Replies

1. 
   HowardAcheson | May 26, 2003 08:55pm | #1

   If you are installing the screws with a power driver, set the clutch so you do not drive so far. Otherwise, change to using a hand driver. For years, I used a "speed wrench" (similar to a brace) for driving screws. It was almost as fast as a power driver and allowed much more control.

   For plywood, it is better not to use flathead screws. The center plies of plywood are not very solid wood and the taper on the screw head tends to force it's way farther into the wood. In solid wood, flathead screws can sometime split the wood if they are used near edges.

   I only use binder head screws, particularly if the hole is going to get covered or plugged.

1. 
   davearnone | May 27, 2003 06:46am | #2

   I'll try the binder heads.

   thanks Howie.

   dave

1. 
   HowardAcheson | May 27, 2003 07:53pm | #3

   If you use sheet metal screws, the correct head type is called a pan head. A binder head is used on a standard threaed machine screw.

   Sorry for the confusion.

1. 
   davearnone | May 27, 2003 09:20pm | #4

   Thanks Howie.  One thing i have wondered about is the impact of using screws that are threaded all the way to the head.  Is there an advantage in using a true wood screw?

1. 
   HowardAcheson | May 28, 2003 05:00am | #7

   True wood screws have an unthreaded portion that is intended to allow the board being screwed to be pulled down tight onto the board the screw is going into. If you thread through both boards, you do not get the tightening or pulling together of the two boards.

   When using a screw that is fully threaded, you should drill your clearence hole to the diameter of the outside of the threads so the screw threads don't contact the holes sides.

   A wood screw has a round head typically. The round head sticks up higher than a pan or binder head. So, if you are counterboring so you can later plug the hole, the counterbore must by deeper if you are using a round head wood screw.

   There are a number of new design wood screws today. They drive easier and hold better in both wood and composition materials.

2. 
   Steinmetz | May 28, 2003 09:07am | #8

   Standard wood screws are tapered. the slightest shrinkage in the materal causes looseness of the tapered screw in it's tapered hole. That is why almost every top hinge on a wood door works loose and causes the door to 'droop'

   The average 'handyman?' will usually remove that #10 screw and replace it with a #12 to get more 'bite.  

   Great thinking, but the screw head now protrudes and binds against the opposite hinge leaf. The door droops more and the lock starts to bind.

   Keys break off. Tempers flare. You have a perfectly good solid wood door replaced by a hollow core foam filled sheet metal skin so called 'Security' door, pay big bucks to a guy named  Andy,(Whom you'll never see again)  and in six months time  the tiny hinges wear down, the short screws come loose    etc etc..

    Meanwhile , Andy has disapeared with your big bucks and resold your perfectly good door to a home restoration company for more big bucks

   For want of a few LONG ,flat headed sheet metal screws,the battle was lost .      

   Steinmetz   Oh, did I mention, Andy charged you extra to 'dispose' of the old door.

   Edited 5/28/2003 2:13:29 AM ET by steinmetz

3. 
   jimmyk | May 28, 2003 07:04pm | #11

   Wow! What a rant that was!

4. 
   Steinmetz | May 29, 2003 12:02am | #12

   A rant, but it's all true.

5. 
   jimmyk | May 29, 2003 04:19am | #15

   I don't doubt it at all.

2. 
   pauld | May 27, 2003 11:46pm | #5

   Dave,

   Your terminology caught my attention. I generally use flat-headed wood screws with countersunk holes, and panhead screws in counterbored holes (often plugged). Why are you countersinking AND counterboring?

   Paul

1. 
   davearnone | May 28, 2003 12:13am | #6

   It's a good question you ask.  I suspect you are pointing to the heart of my problem.

   dave

3. 
   forestgirl | May 28, 2003 09:41am | #9

   Dave, take a look at pages 46 and 47 in last month's Fine Woodworking mag (#162).  "A Guide to Modern Wood Screws" -- good info, pics, etc.  I especially like the section "No More Pilot Holes."

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

1. 
   davearnone | May 28, 2003 06:54pm | #10

   Thanks.  I read that article when it came out and honestly i did not find it that useful.  Lots of pictures but it did not say much. 

   If Big Brother is listening this would make for a great article:

   - Review fastner types, types strategies and methods.  - Discuss countersinking and c'boring and cutting wood plugs.- Review tools and methods for c'sinking and c'boring and wood plugs.- A tool review of quick change accessories for cordless drills would be good too.  Something to help me sort through all the junk.

4. 
   myshkin | May 29, 2003 01:13am | #13

   This sounds like a bit of a distillation of other postings, but distilled through 35 years of wood working...

   When screwing together a plywood carcase with plugged screw holes, I usually use panhead machine screws, with the pilot hole in the "outer" (closest to the head), suffieciently large to prevent the threads from gaining a bite.  I feel the flat underside of the pan head had a greater bearing surface against the plies. 

   The comments re: wood screws and hinges are true, but don't apply here.  Screws, nails, brads or staples are really just clamps, as I assume the joint is also being glued.  Adjusting the clutch on your driver should help too, as the Baltic ply material is very consistant, not subject to the vagaries and variablities of other materials.

1. 
   davearnone | May 29, 2003 01:34am | #14

   What do you use to engage the machine screw threads?

1. 
   myshkin | May 29, 2003 04:49am | #16

   Sorry if I wasn't clear, they are not machine screws, but pan head sheet metal screws.  A tapered "aggressive" thread.  Clears the piece being attached, (because of the drilled hole being large enough to disallow the screw threads grabbing that piece), grips the underlying wood, clamping them together.