Goodbye and hope to see you in other places
dgreen
| Posted in General Discussion on
Knots has been jasoned and is now completely revzoned, I’m sure you can figure out the translation. I’m done here. See you all on other forums. To Gina and Matt and David and the others that served us so well and are stuck with jason’s droppings, Thank You for your service and I wish you the best. Best regards to those that made this site what it once was, and a pox on those who destroyed it. Don Green Former proud Knots member and contributor.
Replies
I may be only a 23-24 week wonder - but boy, it's about time, good riddance. I think I will be rejoining the conversations now that this portion of negativity is gone. I think it is very telling that he found it necessary to point out his absence.
by the way - I like that I can now add photos to replies!
You know, dude, dgreen may have been a bit opinionated and all, but he was here a long time and always had something to say; often worth listening to. I agree with dgreen that this change has been very poorly done, as I have said in another thread, if he worked for me, the dude in charge would have been fired, both for how badly it has been done, and for the letter he wrote chastising anyone who had the temerity to criticize him.
I didn't often actually
I didn't often actually disagree with him, that said I quite often disagreed with his tactic for expressing dissent as it was oft done without regard to the message he was trying to express or the human being on the other end. For that matter, his type of diatribe is often the reason progress is slowed.
in addition to terminating people who wreak havoc - dgreen would have been on my list for the extreme negativity and lashing out at people who did not agree with his entire premise including his penchant for name calling. In the end I feel he was mainly disputatious regardless of his former input.
On this one, it's OK to
On this one, it's OK to change your mind, per your signature.
We all know that Knots is provided at no cost, and is a resource that lives by the privilege of Taunton. That said, long time forum citizens prior to your joining Knots have been vocal about what can be done to improve magazine content and promote forum discussion. Unfortunately, it's a never ending thread, and its infinite life span has nothing to do with the members.
It's courteous to tell your food server why you're not leaving a tip, and DGreen is informing Taunton that the order is wrong, the fries are soggy, and the beer is flat. Shortly, I'm sure, I won't eat at this restaurant either, for many of the same reasons.
I don't know why I'm even
I don't know why I'm even seeing a post from dgreen. I blocked that jamoke years ago. I say good riddance to bad garbage. He was, is and always will be a jerk.
Don,
I wish you the best. This place will be the worse for your loss. I will miss you. I don't show up here much anymore. Your assessment is right on. WHatever problems we used to have, they were trivial when considered in the light of the spirited discussions that were held. I miss many of those who are gone.
I wish you the best, old friend. You have style and personality. You have my private email address. Drop me a line when you figure out where you are going to hang out online.
Mel
Take care Don.. I am sure I will see ya around in another galaxy as I do hang out in Woodworking Projects on another net-work and have frequented that one for over two years. Been here around 10 but did go into hibernation the time they changed the format to the one before this current.
So... I'll keep my eyes open for you elsewhere.
Regards...
I will copy what Mel said...
I wish you the best, old friend. You have style and personality....
Some will miss you. Even me!
Don,
Don't go. It's only a
Don,
Don't go. It's only a bit of discomfort, after all. You must think of your correspondents despite that libertine (I mean libertarian) streak. :-)
In truth I confess the greatest disappointment concerning this change is not the nature of the web pages and navigation but the howls of protest and chucking of teddies from the pram by various otherwise sensible folk. It really does amaze me that fellows can take such umbrage at a minor environmental flicker in their lives.
Still, many have so it must be me - perhaps my queer British stoicism concerning such things. I feel there are many much more damaging events in human society than a change to a web forum's look & feel.
If you do disappear it will be our loss; and one more nail in the coffin. In this sense it will be you and other deserters who are depleting the Knots life force, not some yoof of a web designer, even if he does suffer from a degree of yoof-pomp.
Lataxe, long-armoured agin trivialities (watching out for the real despoilers and life-suckers).
Lataxe:
Your argument that the technology changes are, in the scheme of life's slings and arrows, trivial and it makes no sense for adults to get themselves all hot and bothered.
However,design is the discipline through which we make products intelligible and useful to their purchasers. A company that goes out of its way to make things easier for its customers implies that its customers are important to them and deserving of their respect.
THe release of this site by Taunton, the subsequent mega-whine from Jason, and the slow response to fixes says, to me at least, that Taunton have little regard for me as a customer. Every time I see the "save" button, instead of "post" I think of it as a big f**k-you from the proprietor. Why should anyone have to figure out that save means post?
So, it is not the site, per se, but the message that goes with it that deserves our protest. As Jason said we are "users"; he would do better to think of us as customers.
It is sad to see DGreen pick up his bat and ball and leave. I like my forum spicy and he certainly added that to the mix.
H
Hastings,
I read your reply to Lataxe. I have always liked the way you think. Keep on posting.
Mel
Best of luck Mr Green. You will be missed. I'm hanging around a little longer to witness the possible furneral of this forum. I'm hoping that some folks will cherish the freindships they created, and the knowledge bank available here before leaving over issues like software. I wouldn't bet my 401K on the future of this site. But I'll ride this bus a little longer as the fares are affordable.
God Speed Mr Green
Don,
Will miss you and as
Don,
Will miss you and as Sarge said, I'll keep an eye out on other shores. Maybe on the creek.
Bon Chance
John
Don, I have to agree with you 100%. You are somewhat like me; to tell it like it is, and let the chips fall where they will. I have seen you reply with info on machines in minutes. You are a storehouse of knowledge. Best Wishes whereever you decide to land. I am not here much anymore either, I don't have your vast knowledge, but do know a few things. :<) Maybe I will run into you in your future home. Bruce
I don't understand the need
I don't understand the need for the drama, the personal obituary etc.
Don
It is all about passion. Woodworkers are a passionate bunch, and the better woodworkers are the more passionate. This level of passion/participation may or may not fit your picture of what the forum should be, and that is fine. Those that communicate their passion, or drama as some would call it, only wish to be heard, more as an effort to be recognized and linked to others that are experiencing the same sense of loss.
Taunton made a cold business decision to kill the forum in away that would absolve them of guilt. People feel betrayed since they spent the time and effort to make this a community they felt a part of. Taunton only provided the frame or skeleton, the participants - as many and as diverse as there were - are what made the forum attractive, useful, informative and friendly. Participation is way down, and still dropping, and no word from Taunton or those that made the decision to kill the site.
So....Anyone interested in that pool I suggested on when Knots last day will be?
"This is how it ends, not with a bang, but a whimper" - as the poet wrote.
"It is all about passion."
Writing your own obituary to the "community" says nothing about passion, but lots about ego. No is held here, members come and go.
Some of the more "seasoned" contributors got a bit to comfortable with the forum and could not/would not adapt to the changes. Hmmm when has that happened in history??? Ah the dinosaur yes iI think that is it.
Now there is lots of good discussion happening in this forum, perhaps not at the sam level, not the coffee shop endless digression, but good discussion for perhaps a new group of woodworkers. This forum is certainly no worse than many others out there so I think your little pool idea holds little merit.
"People feel betrayed since they spent the time and effort to make this a community they felt a part of."
But in fact has there been a betrayal?? I think not. The forum is here, no charge, come one come all, some minor hiccups for sure but the site is here and it does work.
" Taunton only provided the frame or skeleton, the participants - as many and as diverse as there were - are what made the forum attractive, useful, informative and friendly."
And what has changed? Nothing other than a number of bruised egos have fled, some quietly some with fanfare. Taunton is still providing the framework etc., all of the topics are seeing activity.
For sure your silly idea of a pool has no merit.
Don
PS Did anyone notice we can post pictures to replies?
it is people that make the forum. taunton just supplied the vehicle.
I first came to look at this forum 4 or 5 years ago and I think what put me off at that time was a thread on using epoxy glues to put furiture together and a couple of other trhreads that were along the same vein. I never came back here until just before christmas. I doubt that I will stay as there is always that whining about what someone else has to do to make it better. I see a lot of wannabees on all the sites. everyone is so sensitive to what is said. it is a public forum. if you want to put your work out there to be seen, you have to be prepared for what may come your way. I realize that everyone's work is the greatest thing in the world unto themselves
there is a big difference between what your wife or friends say about your work; they will all say that it is nice and don't want to hurt your feelings (most of them are not really informed themselves what is good or not good). It is all encouragement.
then comes the real world and this is where the real test is sometimes and your ego may get smacked a little, but you have to take that and learn from it and most here do not question what someone sometimes says. you either go away and pout or come back with guns blazing or someone else that doesn't know that much will come out and defend them. always question what someone says , they may be right and you may learn something
I find it very difficult to get a dialoque going with anyone on these board and by that , I mean questions and answers going back and forth.
back to the original poster. here is someone looking for attention. if you are going to leave , just leave
ron
Hello, I have been a member here for 2 yrs. I don’t post much , as the site seems to belong to “ the regulars “ meaning to older group that is here. I personally feel that I don’t belong due to very short pockets, and can’t play with the top end woods or tools. I see little discussed here in the actual working of wood, it just seems to be a place of “shiny chisels, thousandths of inches, and constant complaints”. I was taught by my parents to respect other peoples opinions, treat them as equals, if you can’t do that then shake hands apologize, and walk off as a gentleman. I guess it’s your choice from here on to stay or leave, should you chose to leave, do so politely and with grace. garyowen
Hello Gary -
I agree - if you leave do so as a gentleman - however the site does not work as well as before, but we are hanging in there.
What I would like you to expand on is " the site seems to belong to the regulars"
We need to increase readership - do you see something that is hurting posters from continuing here other then site glitches?
SA
Weschester, I will certainly be glad to post a reply I will do so soon as possible. garyowen
To Westchester, And All. While I understand things have changed, and some, are of the opinion not for the better. As I said in my other post I am new to the Knots Forum, with this being said, I have been on the out skirts of town for quite some time. We ( wife & I ) have Comcast Cable for our phone, internet, and tv, in those 7 years, there have been many changes in service, as well as online. With each change I had to relearn how things are done, I am self taught in computers & woodworking, some things are more of a challenge than others, some people are faster learners than others, yet I find for me having to read the same thing twice, brings me to the same point as you are after, reading it once. I do believe in the freedom of speech, how ever constant complaining about what You made special, You worked so hard on, you made this site what it was, doesn’t help any one here. If you can’t give some constructive feed back on any topic with out b---h--g and moaning, it is of no benefit to any one and in that respect we all lose out. So with that said, we should all go back and reread the directions, try to help each other out and get on to a new start. ( P.S. The comment you is not meant as an affront, to any individuals here.) Hope this helps garyowen
"I personally feel that I don’t belong due to very short pockets, and can’t play with the top end woods or tools." There's plenty of room for humble shops here! Lots of history too. Sarge built oodles of furniture with his Ryobi table saw. I certainly inhabit the lower half of the monetary spectrum, and any time I post asking about "which machine?" I always make it clear what my budget is (or is not).
So, if anyone out there is holding back because their shop isn't equipped with all Festool and the like, fear not! Come out and join the others who exist on a shoestring or slightly more budget.
Hey Gary -
I understand your reply and in my opinion believe many on the site are hoping a snow ball effect of dissatisfaction will get the powers that be to take notice and work on repairing the disagreeable changes. All here were comfortable with the site the way it was -the change is not welcome.
Anyway - ignore those who won't use their knowledge to chip in helpful constructive comments and would rather fight on.
- maybe this is a chance to voice some constructive ideas. So here goes -
I like to read and learn from the talanted folks here - I also like to help others who I realize from their posts are new and seeking help - however it's fustrating to me when another poster wants to outgun your efforts by answering the question
with a 1000 word essay and causing doubt in your good intentioned comments.
I hate to think I must be a word smith to contribute here -
I'm really just a tradesman seeking out commonalty.
I'm hoping those with advanced writing skills keep their pen at bay.
I'm also hoping for spell check ASAP - maybe even grammer check -
SA
Westchester, I read your reply, and agree that long replies are more often than not confusing. I also want things explained simply,as trying to see it in your head is some times confusing, and very long explanations just make matters worse. Here is a little trick my wife taught me, it is to type this out on Microsoft Word works, if you have it. Word works has spell check, and dictionary lookup. When I am satisfied with the response I push at the same time, ctrl c, go to the response box, and click as if I am going to post, then press ctrl v, this will transfer your comment to the box, then just press the save button. This is how you fix bad spelling, punctuation, and a host of other problems, with out the need to repeat grades 1 thru 12. I have spent a lot of time here today as I was asked for my input, any one here may join in if it is constructive please, lets try to tap in to some good juu juu (? Not in spell check), leave our sharpness to our tools, an not each other, and work on things we can change, like, bad cuts, embarrassing dove tails, and me, my least favorite the dreaded mortis and the ill fitting tenon!!. garyowen
"it's fustrating to me when
"it's fustrating to me when another poster wants to outgun your efforts by answering the question with a 1000 word essay and causing doubt in your good intentioned comments.
What yourself and Gary say has some validity. There are however many times where I've seen short, sharp and succinct responses to questions that are wrong, even dangerous and merely spread bad information that only sounds plausible on a forum but doesn't stand up to serious scrutiny; typically the bad information starts because someone who probably doesn't know much about the subject puts out a poor but superficially plausible response to a question on a woodworking forum, it gets picked up by the next respondent and the next thing you know it's all over the internet like a bad dose of pox.
Some questions really do need detailed information on background theory and science before a useful response can be provided. And if that is the case the answer is likely to be involved and wordy. The alternative would be for the questioner to go and read up on the subject in some depth using reputable resources, eg, books written by acknowledged experts in their field, etc, but if they did that they wouldn't have a question because they would have found the answer for themselves. Slainte.
Mr Chester,
This plea of yourn:
"I hate to think I must be a word smith to contribute here -
.............I'm hoping those with advanced writing skills keep their pen at bay".
Now that is a strange attitude, I must say. Why must everyone keep to the same level of written expression arbitrarily chosen by W Chester esquire? Does the same apply to woodworking skills? Perhaps we all must confine ourselves to pockethole joints or wax finishes?
I do sympathise with a desire for posts that are to the point, even if not short. (Richard Jones is right to suggest that some subjects need full explanations). Also, it is pleasant to read unambiguous as well as comprehensive prose if someone is either describing a problem or supplying an answer.
There is also the matter of presentation. Great blocks of undifferentiated text, long rambling sentences of confusing grammar and dully repetitious drones are wearisome. Let us not forget to condemn, either, those expressions of confused and often prejudicial opinions that are free of supporting argument and often riddled with self-contradictions.
*****
Writing in a forum does need to condense matters to their essentials perhaps. One wishes to grasp the question or answer reet-quick and without the need to imbibe 28 irrelevant mentions of the poster's emotional state or life history..... Although some characters are quite fascinating and one almost hopes they will embark upon a ramble into estoteric matters, as it can be educative to see how ferners and strangers think.
As with woodworking, it is no bad idea to increase both the range and degree of one's skills when it comes to self-expression in speech or writing. Isn't this what life is fundamentally about for us hoomans - the joy of finding things out then employing the results.
Some lads get the idea in their wee heeds that "I cannot do that". Perhaps you have persuaded yourself that you cannot get better at self-expression or the parsing of less-simple prose? I assure you that you are deluding yourself here as all it takes to gain these skills is (as with any other skill) the desire to do so and the work involved in getting there.
Unless it's just laziness of course. :-)
At present I am learning the classical guitar. This is extemely difficult for me and progress is very slow. Is this a reason to give up or persuade myself that I can't ever do it (even if it will take another decade)? Just the opposite in fact.
Lataxe, wary of low common denominators
PS Perhaps you also need to distinguish between people who disagree with you, giving reasons, and those who seek to "outgun" you. It is not an automatic question of your good intentions to question some aspect of your opinion or to dispute something offered as a fact. On the contrary, it is a compliment to be engaged in a meaningful discussion as it shows that your interlocutor takes you seriously.
PPS I do hope this post is not too wordy for ye. :->
Friends
Just to be clear -
Friends
Just to be clear -
I'm not trying to spread dangerous woodworking information around the Internet - nor am I suggesting limiting freedom of expression.
Rather we should help folks by answering the question asked - and not debate each others responses.
My comments are for the sake of increasing readership - lets not loose posters who feel slighted by responses directed at their posting. The opening post here is by a guy who is leaving - nobody wants that and everyone on this site should feel welcome. We will increase readership with that approach.
There is a Lady on this site who has been a long time supporter.
She doesn't always agree with comments however she can word a response to a comment in a way that helps the thread and not push away a poster. We should all try to help the site like she has for so many years.
SA
"I'm not trying to spread
"I'm not trying to spread dangerous woodworking information around the Internet
I don't believe you are SA, and I didn't suggest that I thought you were doing so. I pointed out that there are times when a short response doesn't answer a question as effectively as a longer response would-- a long response, where it's appropriate, gives such things as the reasons why a particular course of action is appropriate, or includes a short description of the background science or theory behind a particular recommendation so that the recommendation itself makes sense to the person that asked the question. Slainte.
Thanks for the reply Sgian -
Good to hear from you -
I'm proud to be part of this group who have the exact same interests as mine -
SA
I'm proud to be part of this
I'm proud to be part of this group who have the exact same interests as mine -
And I have not the the skills of yours,,
Gary,
I personally feel that I don’t belong due to very short pockets.
You are not along, I am in aw of those that spend more on one hand plane then I did on my first table saw.
I will miss dgreen for his knowledge he shared even if one sometimes lost a pound of flesh for a query.
Don
It sounds like you can not learn new tricks to old dogs.
Has any of you any idea how much work it is to run, manage or change forums?
Probably not, i do and must say its is hard work.
I have to get used to the new look and do not like some of the changes, but you get used to them quickly enough.
I have a small forum about treadle machines maybe you would like to post on that one, we can use some more members who are willing to express them self's.
Have a look:http://treadleit.com/
Have fun and stop the nagging.
Like Obama said, its time for change.
I am personally glad DG started a thread to say he was leaving. If he hadn't... I would wonder if anything happened to someone regular here normally. When you start getting older things can happen suddenly and you just aren't there anymore.
So now I know and will probably run into him elsewhere. It is totally ir-relevant to me why he is leaving. Just as it is totally ir-relevant to me how Taunton sets up and runs "their" web-site. That is there business and none of mine.
If you are not interested that DG was not going to around any longer.. you were not forced to read beyond the fact he was. Life is simple!
Well, I wouldn't want to see
Well, I wouldn't want to see Don take off. Then again, I doubt if he is really departing into the sunset.....
Philip,
I tried to send you a message in a thread that I just started, on an Infill plane. It is in Handtools. I couldn't figure out how to send you a message from there, but when I saw your message here, I thought it would be a convenient way to contact you. I really would like your comments on the infill plane that I wrote about in that message. It is on EBAY now. I am not thinking about buying it. I am just interested in what a knowledgeable person could glean about it from the photos that the maker shows.
You might even want to contact the seller to see what his experience is in selling infill planes on EBay.
Anyway, I sure would like to know what your reaction is to that EBay ad. You are the most knowledgeable guy I know in the area of infill planes.
THanks,
Mel
Well, interesting comments from Don Green. I'm new here and feel like I walked into a family argument. I'm not sure what Don is so upset about but why would anyone want to put a "pox" on someone over a web site? Has he always used the same signature? Seems a little disturbed to me. I hope he is happier somewhere else. Please put me in my place if you feel I'm being too judgemental.
A few posts ago I whined about not getting any responses to my comments and a few of you chimed in and made contact, Thank you I appreciate it.
I enjoy this site, if I didn't I would politely leave.
Hi all, I certainly didn't
Hi all, I certainly didn’t expect this type of response!.I rather enjoy it, it’s nice to see and read each post, there have been many very good points made here.
I will not use names as it seems you always leave some one out.(1)As with any forum, there will always be bad info floating about, it is up to all of us,to correct that,for the safety of all that chose to join or just visit.(2)Long explanations to a question are indeed necessary, if warranted,due to either complexity,or other factors.(3)It was pointed out that by using other search sites, you can get info, from these sites,so there is no reason to be here, this is what I,and many others are trying to prevent, these sites can contain dangerous practices, as well.(4) This is an excellent reason to come here,and safety trumps all,let every one know about it, get it cleared up,and be thankful,that maybe we saved some fingers, or worse.(5) Abbreviations can be confusing, once in a wile lets spell things out fully, this will also help, make new members feel more comfortable, and less intimidated. I hope my input has hade a positive effect. garyowen
Don,
I was one of the first to post a response to your message about leaving. Today I saw that many more had responded so I read them. I was thinking that these were all folks who were paying their respects to an old friend.
WOW, was I surprised. Many of the responses in this thread seem to demonstrate why you are leaving. THings are not like they used to be. The problem is partly with FWW/Taunton, but the rest of the problem is with those who post. Trying to explain to some of the inane posters why their posts were inane would be like trying to describe the concept of color to a person who has been blind since birth.
No doubt in my mind that you will be happier elsewhere.
Have fun.
Mel
"THings are not like they used to be."
I think things are exactly like they used to be. A bunch of regulars complaining about something. The regular posters all have a bit of a "call it as THEY see it" attitude.
Don,
I'll miss your
Don,
I'll miss your knowledge, dedication, and straight-to-the-point/tell-it-like-it-is approach. Sorry you're calling it quits. Take care.
Cheers,
Don,
Thanks for your posts, your keen wit and observations, and your intolerance for stupidity and prejudice. As far as I am concerned your points were thoughtful and considered. Perhaps the message was blunt but often the response was more than deserved. As a "regular" who will forget more about working wood than I will know, you earned more than this forum.
It is interesting that no one is picking up on your obvious point here, Jason has some serious issues, and I doubt many have done a Google search on his name. The comments that are posted about him from past ventures are disconcerting. I can relate to your forbidding sense of doom about this forum, and your election to move away. I get that.
Best of luck and I wish you the best
Morgan if the link stays I will be surprised!
http://www.audiencedevelopment.com/2009/jason+revzon
Your point is taken. I've
Your point is taken. I've been a member of Knots for several years (I'm on my 3rd ID due to previous "updates") and I'm still waiting to form my personal decision as to whether the new Knots merits my usual amount of attention. That said, Jason was almost certainly hired to boost Web traffic and increase advertising exposure. If I check Alexa he seems to have done that to the tune of ~30% growth over the past 6 months. Some of us may think he's a pompous ass but if he's getting paid to deliver eyeballs he's certainly meeting the objective. We can always hope that his success will make him more marketable and he will move on to another great opportunity. I suspect Sarah Palin could use someone with such obvious talent!
Regards,
Ron
Sir..I am supprised at your comment...
..as the site seems to belong to “ the regulars “ meaning to older group that is here....
I have been around here for a few years and I have always experienced that 'most' of 'us old timers' welcomed the 'new folks'. I think most if not all enjoyed the 'newcommers'. Most woodworkers love to share ideas. Even if the idea (words?) we express are wrong or need 'modern' words to express them.
As a real 'old timer', as in age, I am so sorry you feel that way. Maybe us 'old timers' just say things as we 'see it' and we have received so many bruses in out lifetime, we forget what it is like to live without pain?
Maybe it is just our, built up over time, EGO?
One thing to remember is that words 'typed' are not necessarily the words a old timer was thinking of. Our old brains are filled with old and new thoughts. I find it hard to sort it out when 'typing' some quick reply.
Anyway, I am glad you came and expressed.. I for one, hope you stay!
We are not your 'Enemy"... Hell, I experienced this from my parents. Good folks, mostly, but I LOVED listening to 'OLD BLUES' music. My folks were not very fond of different colored folks.. I never thought of color.. I just liked the music!
I have been known to make MORE than a few stupid comments in my days..
To Will George,I just read your reply I believe it is my post you refer to.The term old in this instance,refers to being on this site,for many years,not as in,long in the tooth.I understand the confusion part, as we all get there, some just arrive a little ahead of schedule. I am going to try to stay here for a while,in hopes, that some of the attitudes change,if they don’t I will just hit the ignore button. Some of the posts over the past few days have been encouraging, and I think many people here are ready to move on,and try to make this work for all of us. I am more than willing to listen to,or read good advice, from this I take what I can use, and what is of value. I shall put my best foot forward, give the best advice I can,on a subject I feel comfortable with,and will try not to trod upon any ones toes.Please do not use new words as those really confuse me. Please accept this explanation and apology. garyowen
Sir..
...Please accept this
Sir..
...Please accept this explanation and apology. garyowen..
None needed! I took no offence. I like folks to 'speak up' and say what they think.
I have been around here for a few years and I have always experienced that 'most' of 'us old timers' welcomed the 'new folks'
I must say I have found this to be true. I've only been around for a couple of months. I've asked a handful of questions and people have been very accepting and helpful. I hope some of you "regulars" stick around. I value your experience and insights. And as a new woodworker I need all the insights I can find. :)
why cant we all just get along .
yes there are some of us that have more experience than others,more tricks than others,some of us do this fulltime & some parttime (like me)I am a carpenter by trade & I will never claim to know everything,I will always try to understand other guys ideas but will never bad mouth them
but cant we just be respectfull on other people's comments remeber no one pays for this site so be a respectfull
I miss the old Knots. I am getting used to the new version and find they are fixing the bugs. The biggest things I miss now are the "regulars" and I wish those who left gave it a chance. No doubt new regulars will take their place and in time it will all seem normal again. I still get answers and the help I need though it may take a little longer.
Dana
Regardless of peoples likes/dislikes about Don's personality, I agree with his reasons for leaving. I too am thinking about abandoning ship. The web designers have totally ruined my daily read. A poor web design has led to very little traffic and there is not nearly as much chatter here anymore. I have to say the web designers blew the changeover and I cannot see it recovering anytime soon.
Has anyone thought about starting an old knots forum on the Delphi site like the breaktimers? They got around the ownership issue, and the old breaktime site is alive and well with all the regulars.
Brad
"Has anyone thought about starting an old knots forum on the Delphi site "
If it's the different interface that folks don't like, isn't it a bit silly to go somewhere else and start a new forum with . . . a different interface?
As I understand, Delphi was the version being used for this forum previously. Other than a few color changes the classic breaktime site looks and functions exactly as the old one. Tons and tons of the regulars left breaktime, but now chat on the classic forum.
I have silly thoughts everyday, why should this day be any different?
Brad
Ralph, the site has been created. It's a sub forum of Breaktime classic.
http://forums.delphiforums.com/burl
But everyone who said they are leaving is still here. :)
You've noticed a lot of that,
You've noticed a lot of that, too, eh? ;-)
Yup. That tells me that either A) they're so desperate for membership that both of them are here to recruit or B) they're never going to leave, and are merely here to post "WE LEFT AND AREN'T REALLY HERE..." posts.
All in all, pretty funny.
I'm still here. The
I'm still here. The committee has not yet released me. Must find Brandy and get some....
"Has anyone thought about starting an old knots forum on the Delphi site like the breaktimers?"
It already exists. http://forums.delphiforums.com/cabnet/messages/?start=Start+Reading+%3E%3E
It's been around for awhile but no one uses it. much like my Leigh dovetail jig. Apparently you can click on "create a forum" and start your own Knots Classic if you want.
thks. I didnt know that started. It must be the Breaktimers took greater offense to the changeover. The classic version of that one is alive and well.
Brad
You guys are doing a fantabulous job with the deck chairs!
Goodbye and Thanks For All the Fish, eh? Bailing out because the World as We Know It is going away?
Really, guys, I don't get it. I have a delightful time on an email list that has no look or feel at all besides plain text. the folks there are a pleasure to talk to and be taught by. It is fun to be able to make a contribution, too.
Honestly, I don't like the new test or "beta" forum set up here as well as the old one. However, even in the good old days I came for the chat, and the learning not the look. I just don't get why sub-optimal mechanics would run people off. Think back a few year to a time when even the old site would have been technically impossible and we would all have been bowled over by whatever was at hand in the form of a BBS. Hell, guys, I think back to getting a graduate business degree with no "home" computer because there weren't any. We had to write in COBOL and thought it was the bee's knees.
All that said, while I enjoy KNOTS regardless of who well I like the mechanics of it, I do come here less than before and participate still less. I lost my zeal back during a dark period of flame wars and defamation of character. My attitude was not affected by software, but rather, by unpleasant people who hid behind computers to take pot shots at each other. And then there were the thread hijackers who liked to load everybody down with irrelevancies, or provoke argument where none existed.
And yet, despite even that, I do come back and come back again. Why? Because I value and enjoy the majority of the group and have tremendous respect and gratitude for several.
And so, here I am and here I stay.
Cheers!
Joe
I feel everyone is missing the point here. Yhe point is not that the bbs changed its the fact that it still doesn't work right. Most of the so-called bugs should have been worked out before the new board was rolled out, perhaps by running the beta site in parallel to the old one. Then switch over after the bugs were worked out.
The whole issue of bugs sort of bothers me too. The platform the board is based on is a mature one. Most of the problems we seem to be having are not issues that I know of on other implementations of this platform, which leaves us with the scolder who was horrified that we weren't more appreciative of his efforts.
I stay because I hope it will get better. The deafening silence from the people in charge bothers me more every day. If they worked for my company, they would be gone.
(I need to note none of this is aimed at Gina. I think she is doing an admirable job for someone who is in a clearly untenable position.)
Paul
Paul, so are you suggesting when you build a piece of furniture or a cabinet you make sure all the parts fit and the finish is complete before you give it to the client? Wow, you are one crazy fellow. ha!ha!
Brad
Joe:
" I just don't get why
Joe:
" I just don't get why sub-optimal mechanics would run people off."
And I bet you use, and have always used a Windows/DOS computer.
She is indeed doing a good job. Unfortunately, she has to bite her tongue while the AOL Boy Wonder hired in over her head screws things up 'real good.'
Not a fun position to be in I'm sure.
Are the Metrics getting better yet?
What ya'll think?
Seriously? AOL? That would explain a great deal. I almost hope you are kidding or all is lost.
Nope. Not kidding. Google Jason Revzon.
Geez. And the board is drupal. A mature platform with a fantastic user base, with plenty of accessible, free help.
I'm just here for the
I'm just here for the conversation and to exchange ideas with other woodworkers. It's good to be here! I could care less about site mechanics and don't understand why some folks are so upset about it. Just chill, lets talk about wood. Woodworkers are supposed to be mellow.
"I could care less about site mechanics..."
bd old buddy, I guess from that you actually care quite a bit then, even a great deal, or perhaps you care heart stoppingly passionately about the site mechanics; at least that's what you said unless you meant to say "couldn't" and inadevertantly omitted the, er, hmm(?), n apostrophe t... ha, ha-- ha, ha, ha? Slainte.
Sorry about my poor punctuation. What I meant was, I'd rather talk about woodworking than site mechanics. Apostrophes confuse me, I'm more comfortable with lumber.
.
Although we are not quite "old buddies" yet but I am glad to make your acquaintance and hope we can become friends.
.
Thank goodness for the spell checker but unfortunately it is of limited use on punctuation. I actually thought I said it right, was it a double negative or something?
bd, your phrasing was an example of the curious and amusing form of English Americans sometimes use. When an American says, "I could care less," they are usually trying to say they couldn't care less. I'm assuming you are American and it sounds normal to you; it just sounds very odd to me, but who am I to talk because we Brits probably use English that puzzles Americans. Slainte.
Slainte, I think that was a very polite way of telling me I'm butchering the English language, ha ha. I'm guilty as charged, American too. I'll borrow my wife's Jane Austin books and see if I can't learn proper English in the curious manner that you Brits speak it. Later, old chap.
Slainte, I think that was a very polite way of telling me I'm butchering the English language.. Caught my eye!
I was once taught that English is a 'Traders Language'. It changes with the area/people that use it. I think is is natural. I have travled most, but not all of the world, and the only place I had a really hard time understaing local English was in Scotland. I knew they were speaking a sort of English (maybe just for me?)
I loved them folks, but, I had no idea what they said to me.
With my work, I mostly traveled within the USA. Every state more than a few times over. Hell, I can go 200 miles and not understand the local slang.
I worked/travled a few years with two young women from Belgium. The both spoke maybe 4? fluent languages (I say fluent because they could read and write it
I'm still working on my English. Both told me that English is very hard for them, especially in the USA. They thought they knew the words but NOT the meaning in the environment where the words were spoken. I gave up telling them American jokes.. The just gave me glazed over eyes and a big smile.
I tried very hard to learn German while in the Army. I was stationed in Germany. Only because, afterall, I am mostly of German blood.. I failed miserably!
" but who am I to talk because we Brits probably use English that puzzles Americans. Slainte"
it puzzles more than americans
ron
Ron,
I hope you are not suggesting the Queenie has failed to set propah rules concerning the diction and nomenclatures? Her inflooens sadly wanes as it crosses the Atlantic, which is why you lads all mumble and get your words wrong, not to mention the spellings.
Still, there is always a helpful Limey around to put you right. If you like, I can send you over a copy of my Grammer Skool English Lit & Lang primers, which also contain the korrect form of address for posh folk, such as "Yer 'Onour" and "Me Ladeee", used when people with Big Hats come around for tea and scones.
Lataxe, your frenly pedant.
10-4 good buddy. Just hold out yer pinky whiles you chugg yer six pack wddn't want themuns over in Angland to think weuns was uncultureded. Who cares about them danged apostreferrys anyway. Now lets hear yoos best Rebel Yell. yehaw! Gotta go shoot me a squirrel. The wifes readin to me, "Sensable Disabilities" or some daang thing or other. bout a bunch of Anglish weenies fox huntin and waltzing around. Ever et a fox, taste like crap.
Mr Duffin,
You must realise that, as the 51st State and testbed for weird American tele programmes (I mean programs) we here in Blighty are all familiar with your peculiar mores, speech-garbles and orthogynal humour (which is all based on schaudenfraude, being as how y'all suffer individualitis-extremis).
You lads, on the other hand, have come to believe that we are all cockernees or toffs who talk like PG Wodehouse; and act like Mr Bean. In fact we are a nation of sofistycated art-lovers, scientists (all mad, admiddetly) and cat-lovers (not that kind of love).
There are still a large number of peasants but Mrs Thatcher has arranged to have them all declared persona non grata and readied for export to Australia, although I believe that prison is now full. They may have to be sent to Hollywood to serve as extras in your Errol Flynn films about Nottingham Forest, which is now a sheep farm.
Lataxe, whose mere accent would be utterly confusing to any tea-waster.
you must realize that I am not to be confused with those nice fellows below the 49th. just learned the other day about singular and plural y'alls
ron
I did find another segment of those chests. will post a photo
I do also have a piece of Alan Peter's here . we made a trade about 20 years ago
EssDubyah,
You are a tease with that talk of chest-pics and Alan Peters pieces. How long must I be left to drool before you post these pics, inclusive of your AP piece!?
I had failed to realise you was a Kanook. I realise you are marginally more civilised than those fellows lower down (so to speak) and this is because you bowed to Queenie rather longer than the ungrateful wretches that threw good tea into the sea. Obviously Her Goood Menners have retained some of their effect.
The Barnsley chest is now designed and all the parts made and the joints cut. However, I was distracted by archery and geetar-pluckin so no progress in assembling those parts for a month. These are the perils of retirement, in which condition one wanders about doing whatever catches the fancies or eye.
Meanwhile my WW aeriel has tuned in a bit on one Gordon Russell and Utility Furniture. As usual I have scoured Amazon for related books but found (again as usual) that anything promising turns out to be much more biography than furniture-related. I do have a facsimile of the Utility Furniture catalogue issued by HMG during the war (WWII) but there are few details other than small and dingy B&W photos taken with flash powder from 20 yards.
I recall dark and very plain utility furniture items at home in my early years (1576, I mean the 1950s) but its all gorn off to the great scapheap in the sky now, although I never really saw it go. I'm wondering if it's excessive plainess can somehow be relieved whilst retaining its essential form and simplicity...........
Lataxe, rambling about the place and just off to shoot more arrers.
I recall dark and very plain utility furniture items at home in my early years (1576, I mean the 1950s) but its all gorn off to the great scapheap in the sky now...
Good one!
Same here, except, for the dining room table with my grandfathers carved arm chair at the head of the table. He sat in that chair like a King, from where he ruled his kingdom... (He was actually a nice man).
His hand made chair and table had MANY carvings on it. Every saturday I had to dust out all the carvings. He inspected my finish work. I hated that table! He dusted HIS own chair. Nobody was allowed hear it if they were not at least 70 years old? Well, at least I never saw anybody else sit or even touch it.
My grandfather made the table with very simple hand tools, I am sure. We were lucky if more than one lightbulb was lighted in the house...
We all lived in his house and everything else was very old and very plain. I can recall that the dusting rag never caught a sliver. (I think)....
Not sure I ever thought much about this until you brought up the words in your post.. Brought back good and bad memories...
By the way, I like Mr. Bean. He is almost as funny as your words.
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