Replies

1. 
   jeffn7 | Jun 08, 2002 07:08pm | #1

   glue wouldn't give you any benefits, IMO.

   side nailing is my preferred route, however if you are using planks, nailing as an architectural detail is nice. For strip flooring, I find surface nailing to be "noisy" in that it is visually distracting. Just my opinion.

   Red rosen paper between the floor and subfloor.

   fyi, pneumatic side nailers are the way to go, as opposed to the older non-pneumatic type, which do leave a lot to be desired.

1. 
   marpincan | Jun 08, 2002 09:05pm | #2

   Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I do plan on side nailing and will consider a pnumatic nailer. The floor will be a combination of 3" and 5" toung and grove plank flooring.I will be laid in a patern of 2 strips of 3" followed by 1 strip of 5". I am concidering face screwing and plugging the 5" strips.

   Mario

1. 
   jeffn7 | Jun 10, 2002 06:11am | #4

   combination of 3 and 5" boards should have a nice effect, especially if you screw and plug the 5" planks.

2. 
   gabramshe | Jun 10, 2002 03:36am | #3

   Try sealing the floor with a water based sanding sealer after sanding to 100 grit and removing all the dust. Then apply the stain. The stain takes on a different tone than it would with raw wood but it practically eliminates all the overlapping features that happen otherwise. Try it on a few pieces nailed and sanded to a scrap piece of plywood first to check the color variation. Good luck.

1. 
   marpincan | Jun 12, 2002 05:45am | #14

   What type (make or manufacture)of sanding sealer would you recomend?

3. 
   badoyn | Jun 10, 2002 05:42pm | #5

   Why not install pre-finished flooring?

1. 
   jeffn7 | Jun 10, 2002 06:02pm | #6

   Pergo? It just doesn't come close to the look and feel of traditional strip flooring.

   My house had a home office renovated by the previous owners, they used Pergo. The rest of the house has red oak strip flooring, some rooms are the original 40 year old floors that were surface nailed, while most of the rooms and hallways are red oak floors that I installed.

   The Pergo feels thin, the end gaps are noticable because the pergo units are 3 boards wide, so the end joints are all 3 boards wide. I can also identify by sight where the edge joints are. It is inexpensive and easy to install, it certainly has that going for it.

   The floors I installed were 5 days of hard work, required additional expense to rent a pneumatic side nailer, drum and edge sander, required time to finish... but look great and feel substantial underfoot. I also know that those floors will last another 40 years.

   My parents have maple floors with a high gloss finish (clear with a slight tint added), the result is pretty stunning.

1. 
   badoyn | Jun 10, 2002 06:40pm | #7

   I didn't mean Pergo. There are oak floors that are pre-finished prior to installation.

1. 
   jeffn7 | Jun 10, 2002 07:09pm | #8

   yeah, I've seen those as well. It's appealing because of the time (and dust) required to finish hardwood floors. My wife was pretty understanding, but I think I may have to move her out to resort/spa the next time I do floors.

   how do you establish a unified finish with prefinished material?

1. 
   badoyn | Jun 10, 2002 07:31pm | #9

   If I'm not mistaken, the materials are pretty uniform as they are sanded and finished by machine.

2. 
   cuttoff | Jun 10, 2002 07:42pm | #10

   Yes, they are fairly uniform but they do tend to vary from bundle to bundle. It would be helpful to have a place to layout the material before you install it.

   I would not glue it either. Seems to me that this would make it very difficult to repair a damaged piece should that ever occur. Structurally, it doesn't seem like it would add anything either.John

3. 
   badoyn | Jun 10, 2002 10:02pm | #11

   True, but I wonder how much it would vary. I bet if you were purchasing a large enough amount then they would probably crack the cases or be extra careful to check lot numbers.

   I would blind nail the floor. Much easier and less mess.

4. 
   cuttoff | Jun 10, 2002 10:36pm | #12

   If you get it from a Big Box store then you're pretty much on your own. If you order it from a reputable flooring supplier and specifiy matching lots then you're in pretty good shape. I think you still need to check it just to be safe. I'm just an amature but I've found that pricing is consistent with the customer demands so at some point one finds the pocket book dictates the level of quality that you get.John

2. 
   marpincan | Jun 12, 2002 05:47am | #15

   Hopefuly I can get the same good results with my floor.

1. 
   badoyn | Jun 12, 2002 05:20pm | #16

   I'm sure you can get great results, but pre-finished floors just eliminate the dust and time lost from finishing.

1. 
   ggrager | Jun 13, 2002 07:27pm | #17

   I have done a few hardwood flooring installs, both prefinished and unfinished.  I have found that good prefinished flooring (Bruce and a few others) is actually very uniform.  The natural seems to give you more variation (which I really like).  I have also done some prefinished with the v-groove and without and they both look good. 

   A little tip.  If you do use the prefinished stuff, put Armor-All on it when your done.  It doesn't last but a few weeks, but it sure brings out the shine.  A little slippery though.

2. 
   erich | Jun 19, 2002 04:54pm | #18

   Hi there,

        I know I'm a little late to get in on the discussion, but since there seem to be a few of you who have put in the pre-finished stuff I thought I'd throw out a question.  I was planning on installing a pre-finished Bruce flooring (not the Pergo or laminated stuff).  I don't like the "gaps" in the surface of the beveled flooring just as one of the previous posters noted either.  BUT, I understand that the reasons the manufacturers put those bevels there is to hide discrepancies in the final planed thickness of the boards.  My question is this:  If you use the square-edged flooring, is there really a problem with thickness discrepancies that any of you have noted?  Also, if there is, can you fix them without sanding and re-finishing, there-by obviating the whole point of pre-finished flooring in the first place.  Thanks for any advice, I appreciate it (and my wife will too!). 

                              Erich

3. 
   BenM | Jun 19, 2002 08:05pm | #19

   I installed a Bruce parquet floor approximately 14 years ago for a dining room.  They were solid wood and prefinished.  No thickness problems.  Of course, your subfloor has to be flat.  By the way, after 14 years it still looks brand new.

4. 
   ggrager | Jun 19, 2002 08:43pm | #20

   The few floors I have done without the v-groove looked just fine.  They were in a new construction home so the sub floors were nice and flat.  There was one area that the sub floor was not and you could see it a little bit, but it was in a closet.

   I think you should chose whichever you (or your wife) thinks looks better.  I have seen the floor I did 3 years ago with the prefinished Bruce and it still looks great even in the high traffic areas.

   By the way, the instructions in the box say you don't have to use the rosen paper.  I talked to a rep and he said the only reason you would need to use it was in a situation where you would need a little vapor barrier (ie - above a damp basement or crawl).  He assured me that in normal, dry circumstances it really doesn't help anything.

5. 
   jeffn7 | Jun 20, 2002 12:06am | #21

   I went down to Expo center this last weekend to check out the prefinished floors, I was impressed by both the variety and fit/finish.

   The one think I wonder about is the 'smoothness' of the finish when you go with the non-V groove variety.

6. 
   ggrager | Jun 20, 2002 08:10pm | #22

   With a flat subfloor I've had no problems flatness.

7. 
   johnhardy | Apr 05, 2005 07:36pm | #30

   I had a hardwood floor installed in this townhome because of (1) dust concerns, and (2) speed.

   I wouldn't do it again, ever. Not only do I not like the V-grooves (supposedly micro-bevels, but noticeable), I absolutely hate the shadow effect I get when the setting sun comes in through a window and hits the floor. You can really see the different heights of the boards when that happens and the shadow lines tell it all.

   The way an unfinished floor resolves this problem is that you sand the floor after it's installed. This brings all boards into the same plane as their neighboring boards. Much, much nicer.

   DO NOT install prefinished flooring for the above two reasons. By the way, cost was not an issue, Both ways would have cost me the same. I just made the wrong decision.

   John

   Edited 4/5/2005 12:39 pm ET by johnhardy

2. 
   marpincan | Jun 12, 2002 05:35am | #13

   I am not going with prefinished flooring for the reasons listed below:

   1) I do not like V Grove type flooring and most prefinished flooring is V grove.

   2) I want to use longer strips (6' Plus) and most prefinished has a lot of shorter peices.

   3) I like doing this type of work and do not mind spending the time to get good results.

4. 
   Buzzsaw | Apr 04, 2005 08:07pm | #23

   Marp,

     I just finished installing a hardwood "golden teak" floor in my dining room.  We absolutely love it and it came pre-finished.  We purchased the wood at Lumber Liquidators (the wood is manufactured by BellaWood which is recommended by Bob Vila (we bought it anyway))and rented a pneumatic side nailer and compressor.  This was our first attempt at installing hardwood floors and it came out great! Stick with pre-finished.  I could never understand why anyone would want to get floors that weren't already finished.

   Regards,

   Buzzsaw

1. 
   MarkRD | Apr 04, 2005 08:32pm | #24

   Probably because they don't like the "micro bevel" on the flooring planks - the microbevel is one way to hide uneveness in the wood thickness from plank to plank. The other way is to sand after installation then finish.The good news is that the bevel is smaller now than it used to be (I just repaired some 10 year old Bruce oak floor with new Lum Liq oak floor and I was able to do a side by side comparison). They've probably been able to reduce the microbevel because the mills have gotten better at making consistent flooring thickness.Mark

   Measure it with a micrometer, mark it with chalk, cut it with an ax.

2. 
   Lilshaver | Apr 05, 2005 06:11pm | #25

   I recently installed white oak flooring throughout my house. I used unfinished solid wood, 2 1/4 inch wide. I had a flooring installer friend do the sanding and I did the finishing. There are no grooves between my boards and I can't understand why anyone would want them. Really, I'm happy that you're so pleased with your floor. I'm sure that my wife and I are equally pleased with ours.

1. 
   Buzzsaw | Apr 05, 2005 06:16pm | #26

   jpatrick,

     No offense intended. I'm glad that we both are happy with our floors(and our wives are happy is more important).  I can honestly say that I haven't seen a better looking hardwood floor anywhere else.  And the best part is we installed it ourselves. And the fact that I do woodworking really helped because of the ripping that is needed and occasional bandsaw cut. Regards,

   Buzzsaw

1. 
   MarkRD | Apr 05, 2005 06:57pm | #27

   The ripping/bandsawing was the most fun of the whole bamboo floor project for me - way more fun than hand nailing 100 square feet of floor
   (drill, nail, nailset, drill, nail, nailset hit finger, dril nail nailset...Bamboo was tough to nail with the manual nailer - so tough that I broke the nailer (good think I paid the rental insurance) and I couldn't rent an air powered one that worked for 5/8" (15mm).Non the less, the floor came out great... Here's a pic (prefinished carmalized bamboo - lumber liquidators)Mark
   

   Measure it with a micrometer, mark it with chalk, cut it with an ax.

   
1. 
   Buzzsaw | Apr 05, 2005 07:02pm | #29

   Mark,

     I agree.  It is beautiful.  I took some pictures of my floor but need to download them.  Will post over the next few days.  You did a great job!Regards,

   Buzzsaw

2. 
   lwj2 | Apr 06, 2005 05:05am | #31

   Resized pic, Mark.Leon Jester

   
3. 
   ClevelandEd | Apr 06, 2005 05:50am | #32

   Thanks for resizing that photo.  I wanted to see it, but there was no way I would click on a 246K jpeg.

4. 
   lwj2 | Apr 08, 2005 03:30am | #34

   Happy to be of service.For various reasons, I've got Adobe's Photoshop 6.0, I don't use it much -- but when I need it it's indispensable -- so resizing and lightening photos for the forum keeps my hand in and lets you folks with dialup have easier access.:) I probably should spend more time in the basement shop ...So far, the weekend's plans: New support rails for the bed; finish tearing down the former owner's bar; cut out SWMBO's gardening workbench. [Note to self: Dufus, print that set of plans out.] Take taxes to accountant. Get lecture on lackadaisical clients from accountant. Ply accountant with beer. Mow -- or weedwhack -- the hayfield I call a front lawn.Leon Jester

5. 
   MarkRD | Apr 07, 2005 03:29pm | #33

   Sorry guys, I posted it in a hurry and didn't think about you poor modem users. (I've had broadband for about 3 years now - even when I travel, I can usually get wireless BB so I'm not even sure if my Modem works any more...)Mark

   Measure it with a micrometer, mark it with chalk, cut it with an ax.

2. 
   MarkRD | Apr 05, 2005 07:02pm | #28

   The micro bevel is not really a grove. Just the top edge corners are knocked off - probably 1/64" or so - with my older bruce floor, the micro bevel was twice that size and made a place for dust to get trapped.The bamboo bevel is hardly noticable (see my previous post) but you do see it.Mark

   Measure it with a micrometer, mark it with chalk, cut it with an ax.