I just took delivery of my second WW11 tablesaw blade and promptly sent my first one in for sharpening.
What a great piece of gear! I do a fair amount of glue ups and this blade yields a perfect edge.
I have a brand new Freud Ultimate Crosscutting blade I bought a couple of years ago.. and may never even unwrap it now. The WW11 also yields perfect crosscuts.
Replies
That's true. I have some blades that I wish I could give away. The Forrest blades (with a good TS) give results that seem like they were machined!
Hi Bill,
If you don't mind me asking, what does Forrest charge for sharpening a WWII? I need to send mine in to get sharpened after 5 cabinet jobs ( about 95 cabinets). Still cuts good, but I think it's got to be getting a little dull by now...
Lee
The price quoted on their website is about 25 bucks.. plus or minus depending on whether you request a test cut.. or if the blade needs some other work you authorize. They also tack on the cost of shipping the blade back to you.I sent mine to them in the packaging the new blade came in and it cost about 8 bucks UPS.. so altogether ( I requested a 5 dollar test cut) I expect the price to be around fifty bucks.. about half the price of a new blade.I probably won't even have to use the sharpened blade for two years or more. That's how long the first blade's sharpness lasted.. and it was still reasonably sharp when I sent it in.Now.. a later poster says he was told sharpening is free on WW11. If that is true.. I will be pleasantly surprised.. however with the form you download to send in with the blade.. it has all the prices listed I mentioned above.Either way.. a great blade is worth the money if you want to avoid inferior cuts.
Clean your blade before sending it in. It may just have some sap or glue on it. I used mine for a lot longer than what 95 cabinets would do to it and unless you cut some hardwood and feel a lot of resistance, it's probably still sharp enough.
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
Highfigh and Jeff,
Thanks for the tip. I clean the blade before every job, the chinese "contractors birch" plywood I use leaves some nasty stuff on the teeth after a set. Not really feeling any resistance, so I guess I'll just keep on truckin'. It seemed like what I have done with the blade so far was a lot, but sounds like you guys get a whole lot more mileage before you send it in.
Lee
When I first got mine, I was at work and took it out of the cardboard so I could look at it. I removed the plastic on the teeth and cleaned the oil off and thought it looked really cool, ....etc. The other guys wanted to see it so I held it out and they ooed and awwed before I wrapped it up again. A couple of minutes later, my fingers were sticky and when I looked at them, I realized that I cut myself but had no idea, it was that sharp. It was a slow day so we went through the shop and I tweaked the TS while they did other things. I had some 8/4 cherry there at the time (to make some picture frames) and I started the saw to cut it when one guy made a phone call. I cut a really thin slice off and he apologized because he thought he interrupted my cutting and was blown away when I told him that I already cut it. Almost no noise and you could see light through the slice. Glue line rip and minimal burning, even though it wasn't the driest piece I have seen. I have cut oak, maple, cherry, pine, MDF, particle board, OSB, a couple of nails and staples that were hidden, masonite, polycarbonate, laminate and I don't know what else at the moment but it was years after I bought it that I sent it in for sharpening. Keep it clean and off of hard surfaces when you change to other blades (like dado or whatever).
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
Whats the best way to clean a blade, and what chemical do you use?
I use mineral spirits and a plastic bristled brush.
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
Household ammonia works well but is nasty. 409 is OK but if really pitchy you can't be in a hurry. Oven cleaner if it's really bad.
Goo Gone, Simple Green, or any spray degreaser. Oven cleaner works, but no better than the other methods, and is the messiest, harshest, and can remove printing.
Any body in the state of GA can get a general purpose cleaner called AIM. I think the NAPA auto parts carry it. that works great on saw blades . I have personal no interest in the product.I just happen to try when i was in Atlanta visiting relative .
I have been running a Forrest rip blade ,It throws out big chips very good. The only thing i dislike is it is rather noisey.
AS far as Freud goes I used them for 25yrs and i will never go back at any price . When i found out the 10" blades were around 9-7/8".At least all of mine that i measured .I was told that they would never be able to sell a blade if it was marked in the MM size that it actually is. And i do have a personal interest in this company because i own a lot of their under size Blades. Enough Rant Chris Miller
Hi Chris - I've got blades from Forrest, Freud, Tenryu, Leitz, DeWalt, Infinity, Irwin and others, so I don't have a strong allegiance to one particular brand, but I'm curious why you feel so strongly about the Freud being 1/8" smaller diameter? Does it impact your cuts somehow or is it just a matter of principle? I've never measured mine and don't think I'd notice the difference.IMO Freud offers some great values per dollar spent and have exceptional customer service as evidenced by the presence of Charles M around these boards.I hope this doesn't sound like an allegation of some sort...just sincerely curious....Scott
Edited 12/16/2006 8:33 am ET by Knotscott
Hi Chris - I've got blades from Forrest, Freud, Tenryu, Leitz, DeWalt, Infinity, Irwin and others, so I don't have a strong allegiance to one particular brand, but I'm curious why you feel so strongly about the Freud being 1/8" smaller diameter? Does it impact your cuts somehow or is it just a matter of principle? I've never measured mine and don't think I'd notice the difference.
IMO Freud offers some great values per dollar spent and have exceptional customer service as evidenced by the presence of Charles M around these boards.
I hope this doesn't sound like an allegation of some sort...just sincerely curious....
Scott
Scott: It has no effecton the work.Except i was going to gang two blades together to cut tenon on table saw but was afraid i could not get another like the one i had.
Thr real problem i had with Freud was the way i was treated on the phone like take it or leave (Freud ,take notice the US auto industry has found out what this attitude does) I was told that is was a metric size .,I said So!,You people had no problem making a .625 hole for the arbor for the US market.So the way i see it Freud dosen't care or is incapable of making a blade to spec. I have two in my hands that are .160 under size and a combo that is right on 10.0. I suspect their (Freud ) answer is well, we have a wide tolerance .,like plus0 minus .160.? The bottom line is they are out of spec ,Suspose you bought a new table saw with a height spec of 3-3/8" and it only goes 3-1/4" would you feel deceived ? I would! Whats next 1/8'u/s or 3/16" or how abought 1/4"where is the line drawn?
I have used Freud blades for 25yrs. I still think they are a great buy for the money.But i will never buy one again.Like ,suspose i need one for my dado set , what size am i going to get? Chris Miller
I have two WWII blades -- a 10-inch rip and a 10-inch crosscut. Love 'em both and have had them sharpened by Forrest (NOT free). I like them so well I rcommended them to my son, a contractor, and he bought the rip blade. Bottom line -- he hates it. But he loves the Freud blades. Go figure.
I also have a variety of brand name blades. What I discovered is that most blades seem to cut considerably better after being professionally sharpened -- even better than when new. I have even sent brand new blades out for sharpening.
I do not own a Forest blade -- yet...... but Christmas is coming! :-)
A bad day woodworking is better than a good day working -- yes, I'm retired!
I have actually had this same complaint about the diameter. It is an issue, because sometimes I need the entire 10".
I also have about every brand of blade and like the Freud blades best. They are a great bargain, and they cut really well. I have used them for years. I think they cut much better than the Forrest blade I have.
My favorite is a thin 50 tooth combination with square teeth. Each tooth cuts both sides. In reality it is like using an 80 tooth ATB except that it doesn't bog down the saw and it tracks straight. I paid $35 for it at Home Depot.
I have also bought the Freud Diablo blades. I think this is the biggest ripoff in the industry. What a piece of crap! I want my money back!
Hal
http://www.rivercitywoodworks.com
Hal, I had a 10" Diablo on a Grizzly contractor's saw for 2 years. I cut a ton of maple and Koa on it. I gave the saw away and the blade was still like new. Rich
Hal,Sorry to hear of your negative experience with the Diablo blades. I hate to hijack this thread so perhaps you could start another thread to discuss or send me an email so I can try to make it right.
Charles M
Freud America, Inc.
What in the world has the fact that your Freud 10" blade measured 9-7/8" to do with the value of the blade? I have never measured the diameter of a saw blade. 10" or 12" is its nominal diameter. What does it matter that it is 1/8" from that figure? I have used Freud FTG full-kerf ripping blades and thin kerf combination blades and have nothing but praise for their performance. They do exactly what they are supposed to do. They are excellent blades. Rich
33114.18 in reply to 33114.16
What in the world has the fact that your Freud 10" blade measured 9-7/8" to do with the value of the blade? I have never measured the diameter of a saw blade. 10" or 12" is its nominal diameter. What does it matter that it is 1/8" from that figure? I have used Freud FTG full-kerf ripping blades and thin kerf combination blades and have nothing but praise for their performance. They do exactly what they are supposed to do. They are excellent blades. Rich
Rich14:All i'am sim;ly saying is that the blades are not as advertised . It says 10" on the blade , i expect it to be close(see above post to Scott)Mine to be exact are .160 (about 5/32)under size. I don.t think this is even close to nominal size,Upon checking my inventory of Freud blades tonight i have found so;me rilght on 10.00".Others .160 under and the freud dado set are over size 8.160 over .
As far as cutting quality i never changed over 25 yrs because i didn't think any body could beat Freud quality.
My saw is susposed to cut 3-3/8" and i expect to be a ble to do that wiith who's ever 10" blade i buy. Chris Miller
Chris, I think your expectations are extremely out of anything that could be considered reasonable. In fact, I have never heard such a criticism of a saw blade, and I think you are looking for a reason to knock the brand. If being able to cut 3-3/8" on your saw, because it's "supposed" to do that, is the measure of a blade's worth, then I guess you better make sure the blades you buy are not one silly millimeter short of that magic 10" dimension! Rich
hris, I think your expectations are extremely out of anything that could be considered reasonable. In fact, I have never heard such a criticism of a saw blade, and I think you are looking for a reason to knock the brand. If being able to cut 3-3/8" on your saw, because it's "supposed" to do that, is the measure of a blade's worth, then I guess you better make sure the blades you buy are not one silly millimeter short of that magic 10" dimension! Rich
Rich . It's just fullfilling a spec that's advertised on the blade . I love the way the blades cut. Chris
Chris,I'm as puzzled as the others as to why you are so anti-Freud because we make metric blades. Lots blades on the market today from many different manufacturers are the same way. Our Industrial and Commercial 10" blades are actuall 250mm. The difference in depth of cut of 2mm or 0.0787" (or for those that think in fractions that's about 5/64"). Is there an application that you have where that is a critical amount?
Charles M
Freud America, Inc.
Chris,
I'm as puzzled as the others as to why you are so anti-Freud because we make metric blades. Lots blades on the market today from many different manufacturers are the same way. Our Industrial and Commercial 10" blades are actuall 250mm. The difference in depth of cut of 2mm or 0.0787" (or for those that think in fractions that's about 5/64"). Is there an application that you have where that is a critical amount?
Charles .I'am not anti Freud because you make metric . blades . I never said any thing like that. . If it is advertised as a 10" blade it ought to be 10".Why is that difficu/lt to understand / If you want to; market a metric blade then tell the public like it is 250 mm or what ever.Like i said to Scott suspose i wan t to gang two blades together to cut tenons on the table saw , what size can i expect to get from you?10" 9.842,or8.160(dado set)?? It looks to me that your blades are all over the map as far as O.D. size.some are metric and some US
The application i have is to get a full 3-3/8" cutting height out of my saw.And my saw is built to spec. 3-3/8", it needs a real 10" blade to do this.
And just why can't you make the blades 254mm???You certainly learned how to make a.625 arbor hole forr the US market??
And just where on the package or blade does it say 250MM?
Charles ,I have used Freud blades over 25 Yrs and i liked them a lot , I told any body i met in woodworking to buy them because they can't be beat for the price . But when i called your head quarters and i get blown off the way i was, well , i think you have a feeling the way i feel..I woluld feel embarrested to tell a costomer that my product would not sell if it put the MM size on the blade.And that's what the man from your company told me. So i have a glue line rip that is under .157.A rip that is .157under.Two combo blades that are right on 10.000 and a dado set that is8.157.Now , at the end of the day you are correct there is are 5/64 ' cutting depth .but i thought we were measuring these blades by dia.,9.8425. And if other manufactures are doing the same , then they will not get my business.And what is your blade O.D. tolerance??
Sincerely Yours
Chris Miller
Ypsilanti Michigan
Chris,We manufacture blades and cutters for markets worldwide to fit all kinds of machines and North America is just about the only place that still uses the inch as a basis for measurement. Blades that we produce solely for the American market ARE made in inch increments but blades that we also offer to the rest of the world are metric (you can use a 250mm blade on a 10" saw but you may not be able to use a 10" blade on a 250mm saw). To produce blades in both inch and metric sizes would increase the cost considerably.In regards to you being "blown off" when you called, I think you felt put off because you did not get the answer you wanted. And you missed the meaning of what you were told. We label 250mm blades as 10" in North America because few customers would make the connection and many would think that they would not work on their 10" saws. This is not uncommon. Look at 3/4" plywood which is almost always either 18mm or 18.5mm instead of being 0.750". There are times that we can't make EVERY customer happy and I regret that we were unable to satisfy you.Charles M
Freud America, Inc.
Edited 12/17/2006 1:17 pm ET by CharlesM
Charles: Thank you for the reply . At least now i understand the Freud 's point of view.Duel dimensions might be an answer,such as "250 MM for 10" saws" . Just a thought. Chris
Chris, It's good to see you backing away from your strident negative opinion of Freud blades. But I still don't think you're getting it. It's necessary for a craftsman to understand the specifications and capabilities of any tool. Your 10" saw was never intended to use blades that only measured exactly 10" in diameter. The depth of cut was never GUARANTEED to be an exact value. While those facts were never explicitly printed on the saw or operator's manual, they are facts of life regarding these machines. Your saw will operate with a rather wide range of blades, probably from circular saw size up through a few fractions of an inch greater than 10.000". If you have your blades resharpened several times, there is a good chance they will NOT measure 10" (if they ever actually did). Does that make them unuseable? NO! You have been blaming a manufacturer for a perfectly acceptable product designation and specification, when the misunderstanding is entirely yours.
The only time I've ever actually measured a blade (or cared) was when it was too big. I had a Yate combo TS that used an 8" blade -NOT 8 1/4 a common CS blade size. While shopping for an 8" blade, Lee Valley customer service had someone go to the warehouse and measure one for me. Now that's service.
Lee
Highfigh is right. I clean my blade 5 times before it needs to be sharpened. I have 3 WWII's, one regular kerf and 2 thin kerf's. I've had the regular kerf in the saw for 2 years now, and it's on it's 3rd cleaning. Still sharp as a razor after a good cleaning.
Jeff
Well that is interesting, not that it effected my purchase as i had allready paid for the blade when the lady said that but she made it very clear that the sharpening of the blade (at least the first time) was free and that i only had to pay for the shipping.
Odd, wonder what the diffence is, like i said this was something she said as she handed me the bag and my reciept and i had not even asked about sharpening. It was all part of the "remember to blah blah blah" speach she was giving as she finished up the sale. She made a point to tell me to keep my box no matter what.
Oh well let me know how this turns out. Maybe it is like GMs new warenties if you bought a car a few years ago you got 3 years and 36000 now they are doing 5 years and a 100000. Or (more likely) the lady had no idea what she was talking about.
Doug Meyer
The WWII is my primary blade and I love it. IMHO it's among the very best general purpose blades available...Ridge Carbide TS2000, DW7657, Infinity, and Tenyru's Gold Medal are pretty good too ;-). However, it is a general purpose blade, which by nature is a balance of compromises in order to offer good to very good performance on a wide range of cuts and materials....versatility is really the only performance area that it excels at. When compared to a comparable quality specialty crosscut blade like Forrest's Chopmaster or Duraline, or Freud's LU85 Ultimate Crosscut blade, I think you'll find the WWII's cut isn't quite as clean....those blades of course have poor versatility and don't rip worth a hoot. The WWII is a whole lot more versatile, and is good enough for nearly every task without swapping blades out.
It is worth emphasising that to outperform the WWII with a dedicated blade, the quality has to be quite high....if you buy even a slightly lower quality specialty crosscut blade, the WWII will outperform it in my experience.
http://www.epinions.com/content_145552674436
Edited 12/14/2006 6:38 am ET by Knotscott
Edited 12/14/2006 6:41 am ET by Knotscott
I just picked one of these up at the local tool show, and according the the lady behind the counter (worked directly for the company) the sharpening is free. I just need to keep track of my numbers for the blade (came with the blade box) and the box is designed to be used to ship it back to the company in.
As for thier being better blades, well for the price it is a great blade and while i am sure some high end blades are better at spicific tasks I at least can not afford to by a high end blade for each task, so this is a good compromise.
Doug Meyer
PS this is my first post but i have been lurking here for a while
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled