OK.. Most of my files are old metal working..
Any ideas on a set of wood working files?
I have wood rasps but what files and what brand are ideal?
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Replies
Tricky question - It's kind of like asking what plane should I get..
Anyway, It really comes down tow what are you looking to accomplish with a file. Depending on the cut of the file, you'll range from fine smoothing of wood, to aggressive shaping. You mentioned you have rasps, and that's a great start for shaping, as rasps are very coarse, and remove a lot of material, fast.
Most of my files are Nicholson, I may have a Pferd, or a craftsman thrown in there as well. What I try to do is look at the cuts, as if they were sandpaper. The bigger the tooth, and gullet, the faster they're going to remove material, and the rougher they'll leave the finish. Of course, there's a much more technical way to figure that out, by knowing the differences between a mill cut, second cut, bastard, etc.. But again, I just look at teeth and gullet.
And today, you may want to consider the microplanes as well - They do a great job in place of a file, and are similar to surform rasps.
Hope this helps
Gregory Paolini
http://www.GregoryPaolini.com
Thanks.. I have a few microplanes. Great for the kitchen but I do not like them for wood. Just me//
Like Gregory, most of mine (a few dozen or so) are from Nicholson, but with a few "utility" files from a Swedish manufacturer, Os-something. A variety of shapes and patterns is useful, depending (as Gregory pointed out), on what one is doing. I also have a couple of sets of rifflers, used mostly when carving, but they also come in handy for general woodworking when a fine touch is required. Jewelers files can also be handy for really fine work, very tight curves, etc.
Usage-wise, I probably use bastard patterns most often (flat, half-round of varied radius), reserving rasps for really gross shaping.
I also advocate treating files like chisels. That is, don't touch a file with anything you wouldn't rub against the cutting edge of a chisel. Those steel-wire "file cards" should be suggested only by those who want to sell you new (un-dulled) files. Proper storage is also important, of course, being sure not to let the files rub against each other or other metal. Naturally, good handles should be purchased with the files.
Lie Nielsen also sells joinery floats that look interesting, but I haven't tried them.
joinery floats .. I have none but they look a bit big for what I want..
And I thank you REALLY..
I found this from your words... I will get some if I can afford them!
http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/ToolGuide/ToolGuideProduct.aspx?id=30641
Edited 7/6/2009 11:28 am by WillGeorge
Hi Will,
One file that I have found to be very useful is a Four-In-Hand. They come in various lengths and are flat on one end and oval shaped on the other. The interesting thing is that each end has a file on one side and rasp on the other.
This gives you two profiles with a file and a rasp on each side - very handy.
One thing I have found is that the amount of force you exert when using files/rasps has an major impact on the quality of the surface it leaves. You also have to pay attention to the direction of the grain too.
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
You also have to pay attention .. Me!
Will,This is not going to be a lot of help. There is a guy out near you in Chicagoland that, to me, is the guru of everything you ever wanted to know about files. I met him at an antique tool auction about 5 years ago and all I can remember is he had a Chicago type name, a last name with lots of vowels, and a very active member in the Mid-Western Tools Collectors association.
http://www.mwtca.org/My sense is everyone knows this guy, except me of course. He's a terrific resource with every file imaginable.
Will,The float is a different animal altogether. I takes a very different cut (see attached).Chris @ http://www.flairwoodworks.com and http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com)
- Success is not the key to happiness. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Will,
If I could only have one, it would be a Grobet Detail File made in Switzerland. I reach for it a lot. Flat on one side, round on the other, tapered with courser and finer ends. It's not cheap at almost $40 for an 8" file, but it really is a beautiful tool.
It's available from Tools For Working Wood where you will find a description that is much better than anything I can write.
http://www.toolsforworkingwood.com/Merchant/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=toolshop&Product_Code=ST-GROBDET&Category_Code=TXBS
View Image
Regards,
Frank
Hi Will
I have a bunch of Nicholson metal files that also work on wood. However I generally first turn to my Aurio rasps and rifflers, which cover a wide range from coarse to very fine. I suspect that you associate rasps as coarse workers. If so, you are in for a treat! Rasps can produce a smooth surface.
I also have a microplane and a LN joinery float. All good workers.
Some rasps, riffers and round files ..
View Image
Regards from Perth
Derek
Almost any medium to coarse brand name file will work well, get an assortment of shapes and sizes so you can match the tool to the job. A Nicholson "four in hand", as recommended by someone else, is an excellent first purchase and may be all that you need.
Purchase, or make, files with safe edges, these have only their wide faces toothed so you can work into corners without marring the adjoining surface. Safe edge files are hard to find however, and more expensive, so I just grind off the edges of conventional files as needed.
If you want to keep the files cutting well on wood never use them on metal even once, metal cutting will dull them and they won't cut as cleanly on wood ever again. Files used for brass work should also never be used on harder metals for the same reason. Files should always be stored and handled so that they never touch another file, which will damage the teeth.
To clean the files you will need a file card, a stiff short bristled brush to clean out debris caught in the teeth. Rubbing some chalk on the file's teeth will sometimes reduce or eliminate their filling up with wood dust and fibers.
John White
Shop Manager for FWW Magazine, 1998-2007
Thanks to all.
I will look into the suggestions.
I have many top quality metal working files but they were used for metal working. The still cut metal nicely but I am not that happy with the cuts on hardwood.
I do have a set of smaller flat and another set of curved rasps. Moderate price but not the really expensive one. They cut well and hold the edge.
I may get this set.
http://www.traditionalwoodworker.com/product_info.php/products_id/3878
but I will look into all of your suggestions.
Will, as someone else said, once a file is used on steel it will not cut wood cleanly. If you buy any decent file and use it only for wood, paint the tang blue or something to mark it, it will do a good job for a long time. But if you forget and use that wood only file on steel even once, it will no longer cut wood as it did before. Same with a file to be used for brass. Go to a local Chi Town hardware store, or even, dare I say it, Sears, and buy you a good file and try it on wood and I think you will be pleased.
Bruce"A man's got to know his limitations." Dirty Harry Calahan
I agree but they still cut metal just as they should!
or even, dare I say it, Sears,
I have bunch of bunch of tools that still work this day from Sears! I use to love that store... For tools and clothes...
I gave up on Sears long ago when I bought a very expensive Black shirt.. I love Black.. And one arm was longer than the other!
I had all kinds of hastles returning it... I do not return things I have not purchased!.. Ever..
I hardly ever shop at Sears these days! I always did before...
And the shirt was only $30.00 dollars as I recall... Very expensive at the time!
I give up!
Will, I used to buy a lot of mechanic type hand tools at Sears also. After all if your Craftsman brand tool broke, you took it back and they handed you a new one. They still do that pretty much, but the frequency of returning the tool has gotten a lot shorter. About the last time I went to buy a Craftsman branded socket my son and I were looking at 3/4" drive stuff for him and the sockets were stamped "Taiwan." I'm not trying to start a war here, and I know you have 2 beautiful China dolls, but that was not what we expected.
So now when I need a new socket or wrench it is pretty much either stop the Snap-On or Mac Tool truck or go flea marketing for the same.
We all have our preferences and this is one of mine.
HAve a great weekend.
Bruce"A man's got to know his limitations." Dirty Harry Calahan
Snap-On .. I have some.. I still like my old Sears tools. Had them for years and still work..
Only problem I had was returning the $30.00 shirt from Sears.. I never shop there anymore~
But I do understand your comment..
Edited 7/10/2009 7:16 pm by WillGeorge
Will,Are you sure you checked your actual arm length?
I swear mine got longer after carrying heavy camera cases for years. Started making forest noises and wanting bananas:)BB
Have a set of sockets and drivers from Sears 40 years ago. All still good but I won't buy from them now.
Will - I looked at the set you posted, and I'd recommend against them. This set is largely composed of rasps, and there's a big difference in performance between a machine-made rasp and a hand-made one like the ones at The Best Things, Auriou, or Tools for Working Wood. I've a lot of rasps, and can vouch for this. It won't matter all that much if you're using a coarse rasp to hog off wood and you're going to follow up with a fine rasp, a scraper, sandpaper, or a file, but machine-cut rasps generally will leave a series of parallel lines on the wood from the uniform teeth. A hand-cut one like an Auriou will not, even in the coarser grades.
What I'd suggest instead is that you purchase a Nicholson #49 or #50 for roughing in - like establishing the basic shape of a cabriole leg, for example, then spend the rest of the money on a hand-cut rasp or two in a finer tooth configuration. Aurious are very nice - I've about a dozen from the company before it went out of business and was ressurected as a smaller firm. But they are quite expensive. If you want to save some money and get the same thing, buy one from The Best Things - they are made by former Auriou employees.
Less expensive still are the "Grammercy" rasps at TFWW - I believe these are chinese-made, but perhaps Joel can correct me on that point. Word has it they're a little less finely made as an Auriou, but at a very large cost savings, and way better than a machine cut rasp.
Finally, and in my opinion, a machine-cut file is what you want. I've a few hand-cut files (leftover from an esoteric interest in blacksmithing), and in this case the small imperfections in spacing and height of the teeth aren't desirable as they are in a rasp. So my thought is to go to Sears or the local hardware store and buy a Bastard and a Mill Bastard file - those are the two coarsest grades of metal-working files, but they're quite smooth compared to a rasp in a woodworking application. In my opinion, the "smooth cut" files are too fine for woodworking - they clog way too easily.
WG,
Look up Slav on the Woodnet forum. He makes a business of selling NOS files and rasps. An email to him (or maybe a telephone call) will result in the correct info for what you are doing.
T.Z.
Does anyone have an opinion on Habilis Files? They seem to have a pretty good variety of files.
http://www.fine-tools.com/feile2.htm
Dave
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