought of a better way...Glaucon
If you don't think too good, then don't think too much...
That sounds like a good system, but I think you have more patience than I. I am not giving up just yet (final cuts with the Festool), so I will try your idea and play with it some more. As I said earlier, the discrepancy was not great, and I didn't have a problem working around the slight differences. I do like the idea of using a mechanical pencil for the cut marks. And -- it looks like the rubber pad thingy should be replaced when it starts to get chewed up. I don't know how many cuts I have made since I got the saw, but I would guess it is somewhere way over 100, and the "thingy" is still in fine shape. Aside from the dc, the thing I most liked about the Festool was the fact you could use the saw/guide without clamping it down, which in my world is a real convenience. Even in my salad days, I never tried to muscle a full sheet of plywood through the TS, except maybe 1/4" stuff. I have always used a shooting board to break the sheet down, and then used the TS to cut everything to exact size.********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
<"That sounds like a good system, but I think you have more patience than I. ">
Must be a better way, but I haven't been able to think of it yet...Glaucon
If you don't think too good, then don't think too much...
I'd be curious, however, if anyone else has thought of a better way...
I use both the repeaters and the cabinet maker from Eurekazone.
Both give you repeatability , accuracy and speed.
Visit the eurekazone forum & Saw mill Creek, or do a search on the repeaters at breaktime.
David.
However, both systems are subject to your accuracy in marking each cut on the ply, and then consistently placing the guide on your mark. Whereas with the TS, you can set the fence to your measurement, and be assured that every cut for the entire run is exactly the same.
Nikki.
Call Dino to set you up with the "Cabinet Maker" or the "Repeaters".
http://www.eurekazone.com/products/detail/fs.html
http://www.eurekazone.com/products/detail/ezr18.html
You can use your existing equipments and add accuracy, speed , ease and repeatability.
Or visit the FOG and learn how to make your own F/ EZ Smart Repeaters. :)
David.
Can Dino's repeaters be used with the Festool guide rails, or does one need the EZ guides?Can they (the repeaters) be used without clamping them to the stock?I am aware of the repeaters, but I somehow had it in my head that they were used for narrow stock, rather than cabinet parts (that might be just under 24").In any case, I have thought about getting the EZ guide rails, and then using the Festool saw. I would not call the Festool guide rails flimsy, but they do seem delicate -- fine if they stay in the shop, but not really built to withstand job site abuse (at least not to the extent the EZ guides seem to be with their thicker extrusions).********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
Let me see what I can do with your questions in this thread.
The EZ repeaters do not work on the Festool Rails. The Repeaters mount using the EZ Self-aligning system. This consists of two sliding dove tail design connectors on the back of the rail. Festool has only one slot on the back and is is not designed to self align as the EZ does.
Using the repeaters, does not mean you have to use clamps.
The repeaters are currently being marketed in capacities of 18" and 26". To increase that capacity, two repeaters can be connected.
Burt
I guess I'll post this to you, but it is directed everyone else since there are too many opinions(some biased) floating around and your comment on considering both before making a purchase.
Where I'm at right now, because of my injuries, I'm am wanting something the will mainly resize sheets down to a more manageable size, i.e. weight. . I also currently own a PM66 with a Jet slider attached. All of this in a small 2 car garage
Another reason is to put an actual straight edge on sheet goods, since much of the material is no long "perfectly" straight. This is specially true on melamine products where you start splitting sheets into 12-24" widths and the sheets bow. recently, I have used quite a bit of 3/4" alder plywood and the joints/seams of the veneer are not parallel to the ply. I have also had the same problem with pine veneered plywood.
Right now, I have a 6-8"x100" aluminum straightedge that is used for solid surface and I have been thinking of the festool saw because it seems to be more of a precision saw than the "supply you own saw to our carriage"(EZ Smart), not that I don't like the ability to use a different saw of choice. But I have reservations about using a circular/worm drive saw to produce chip free cuts on melamine. Seems that the EZ system needs to have the saw mount "tweaked" to get clean cuts.
The other desire I have is to produce (exact) square cuts for cabinetry since I do a lot of frameless construction cabinetry. So this means whatever I cut has to be dead on square or building/boring and installing won't come easy.
This is where I have thought about a squaring fence like in the festool, but I'm not sure it is a viable choice because of the setup time and accuracy. My feeling is that if it takes more than a few minutes to initially to setup, it might not be worth it.
This is where I'm at right now, still wondering which way to go...
Edited 2/27/2006 3:12 pm by migraine
migraine
I read your post to nikkiwood, and I'm chiming in to answer one of your questions. For square cuts, festool sells a miter guide which attaches to their guide. It has a full range of any angle you'd like, and is easy to use. It takes a few seconds to attach it to the guide, and it locks the entire saw guide at whatever angle you choose to the piece of stock. You can actually look it up on the festool site under accesories for the TS 55. I bought it in the kit with clamps, guide bars, etc.... for $150.00.... and use it quite frequently, along with everything else in the kit.
Hope this helps.
Jeff
I've said my piece elsewhere about my own voyage into the Festool/EZ debate, so I won't go into the whole thing here. I bought the Festool set-up for 3 basic reasons: 1) I had seen it in operation, and I could buy it locally and have it the same day (no mail order), and if I didn't like it for any reason, I just had to drive it back to the store, 2) I liked the dust collection capability of Festool, and 3) With the information I had at the time, I just didn't see how a crappy CS could render the same quality of cut as the woefully expensive Festool saw. I have still never seen the EZ in action, but Burts, GWA, and other EZ users have convinced me that the EZ (even with a "crappy" CS) can deliver cuts as good as the Festool. So I am pretty much convinced cut quality is a moot point when comparing the two systems. Part of your decision should rest on how important dc is in your situation. I have the PC saw Dino recommends, and hooking up a hose to the nozzle on the saw helps a lot, but I can attest to the fact that it doesn't come close to the Festool -- which after all, was engineered from the get-go for dc.As far as the Festool square is concerned (touted by Jeff Heath), you should look it up on the website. IIRC, it is a small affair, intended mainly for the MFT table, and not really designed to give you dead-on square cuts on a plywood sheet. From the comments in this thread, and my own studying of the EZ web site (much better than it used to be), I think Dino's repeaters win this particular battle. If the Festool square does not work (with plywood sheets), it is certainly possible to rig up some sort of t-square type jig for the Festool rails, but the EZ system has a simple elegance to it. But it is also true, that if the ply sheet is not square to begin with (often a problem for me with Baltic birch), you are fried with either system.Finally, I would think about versatility. You probably already have a flock of routers laying around, and if you ever want to use them with the guide rail, it is simple to do so with the EZ system. I also like the idea that you can hang a portable planer off the router set-up, which for some on-site stuff, could be very handy.With Festool, you must use their routers. I hear they are good, but they are also expensive. So in the end, if I were making the decision today, I think I would opt for the EZ. That's not to say I am in any way displeased with the Festool, but I think EZ offers several distinct advantages, with the only downside being dust collection. BTW, even the Festool apparently has problems with the Melamine, at least that's what I have read in the FOG. there was some talk there about all melamine is "not created equal" and if you stay with the better stuff (Roseburg was one brand that was praised), you should not have a problem. As you can tell, I don't work much with melamine. BTW 2, like you, I have a PM 66, and for years I used a shooting board to break down sheets of ply, and then cut them to final dimensions on the TS, trimming off all four sides for a good, smooth cut. Just last week, I used the Festool all the way for two large cabinets; I thought it was too much fiddling around (unless you have various size guide rails so you don't have to disassemble them). So in the future, I will probably use the Festool to break the sheet, and do my final cuts on the TS -- but I won't have to redo the Festool cut. Hope all this helps. The good new is, there is no bad decision here.********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
I am a one man cabinet/furniture shop. I purchased the festool TS 55 guide with CT33 about 2 months ago. I have absolutely loved it. I set up a low table with a 4X8 sheet of mdf on it, and another 4X8 sheet of polystyrene on top of the mdf for cushion. I process all my sheet goods on this table, and can't imagine any other table (next to a commercial slider that is too big for my needs and about 10 times the money) that would be better and cost only 35 bucks. ( the table was my old kitchen table, slated for the landfill after I finally made my wife a new one.)
I no longer have to try to slide 4X8 sheets of veneer core ply awkwardly through the table saw. Nikkiwood is correct, exact repeatability is tough, but I can get to within tolerances that are very acceptable, and unconcerning to the project. At the end of the day, I get more accomplished, and am not so tired after picking up the large heavy sheets. I easily processed 19 sheets in a little over half a day, and hardly broke a sweat.
I also use the guide and saw to straightline one edge on rough lumber, a little easier than running a 10 foot board of 6/4 cherry through the bandsaw.
I also have the Rotex 6" sander, the one that has dual mode. Very impressive, and dust free hooked up to the vac.
I'd say you won't regret your purchase. I haven't. My back appreciates the new tools, too. I would never use it to replace my TS, bandsaw, etc...... but it's a great addition to the shop.
Jeff
I no longer have to try to slide 4X8 sheets of veneer core ply awkwardly through the table saw. Nikkiwood is correct, exact repeatability is tough, but I can get to within tolerances that are very acceptable, and unconcerning to the project. At the end of the day, I get more accomplished, and am not so tired after picking up the large heavy sheets. I easily processed 19 sheets in a little over half a day, and hardly broke a sweat.
Most of the time is wasted on measuring and setting up the guide rails.
At the end of the day, you don't have 2 parts measuring the same.
The problems of inaccuracy, continues with the assembly , the installation and even trying to fit the doors on the boxes.
Take another look at the Repeaters.
Even the web site is getting better.:)
David
I looked at your links only after I had written my last post to you -- with the questions.You're right, the site (at least this part of it) is a big improvement in clarity. It actually made sense to me. And I think I figured out the answers to the questions I raised for you.But here are a few more, for either you or Burts:1) Once you have the repeater set, do you still have to mark the sheet for subsequent cuts? I would think not.2) How reliable is the repeater when cutting the long length of the sheet? Wouldn't it be better to have a repeater mounted on both ends of your guide rail? If you are using just one repeater on the end of the guide, would you mark the far end of the cut (on an 8' sheet) to make sure the guide is lined up properly?3) If I remember correctly the EZ guides are just 50" long. If you have two (joined together) for the long (8') sheet cuts, is there enough room on the small (4") overhang for attaching the repeater -- or do you need a longer guide rail? thanks for your help. ********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
1) Once you have the repeater set, do you still have to mark the sheet for subsequent cuts? I would think not.
Once the repeater is set you do not have to mark the sheet.
2) How reliable is the repeater when cutting the long length of the sheet? Wouldn't it be better to have a repeater mounted on both ends of your guide rail? If you are using just one repeater on the end of the guide, would you mark the far end of the cut (on an 8' sheet) to make sure the guide is lined up properly?
When ripping a full sheet of plywood, you use 2 repeaters - one on each end of the rail. For shorter cuts, you use the square and only need one of the repeaters.
3) If I remember correctly the EZ guides are just 50" long. If you have two (joined together) for the long (8') sheet cuts, is there enough room on the small (4") overhang for attaching the repeater -- or do you need a longer guide rail?
The EZ guide rails come in a variety of lengths. I personally prefer to use a 50" and a 64"
Hope that helps
Burt
Your info was helpful. I went back to the links you included in an earlier post; Dino shows the repeaters being used with the square, but from what you're saying, it looks like the repeaters can be used alone with the guide, and the square is not really necessary -- particularly if you are using two repeaters on you long cuts on a sheet of ply. Did I get that right?********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
You're absolutely correct. Originally, the repeaters were designed to be used as a "Pair" with a long rail for ripping. Later we discovered that one works great with the square.
Burt
As Davidwood mentioned, Dino has a "fix" for the slight inconsistency problem. The repeater, used either with the rails or sliding square provides a setting similiar to a fence. Just like on a table saw, set the repeater and make as many cuts as you need. I use this setup for cabinets and have no problems. It feels strange to leave my unisaws with the large fences and run-off tables setting and use the repeaters but you can't argue with the results.
Jeff,
I have no desire to get into one of those fights. I was only helping to clarify comments by Davidwood. Also please note that neither Davidwood or myself introduced EZ into the conversation.
Burt
If you want to learn everything you need to know about Festool tools, come over to the Festool Owners Group, on Yahoo. We have open discussions about the Festool tools, techniques, and lots of jig ideas.
Some of the members have developed a few very elegant ideas for repeatability with the saws.
To your basic question: "Would purchasing the Festool Saw, Routers (1010 and 1400), Rotex 6" Sander, MFT Table, Medium sized vac, hole drilling kit, and accessories greatly improve my efficiency as a one man shop and off-set the expense?"
My answer is a definite "yes." I get by with just a bench-top table saw (a Ridgid) because I use the Festool cutting system to break down sheet goods. After just a few uses, I quickly got to the point where I can cut several sheets with repeatability within <1/64".
The Rotex sander handles well, has incredible power, and has almost 100% dust collection when hooked up to a vacuum. Same goes for the other Festool sanders.
I use the Festool routers a little less than my other Festool tools, as they are dedicated to hand-held routing. The OF1400 has really smooth plunge motion and great bit-changing. It uses 8mm, 1/4", and 1/2" bits. Don't listen to those who say it has strange bit configurations.
The MFT is an amazing work/clamping/cross-cut/hold-down surface, and more.
I don't have the hole-drilling system, so I can't comment on it.
The Festool system has allowed me to almost eliminate dust from cutting and sanding, work in less space, and work more quickly than before. It's also easy to pack everything up when I need to work on site. I can cart a whole workshop in the back of my car.
Here's the link to the Festool owners group:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FestoolOwnersGroup/
I assume by the time you read this, you'll be feeling better. At least I hope so.
I was the one who raised the EZ issue, and Burts and Davidwood were good enough to come in with their answers -- and I appreciate that.
Furthermore, whenever anyone says they are considering the Festool saw/guide system, I intend to bring the EZ guide into the discussion, and vice versa. And that's because I think if anyone is considering the one system, they at least ought to know about the other.
You're a good guy Jeff, but you need a thicker skin, and maybe a better understanding of the dynamics of these discussions as they unfold in a thread.
********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
Nikkiwood,
You wrote this: "whenever anyone says they are considering the Festool saw/guide system, I intend to bring the EZ guide into the discussion, and vice versa."Actually, it's interesting, because the two companies have a very friendly relationship (better than their customers). They dislike the strife that often arises during the "Festool versus EZ Smart" battles. In fact, I believe Easy Smart has displayed photos of their tools being used with a Festool saw, and people at Festool have kind words for the engineers at EZ Smart.I'd love to see the features of both companies combined into a single system one day.In the meantime, my focus is on Festool. Several Festool users have come up with some elegant solutions to the repeatability "issue" by developing jigs.The only other challenge left to address is cutting narrow strips.On most sanding and cutting operations, the Festool system already will save time, energy, and lungs!
Edited 2/25/2006 8:55 am ET by BanyanTree
Jeeez Jeff.... have you considered quilting? It sounds like you skate with the Broad Street bullies...
Glaucon
If you don't think too good, then don't think too much...
I know, and I've had enough....... hanging up the skates......this brings the stitch count (in my face and head) to 143. Plastic surgeon's putting his kids through college on me......
These young kids have no clue how to play the game without the stick work, they all wear shields and cages now, so they have nothing to lose by whacking somebody.
Jeff
Used to play on the canal behind my house when I was a kid... in college, I liked going to games- there was good skating and play and we went to the NCAA finals every year... didn't care much for the NHL for years because of the lack of skill that was replaced with fighting. Like the Olympics- the Finns and Swedes are a joy to watch. Maybe when Americans learn to skate and play like Canadians, I'll start going to games again...Glaucon
If you don't think too good, then don't think too much...
First let me say that I have had the Festool System for almost three years now and had purchased for the sole purpose of on site work. I have a complete cabinet / woodworking shop with all the equipment you would expect to see. Last December we purchased our third Festool System. Two for out in the field and one for use in the shop. The guys love the shop setup so they don't have to try and horse a sheet of ply on the cabinet saw. We also noticed some measurement problems as far as long rips but have addressed it with what else but a jig. You will have to have a setup table but i have read some use a set of saw bucks. Tools to me are meant to be time savers. We still break out the hand planes but not as often. This system is a very useful tool in any type of shop. Dust collection is great and its portable.
What sort of jig have you devised for repeat cuts (with the Festool guide)?And, do you use the protective cases Festool sells for the guides, or have you come up with some other way of protecting them -- both in transporting them, and from getting them knocked about on the site?********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
We use a very simple indexing cleat. Scrap wood made into a type of tee square and mounted with a clamp to the outside edge of the panel. the other side is firmly against the guide rail and thats it. For example if we needed 8 nail rails at 4 " we would just cut and keep moving the guide rail up against the indexing cleat. It is a very exacting method of repeat cuts. As for the guide rail covers no we dont use or even own them. We have a total of 7 guide rails, some the same size. We hang all of our rails up on the walls and never left flat or leaning up on something. We have not had any problem or damage to them what so ever.
I have been using the Festool MFT, saw and guide rail a month or so. I am still getting used to it so take these comments for what they are worth, but the issue of doing repeat cuts is the sticking point for me. Using a pencil mark (maybe the pencil is too dull and makes a broad mark one day and a narrow the next depening on how I hold it) and then aligning the guide edge to the mark (sometimes the light is different, I don't have my glasses on, I just can't see well that day, ....) and there is enough room for more than a 1/32 of difference between cuts. On the MFT I can make consistent cuts and my cuts have been reasonably consistent on the few larger sheet goods I have cut, but I start to wonder if I have ten sheets to cut, five one day, five the next, can I make the same cuts to within a 1/32 given the issues of cutting to a pencil mark. Whatever the solution, that is my difficulty, so I appreciate your observation about making repeat cuts and look forward to seeing the replys about solutions. I do check the Festoool group and there are some t square type soultions suggested there. Maybe that is the best solution in the long run. For me, aligning to a pencil mark is not a good solution for lots of cuts.
Your issue with repeat cuts on the MFT is understandable. I most often leave the MFT Idle and use the EZ repeaters either on the square or on the longer rails for rip cuts. The repeaters are like a fence and have markings. As long as you set it on the same marking (Measurement in inches), you'll get the same measurement, today, tomorrow, next week, next year, etc.
I plead ignorance in all of this, so again, take this for what it is worth. I actually have fewer problems with making cuts on the MFT than using just the guide rails on sheet goods off the MFT. cutting the larger sheets down seems to require a pencil mark and that is just a source of potential error. On the MFT I can use a side stop or the fence rail or both to ensure the cut is accurate without a pencil mark, as long as the fence to rail is square. I am sure these are all problems people solve over and over again, but I have yet to find a solution that is as comfortable to me as setting my table saw fence for 36.75 inches (or whatever) and pushing through the sheet for the cut. I don't like having to manhandle the sheet and the guide rail systems are the alternative, but I just need to find a way to make cut after cut the same. Still struggling to make it all come toghether!
I can relate to your struggle. Over the years, I have owned more different saws and saw configurations than I care to admit. I'm always in search of perfection and find it quiet difficult to obtain. The sure simplicity of the EZ system and the ease of obtaining highly accurate cuts make it the best thus far. When we get into woodworking each person brings his own desires and experiences with him. That is what makes stock in a tool company a good investment.
Hi Burts,
I couldn't agree more. When it comes to tools, I choose what gets me to the outcome. I am not the tinkering type: work around and such only keep me from the outcome and that is what is important for me. If there was only one solution for all of us, then the tool maker would be a millionaire. Thank goodness for diversity and different approaches to solving the outcome. And I do appreicate those folks who enjoy tinkering and through that path find solutions I am too impatient to discover. I bought into Festool more for dust collection as the start and I have an open mind about what gets me to the end point. I still have trouble with those pencil marks ....
Best
John
If you are doing custom work, then definately the system will help pay for itself. I don't have a problem with repeatabiltiy & accuracy with the Festool System. I've cut 32 peices uniformly with the guide rails and MFT for case sides, with not as much as <1mm discrepancy. I've also have not replaced any of my traditional tools with the system, but they do sit more idle. The hole drilling system is unique and very versitile.
IF you have a large kitchen to do, consider hiring out the casework portion to one of the larger case goods shops and concentrate on the details. I use eCabs and can send out what I need & spend alot less time on the whole project. Let someone else do the drudgery.
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled