I very much enjoy the challenge and satisfaction of handout dovetails—currently about 70% challenge and 30% satisfaction. There are many great articles and videos available to refer to, but one aspect I have trouble with seems to be glossed over in these tutorials. When I am sawing down to the baseline for either tails or pins, I have trouble getting the depth of cut precise on the backside of the board, which I cannot see very well.
Any hints or tips on improving this?
Thanks.
Replies
One of those small bathroom mirrors on a stand, that you can also tilt into various angles, placed behind and slightly to one side (to avoid saw-knock) of the piece being cut can help.
Eventually, you're best to acquire the skill to keep the saw not just tracking aright to the line you can see but also dead level throughout the cuts as you make them. It can help to get a "muscle memory" by doing lots of DT cuts in one longish session as you tweak your sawing action, stance and so forth.
As you progress through the first to the 100th DT (perhaps with the aid of the mirror to start) you find yourself gradually learning to keep the saw exactly right in all respects, including level so that the saw kerf is equally deep on the far side as on the nearside.
It helps to have the right stance and height of the work so your arm doesn't make the saw go in any kind of arc. If your forearm just goes straight out and back whilst parallel to the ground, this makes it easier to keep the saw level too.
Letting the saw do the cutting under it's own weight, rather than putting pressure on it by bearing down from your shoulder or wrist, can also help in keeping the saw level. It's tempting to "saw at it" with a tipping of the saw forward then backwards as you push it in and out of the cut, as this seems to make the cutting faster. It doesn't really; and there's no hurry anyway.
Lataxe
I cannot seem to keep my saw level after years and years. I now cut with my saw slightly up on the far side, cut to the line on my side, and stop to look before finishing. The other thing I do is make sure the show side is facing me at all times. An overcut on the inside of a drawer is easier to live with.
Practice, practice, practice.
Some prefer a tapered sawblade, and say it helps them from overcutting on the backside. Like MY, I keep the showside toward me, and don't sweat the inside so much.
It's just one of those things that becomes second nature after a while.
I have a tapered saw and also do like _MJ_ does ;-)
Cut on a slight incline as you near the bottom of your cut. When you're a saw stroke or two away from cutting to depth on the near side, level the saw out and look at the back side of the cut.
Dovetails and mortise and tenons are routine joints. They just take some repetition and addressing one small problem at a time, preferably with something that will have you relying more on feel and sense than extremely tedious methodology.
Give yourself some room to mess up with the intention of learning, and use mistakes as an opportunity to experiment with fixing the aesthetics of some of your mistakes.
Practice produces muscle memory.
Waw from show side, slow down, use a mirror be aware of soft wood, soft grain.
Rather than trying to saw flat - something you can only learn if doing lots of DT's repetitiously and frequently.
A technique that will help you is to establish a kerf on the end grain, then saw at an angle down to the line on the front side, then tilt saw and bring cut down to line on back side. Using a mirror really helps.
Practice...
But, a similar item to what Lat_axe has suggested... I built a little mirror and stand so I can see the backside of workpieces... It was just a piece of mirror I had left over from a project, with some wooden leg/brackets I built to hold it.
I've used it once or twice since I built it six months ago. But, don't use it as much as I thought I would. But, it does work for things exactly as you're describing.
Thanks for all the shared experience. I am especially inspired by the advice that this is another of those skills that comes with practice, practice, and mo' practice. I do recall my initial discouragement with handout mortises, but now keeping the chisel exactly 90º in 2 dimensions while keeping the mortise walls crisp and precise is second nature. I really enjoy keeping things simple with a minimum of jigs and fancy methods.
This blog is a great resource.
Before you know it, you'll wonder why you ever worried about hand cut dovetails.
I learned by watching Paul Sellers videos on YouTube. He has a paid Master Class series as well but he doesn't share anything differently there. I'd watch his YouTube videos on dovetails. They are what taught me. After making them about 10 times they started to look good. Lots of little things you will learn by doing so just practice. In all honesty, they aren't that difficult to make once you practice and they do impress folks. Probably, impress more than they should but then again, there are other things that are more difficult that folks wouldn't be impressed by so we take our wins where we can. Good luck and I've love to eventually see an update here form you on how you've developed at them. You can totally do this.
Be OK with making some dovetail fatwood for the woodstove while you improve! Soon you can cut them in your sleep
Well, thanks, Joe. I've been following Paul Sellers for a couple of years now and find him very helpful and inspiring.
It's been 4 days since my initial post, and in that short time, following the suggestions above, I've just spent lots of time cutting tails and already I'm starting to hit the rear baseline much more consistently. Very satisfying.
My current project involves making a much larger version of a dog feeding station I made a year ago for a small dog, to accommodate our new Irish Wolfhound. The small one turned out pretty good, but the large one involves more dovetails that have to mate on the taller sides. Photo below of the small one.
All fun.
There is a great new FWW podcast showing Mike using blue tape to lay out the dovetails and angling the saw up slightly
Hi TboneTim,
I am glad to hear it helped you. Irish Wolfhounds are beautiful animals.
Sincerely,
Joe
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