Replies

1. 
   Rich14 | Mar 21, 2007 06:11am | #1

   Hadley, Everything you could possibly need: http://www.amazon.com/Sam-Maloof-Woodworker/dp/0870119109/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-3447384-3330430?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1174446462&sr=8-1 Rich

1. 
   hadley | Mar 22, 2007 05:15am | #8

   Rich14 and Napie: Thank you both for your courteous responses to my inquiry re Sam Maloof's chair joinery. What a favor!

                                                                   Kindest regards, Hadley

2. 
   Napie | Mar 21, 2007 06:03pm | #2

   Try these.

   
1. 
   Rich14 | Mar 21, 2007 07:02pm | #3

   Napie,

   Good drawings and instructions. The Maloof book shows how he approaches the joint as an exercise in sculpture, more than "just" jointery.

   He makes the joint just as you describe, but the parts are way oversize, look crude and "clunky" when glued up. Then he carrves the whole assembly down to achieve the final appearance.

   I was surprised when I first saw his method. He is completely self-taught and arrived at many of his solutions without any "interference" from the preconceptions of the "right way" that a traditionalist would use. You should see him "carve" freehand with the bandsaw.

   I think most woodworkers would prepare the joining pieces in a more precise way and have all their mating surfaces meet in all  three dimensions and planes before assembling and gluing the joint.

   But that's the difference between an artist and just a furniture maker and why he now can command $50,000 for a rocking chair. Bless him.

   Rich

1. 
   Napie | Mar 21, 2007 09:21pm | #4

   Yeah, I have his books and video.  Unconventional would be how his construction methods would be described.  I have used the joint quite a few times and have done the freehand bandsaw cutting, it is not very safe.  Most of my work leans to the Shaker style versus the <!----><!----><!---->California<!----><!----> style. It is no less work than a more “finished” joint, maybe more due to all the carving and sanding required.  That is why he still only builds about 75 pieces a year even with all his helpers.

   <!----><!----> <!---->

   He would disagree with the “artist” designation.  He says he is still just a woodworker and I would agree, but also a great designer too.

1. 
   Rich14 | Mar 21, 2007 09:36pm | #5

   I don't think I'd be on very firm ground disagreeing with anything Sam has to say. Sure he's just a woodworker. He's genuinely modest.  But I think I could hold my own, refuting his point that he's not an artist.

   I wish I had his just a small fraction of his talent or energy.

1. 
   Elcoholic | Mar 22, 2007 12:15am | #6

   I went to both of his workshops last year.  He is absolutely amazing.  96 years old, he does the shaping and joinery, working 6 long days a week and still likes to occaissionaly peg the tach in his Porsche.  He does more rockers than anything, but cradle orders move to the top of the 2-3 year backlog.  We should all be so lucky.John O'Connell - JKO Handcrafted Woodworking

   The more things change ...

   We trained hard, but it seemed that every time we were beginning to form up into teams, we would be reorganized.  I was to learn later in life that we tend to meet any new situation by reorganizing; and a wonderful method it can be for creating the illusion of progress while producing confusion, inefficiency, and demoralization.

   Petronious Arbiter, 210 BC

2. 
   eric314 | Mar 22, 2007 04:55am | #7

   Napie,Great drawings and explanations.
   Could you please provide some information on the joint between the front leg and the arm rest?
   I am just a beginner so excuse me if the answer is trivial.Eric

1. 
   Napie | Mar 22, 2007 04:41pm | #9

   The arm rest is blind doweled into the front leg. The joint in the drawing is the front leg joint.  The rear leg is only two sides versus three. In other words, it is a 90 deg notch cut out of the rear corner of the seat.  Also Sam uses a set of special rabbet bits that cut a 93-87 deg angle in the notch on some of his chairs to flair out the rear legs.  If you can locate the old “Fine Woodworking on Chairs and Beds” it has the article he wrote about 20 years ago on the building of his rockers.  It is short but pretty good, some libraries have the book. Also, his video is well worth the price just to see him work.

    

   I use his bandsaw technique for making the seats of some spindle type rockers I have built, it works great and saves a lot of hand cutting, just fire up the 8” disc grinder and go.

1. 
   eric314 | Mar 23, 2007 05:33am | #10

   Thanks Napie,
   Eric

3. 
   Lindau | Mar 23, 2007 02:52pm | #11

   Napie, those are great illustrations! I wish I'd had them when I was learning. I always thought the rabbeting  bit was 1/4" instead of 3/8".  Which would make the matching roundover 1/2" instead of 5/8".  In any event, you've really shown the nuts and bolts of the joint, and the fact that the whole thing revolves around the 1/2" bearing. Have you ever played around with this joint using a 1/4" bearing?

   As an aside, I've always noticed that Hal Taylor's joint was "bigger" than Sam's.  I'm seeing now it's as a result of the larger rabbeting bit.  Bill Lindau

1. 
   Napie | Mar 23, 2007 03:03pm | #12

   I can’t take credit for the drawings, I don’t remember where I found them on the web.  The first time I cut the joint, I did it by mostly hand and it was not to difficult. In fact Maloof did them by hand for years.  I think you could change the size if the rabbets without to much problem at all.  The joint is pretty adaptable.

   <!----><!----> <!---->

   I have looked at <!----><!----><!---->Taylor<!----><!---->’s chairs on the web and they seem almost cartoonish compared to Maloofs.  Sam’s work just has that perfect combination of form and proportion that is hard to duplicate unless you make a direct copy.  I’m of the opinion that a couple hundred years from now people like us will copy him like we copy the Townsends and Goddard’s.

1. 
   Lindau | Mar 23, 2007 03:36pm | #13

   I haven't seen anything of Sam's in the last several years. Has he explored any new directions with his chairs? Bill

2. 
   user-200815 | May 27, 2007 08:15pm | #14

   Late to this thread - but here's where you got Marc Adams'
   version of the Maloof chair seat joint. He goes over it
   in his tape on joinery.http://web.hypersurf.com/~charlie2/Joinery/Joinery2.htmlI'm a "visual learner" and often have to draw things to
   really understand it. I can watch a video/DVD and "think"
   I "got it". Then I try and do what I saw done. Typically
   I missed something critical, or didn't understand some-
   thing important. By making a sketch with some notes
   I can then do a scaled drawing - with an isometric view
   to "see" things in "3-D". When I'm done I understand
   things well enough to actually do them - AND - I've got
   the drawings to refer back to if I need to later. The effort
   to put that up on a web page and perhaps help another
   woodworker is neglible.There's so much to learn in woodworking. Why should
   each woodworker have to re-invent the wheel? charlie b

3. 
   user-200815 | May 28, 2007 09:06pm | #15

   In most instances, I much prefer to learn from others' mistakes than to necessarily repeat them myself. I prefer to Stand On The Shoulders of Giants, which is significantly different from your Monkey See Monkey Do analogy.

   You have seen DiCristafora's book on joinery? There are, I dare say, thousands of ways to join two pieces of wood and the Chinese have no doubt come up with many that Westerners still haven't "discovered". Awareness of the various joints available saves "brain time" for designing a piece, selecting the stock from which to build it and deciding on, and then applying properly, the most appropriate finish for the piece.

   One of my "dreams" would be to have a library of colored cast transparent resin copies of some of the trickier joints - the 8 or 10 versions of the triple miter joint for example.

   In the case of the "Maloof chair joint" - it's a strong functional joint which permits "sculpting/blending" the joined parts. And there are no doubt many ways to make this type of joint. The one Marc Adams came up with can be made with off the shelf router bits and a router, a well as a table saw. If the illustrations I did of Adams' method helped another woodworker make the piece he was having trouble with - well I'm glad.

   Designing,building and finishing solid wood furniture is challenging enough. Anything that reduces the "grunt work" is fine with me - which is why I like loose/floating tenon mortise and tenon joints - and have the Festool Domino.

   If you want "challenges" - get into wood turning. No other form of woodworking that I'm aware of has gone off in so many radically different directions in such a short amount of time. If you enjoy figuring things out on your own, check out

   http://www.tahoeturner.com

   and figure out how Malcom Tibbett does what he does. It's really relatively simple - once you've seen how he does it. But that seems to be true of most really innovative things. OK, so E=mc^2 isn't obvious.

   Running low on Potassium. Think I'll have a banana.

   charlie b

1. 
   dherzig | May 28, 2007 09:21pm | #16

   If you can, then take the course Marc himself teaches at the Marc Adams School which focuses on all the various joints. I have a box of them that I made during the course, including the one for the Malouf chair. The final exam is to be given one of the joints from the book of Japanese joints. Then figure out how to make it, including where to start and the total sequence during the final morning.