I am in the process of building a bathroom vanity out of quarter sawn Cherry. It’s some of the best Cherry I’ve ever had the pleasure of working with.
I’ve made a lot of raised panel doors over the years and have typically struggled with the finishing part.
I am trying something new to me for these doors. I will pre sand and then apply my finish to all of the parts (panels, rails, and stiles) before I glue them together. So far, I have sanded the rails and stiles to eliminate the minor mismatch in the joints.
It’s the finishing part that I am concerned with. I want a satin finish with depth to it and be free of blotching (no stain). I also need it to be durable since it is in the bathroom.
I’ve done some research and think that a couple of Shellac first coats, lightly sanded between coats, and a sprayed satin polyurethane finish may be the best way to achieve this? Is there a better combinations of finishes than this?
Thanks in advance for you inputs.
Phil
Replies
Dewaxed shellac, along with careful masking of your glue surfaces & it sounds like a winning formula. "Oversanding" to higher grits can reduce blotching. Test test test.
Greetings Phil,
Beautiful cabinetry and doors in your photos!
Finishing took a long time for me to master as there are many variables that affect the final outcome. If you want to see some real depth and grain pop, allow me to suggest a base coat of Waterlox (rockler.com or search the web). I feel it brings the best appearance and clear depth of grain of cherry under any final topcoat. Chances are you will not consider using a stain after seeing the richness of the cherry color.
Shellac (clear not amber) will act as a barrier seal in between the Waterlox and the satin polyurethane. Great results begin with a wipe-on application of Waterlox followed by spraying of the shellac and subsequent polyurethane. The shellac builds fast and after three to four coats will sand back to a flat finish using 1000 - 2000 grit paper.
You cannot rush a finish as the shellac needs to dry and harden so the sanding results in an overall dull finish (check FWW for videos on rubbing out the finish. Light sanding between shellac coats is always helpful. If you do no generate powder from the shellac finish, then it is still soft. You may have to wait 3-4 days then final sand before spraying the Polyurethane.
The same holds for rubbing out the final coat of the polyurethane as it will need a week or so to fully harden. The harder polyurethane (oil or water-based) protects the cabinet however, I find that less expensive polyurethane brands (Lowes or Home Depot) do not flatten out as well as you expect. I have moved from water-based polyurethane to water-based lacquer (https://www.targetcoatings.com/) and incredibly happy with the consistent results.
As the coats of spray are applied, the finish will build to a flat surface. The first 2-3 coats are not as good as the final 5th or 6th coat. Spraying requires cutting the shellac or Polyurethane to low viscosity (easy for the gun to spray and atomize).
The shellac is oil-based but once cured it is a universal sealer that will take an oil or water-based spray finish on top of it without any issues. I suggest you review some FWW videos on using a spray gun as the right air pressure to the gun will atomize the finish and it will be satin as desired and exceptionally smooth to the touch and its reflection to light.
I have learned everything on applying finished through FWW.
Good luck and enjoy the journey!
I have never heard of oil based Shellac -- maybe there is something out there called Shellac that is oil based, but that would be an oddity at best. Shellac in all traditional forms is alcohol based, and it typically dries very fast -- one of its strengths. If it takes days to dry, I would suggest you are using product past its useful life or you have poor solvent or something else is wrong. Oil finishes do typically take much longer to cure.
Shellac is not oil based.
Agreed ctsailor!
My error in reading for clarity before posting. Shellac is not an oil base as my intention, though written poorly, was to highlight its benefits to seal against either a subsequent spray coat of oil-based or a water-based finish. Good catch with added commentary on older shellac's downside!
So, what is your suggestion to help Phil?
A good question. There are too many options in the finishing world. And I am no expert Personally I would pre-finish just the panels. Probably a wash coat of Shellac (1/2lb cut +/-) followed by an oil of some sort to make it pretty. After thorough oil drying a couple of coats of Shellac. Or, being a bathroom one of Shellac and something more durable on top. But there is no one "right" formula.
How are your door frames joined? Just the glue surface with the cooe and stick bits?
I always use Sealcoat under water based poly for cherry, so your finish is fine. Prefinish the panels if you want. But I would assemble the doors before finishing the rails and stiles.
I really, really like this idea. Shellac and oil go very well on cherry. I thin the SealCoat thinned 1:1. Garnet or tinted shellac also look good on cherry. Either way, its going to darken nicely.
Personally I've used water based poly with good results. But it does require sanding b/t coats, and that can be an issue with raised panels, so I think I would totally finish everything before glue up. I've used EM8000cv worth a look.
I love cherry! that will be one classy bathroom!
I noticed your panels have squared-off end grain at the tops. We have cherry doors with the same end grain on the panels in our bathroom and they've been a problem since year 2. The high humidity of a bathroom won out over whatever finish the cabinet maker used, and mold invaded. Take tons of extra care to fill / shellac these to make them totally impervious to humidity.
I recommend that after hand planing smooth, sand 400 grit, then 1,000, then sand to 2,000. The sanding effectively burnishes the wood making the pores similar and completely avoiding splotches on Cherry. Then finish with a very, VERY thin coat of Tried and True varnish oil. The oil will add depth and will be flat once it cures.
I second the T&T varnish oil finish for cherry. Would prolly add an extra coat or two for the bathroom setting.
I use T&T varnish oil and its Danish oil. Both are extremely easy to apply and give results similar to Waterlox in appearance. They are great finishes for cherry. I have experimented with Seal Coat as an underlayment to T&T but found it unnecessary.
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