Replies

1. 
   JimGG_ | Nov 05, 2000 04:56pm | #1

   *
   The criteria for a 1000 sq.ft. shop are probably identical to the criteria for a 1000 sq.ft. home. What fuels are available at the job site (Is there natural gas?)? Compare fuel costs. How much do you want to spent on the hardware part of the job? How do installation costs compare?

1. 
   Dave_Dugdale | Nov 06, 2000 12:58am | #2

   *Kate, I deliberated on heating options long and hard when I built our 2500 sq.ft.; shop eight years ago. We are in VT and winter heating costs are a major expense. I settled on in floor radiant heat. We use a small propane boiler for the heat source. It has proven to be a very good choice. The only "complaint" that I have is that with so much heat stored in the slab if you get an unusually warm day in the fall after the boiler is turned on you may have to open the doors to reduce the temp in the building, because even though the circulators aren't running the floor is still radiating the stored heat.

1. 
   Bob_Powers | Nov 13, 2000 02:29am | #3

   *Having just built a new workshop from the ground up, I strongly recommend hydronic heating. There is no dust, no open flame, no noise, nothing but comfort. My shop is 700 square feet, and is heated by a 40 gallon hot water heater.

1. 
   Lisa_Moon | Nov 22, 2000 07:53pm | #4

   *Dave, I find myself in the same predicament as Kate. I have considered floor radiant heat, but haven't explored it further just yet. Do you think the system was more expensive than the average system, and do you think the cost of using it is reasonable? (Purely subjective, I know...)

1. 
   Dave_Dugdale | Nov 26, 2000 01:45am | #5

   *Lisa, in floor radiant heat was considerably more expensive to install than a conventional forced hot air system when we did it (8 years ago). I have no doubt that I have recouped the difference in cost, by its increased efficiency. We also did the installation of the tubes ourselves prior to the floor being poured. It was quite easy. The major point to remember is to keep the length of each circuit equal.I like radiant heat because it is efficient, clean, safe, and the shop has an incredibly even temp. all winter long. Even after having the overhead door open for an hour, to unload a truck, as soon as the door closes the air temp jumps right back up to normal. Everthing with mass in the shop is at the same temperature, so it doesn't take long to rewarm the air. This is something that you will really appreciate if you do any finishing.Dave

2. 
   mike_semo | Nov 26, 2000 05:16pm | #6

   *I just have a 500 sq. ft. shop and use a downdraft natural gas furnace. Even though I keep it clean, in a small shop there is ALWAYS dust on everything. In the winter when the outside door is closed and the furnace turns on you always get that dust moving around, and the temp by the garage door is always about 10 degrees colder than by the furnace. Being used, it was cheap to install, but when building a new shop, I will definitely put in radiant floor heat.

3. 
   David_I._Bell | Nov 28, 2000 09:24am | #7

   *OK, I think I may have blown it. I just had a new garage built as part of a larger house remodel project and I didn't think about putting radiant heat in the slab. It's poured, it's too late, I'll just have to get over it (and kick myself for some time to come!). Now... I still have to heat my workshop (err, garage that is). I live in the San Francisco Bay area so winter temperatures aren't that bad. I'm a little leery of a gas fired "hot dawg" style furnace (fire hazard?). Should I be concerned? Electricity is not cheap here (#$%! Pacific Gas & Electric). Any ideas? All opinions welcomed. -- David

4. 
   Dave_Dugdale | Nov 28, 2000 01:07pm | #8

   *All is not lost! If this is actually a workshop and not a garage you could lay the radiant tubes on top of the slab and then install a wood floor over the top. This arrangement will give you the advantages of the radiant heat AND you will be walking on a wood floor instead of concrete!Besides who needs a garage in San Fransico anyways?

5. 
   Vern_Tator | Nov 30, 2000 06:01am | #9

   *All this talk of heating and no one has mentioned insulation. When I built my current shop 8 years ago, I was really furious that the building dept. made me insulate it just like a house. R19 walls and R30 ceilings. Retrospectively it was the best thing they made me do. Without proper insulation you can't have a reasonable heating system. The insulation also helps keep it cool in the summer, the best investment in my shop , next to my cyclone dust collector.

6. 
   Dave_Dugdale | Nov 30, 2000 12:11pm | #10

   *You are absolutely right! Without proper insulation it doesn't matter what you use to heat with. Our shop has R-19 walls and R-35 ceiling. With a heated slab it also has 1" of foam under the slab and 2" around the perimeter (not enough), which extends down below the slab about a foot.The reason I say that the perimeter insulation of the slab is insufficient is because the ground around the edge of the building doesn't freeze up as solid as the rest of the yard. I'm obviously getting heat leakage.

7. 
   David_I._Bell | Nov 30, 2000 07:13pm | #11

   *Yep, my workshop will be well insulated. What kind of dust collection system did you install. That is the one of the areas I have no experience with and I want to set one up.

8. 
   Hiding_under_a_cloak_of_Mystery | Dec 05, 2000 04:18am | #12

   *I "built" my shop inside an existing 8000 square foot warehouse and to start with it had no roof, just walls. Very freaking cold.When I finally was able to afford to build the second floor, I insulated very heavily in the 2x10 rafters/joists. The 2x4 walls are also fully insulated. My heating system is one of those torpedo propane blowers. The upside is that it is fairly cost effective and heats the shop right up.Down side is that it can scare the heck out of you (it is on a thermostat), may not be legal (don't ask, don't tell policy, in fact I seriously doubt it is) and gets your leg real hot when standing in front of it.I point it at the shaper and let it go. One of these days I will move it to the other end of the shop but until then I don't worry.I also use a big fan to circulate the air from the ceiling to floor. That way the hot air doesn't immediately creep out.

9. 
   Gary_Weisenburger | Dec 18, 2000 05:08am | #13

   *Hasn't anyone suggested a wood stove? I'd be using one today, but I don't own my commercal shop. I heated my CT boatshop with nothing but a woodstove for fifteen years. As a backup source, I think you may find your "store-bought" heating system will infrequently cycle on.

10. 
    Renaldo_dawson | Jan 03, 2001 09:02pm | #14

    *Yo Wood warm? Heating device should be aproved by the company that insures the building.. Some heating appliances may not be satisfactory to meet code requirements.. the propane and kerosine heaters both produce huge amounts of water vapour.. We don't need more than about 35% R.H. in a shop so consider devices that will reduce relative humidity and provide moisture stability for tool surfaces and wood stored..

11. 
    Mathias_Raulf | Jan 04, 2001 07:24pm | #15

    *We have a 10.000 sq/ft area to heat. Since this room is rented (an old warehouse for cold storage) I will not go to the expense and insulate the roof, floor and four walls. Insulated windows to boot.I have a diesel-fuel burner with an inbuilt fan and keep the thermostat just over freezing in wintertimes so as not to kill all those glues and the rest of fluids.If I were to heat this shop all winter long I might as well burn my money, it is so expensive.We dress accordingly, no spraypainting here, and like to work onsite in those warm homes of the customers.My old master always said "Think of something warm...".But yes - insulation, radiant floor-heating is great.Bigger outfits in Germany create so much sawdust and that many chips, that they can use whatever is in those bags to burn in special ovens (automatically fed) and create heat and electricity they can sell.Now that is the nicest way of creating a purpose for the dust that gets blown around otherwise.

12. 
    Tom_Witt | Apr 06, 2001 05:43am | #16

    *The one system I don't see mentioned here is infrared radiant heaters. These can be installed as electric power or gas powered. The advantage is that they heat objects (such as a woodworker) and not the air.Go to McMaster Carr and do a search.http://www.mcmaster.comIf you can't install floor radiant heat this is perhaps the next best thing for larger shops.Regards, Tom

13. 
    Brent_Hornick | Apr 24, 2001 06:30pm | #17

    *I would consult with your insurance company and ask which type of heat they recommend and rates associated with different heat sources. Here in Ontario Canada I was informed that a wood stove or any open flame appliance would terminate my insurance on the shop and contents. Also they asked whether I had installed or portable dust collection, as I had installed they looked more favourably at me. Good shop heating choices:1. Radiant-in floor-slab installed or installed over existing floor in a light weight concrete.2. Base board with gycol/water mix3. radiant tube (large pipe suspended from the ceiling with fan and burner at one end.) draws in outside air for the burn process and exhaustes right back outside on the other end.The heat source should have a sealed flame and burn outside air for combustion.Also looking at adding solar to the system to augment the water/glycol heating process. Would probably be sufficient enough for those in-between days in the fall and spring.

14. 
    Glenn_Boland | Apr 26, 2001 02:50pm | #18

    *Tom,I have taken your advice and used the McMaster Carr Website. It's a great resource! Thanks for the tip. By the way, I am also looking for an inexpensive heating source for my own basement shop. Venting is a problem but I like the flexibility and ease of use of a small propane heater. Any thoughts on this?

15. 
    chuck_godlasky | Jun 10, 2001 06:53am | #19

    *RE: Heating my workshopWould it be a good idea to use a pellet stove to heat a small shop? It seems to have a lot of advantages -sealed heat source, no smell, relatively inexpensive fuel, thermostat control, etc.Chuck [email protected]

16. 
    Dan_Bloomer | Jul 25, 2001 09:37pm | #20

    *I heated a 1500 sq. ft shop with 11' ceilings and poor insulation here in central Maine for 8 yrs with a mobile home oil furnace set up on a cottage base. My burner guy said it was it was too large a building for the furnace, but it did not run all the time as he said it would even mid-winter. Furnace is approx. $1200 to $1500 plus tank to set up.When I stopped heating with wood I never looked back.Paying employees to stoke up the furnace in the morning didn't make much sense economically.Natural gas is not proving to be as dependably cheap as was originally projected; propane is much more expensive than fuel oil.

17. 
    WmPhelps | Nov 19, 2001 07:10pm | #21

    *Hydronic heating has great pluses and it has downsides. While ill recommend this type of heating as it tends not to dry out the air and has better efficiency ratings in the long run. Ask yourself or add to this discussion, What type of climate do you live and work? You stated NE so this type of heating would be beneficial in the long run. Do you work everyday in this shop? Are you using this shop off and on or for short periods? If so then hydronic heating may not be the best for you unless you decide to keep the heat on or set it to thermostat.Also be advised that hydronic heating is VERY slow to respond to sudden demand in increased or decreased heat. increased or decreased heat isnt instant at the thermostat like forced air heat.hydronic heat has some downsides as far as sudden changes in outside temps. This is a workshop not a house, at times you might deal with condensation. In a woodworking shop condensation can lead to rusting on tools that have floor contact because those tools are being warmed by the floor. You might need to consider a de-humidfier in your shop since hot air is always prone to dry the air out while hydronic heating can actually increase the humidity in a shop. IN the Dry west youd probably not see a change in humidity, but areas of higher humidity this can wreak havoc on your wood and your floor contact tools.You might consider adding solar type heating to help offset your primary source. If your can have your skylights on the south facing roof to allow passive solar heat. essentially your making the shop into a greenhouse per se. however at night these skylights are a great heat sink, letting stored heat escape from your shop so thermal windows are a must if you use this shop regularly. COnsider basic ceiling fans to move that hot air around your ceiling/truss/rafter area to help offset your primary heat source.

18. 
    John_Casteen_ | Nov 23, 2001 05:40am | #22

    *My new (almost completed) shop has a direct-vent propane heater whose name I picked up from the FWW article a couple of years ago. I looked at a number of different systems which would have been acceptable from my insurer's point of view; the one I ended up with was about half the price of a forced air furnace, and has the same efficiency rating. I'm happy with it. That said, I think the best heat for a wood shop comes from a wood stove. I have worked in two different shops heated with wood; it's comfortable, keeps scrap from piling up, and forces one to sweep.

19. 
    Tom_Watson | Nov 29, 2001 03:03am | #23

    *I use a 150,00 btu, kero fired, 'salamander' type heater in my 1300 square foot shop. My shop is in Southeast Pennsylvania.There are many advantages to this. I use a thermostat that I got from Grainger and leave the heat at about forty degrees most nights. When I come into the shop in the morning, I can get the temperature to about sixty degrees in about twenty minutes, even on the coldest day.When I need to leave the heat higher because of glue-ups or curing finishes, I can set the heat at any temp, to about ninety degrees.I have a spray room with an explosion-proof fan and this kero heater can provide as much make-up heat as needed to counteract the loss from the fan. It is on the other side of a wall and about twenty-five feet away from the furnace filter covered openings that allow air from the main shop to get into the spray room.I have two CO meters in the shop to provide redundancy in the readout of gasses (never a problem). I have a digital RH/Temp gauge to check the thermostat setting and to make sure the RH does not get out of hand. During firing, the RH does climb but during inactive periods, it quickly drops back to normal.I have a number of recycled plastic drums (55 gallon US)and this enables me to buy kero when it is at a favorable price. At the current rate of $1.20 per gallon USD, it is pretty cheap heat, since I have never used more than five drums in any one winter (over fifteen years).The heater is noisy, although I am well used to it by now. If it is tuned up properly, it does not smell, nor does it create an oily atmosphere in the shop that might contaminate finishes. I buy a tune up kit every other year and spend one hour installing it.This system has worked well for me for a long time.

20. 
    pwl15 | Apr 01, 2002 02:48am | #24

    Hi Dan,

    I am also in the Northeast (MA) and 2 years ago put heat in my 800 sq foot barn workshop.  It is fairly well insulated.  I did some research and found that the number one concern of heating a shop is the issue of an open flame.  I had thought about a wood stove but for the prior reason and the fact that I am a weekend warrior in woodworking I don't generate enough scraps to make much of a dent in the required burn pile.  I choose to go with a direct vent propane drive wall furnace.

    I decide on an Empire - specifically model  DV-55 (55k BTU) with a built in fan.  It is a tall vertical unit and doesn't take up much wall space.  It's quick and easy (for a professional) to install - I think the whole thing cost me about $1,000.  Their website is at http://www.empirecomfort.com/.  Also, here is a good site for 'sizing' the system you will need  http://www.warmair.com/. 

    Good luck

21. 
    smijal | Apr 01, 2002 10:49pm | #25

    I just finished having a Reznor SFT sealed combustion (direct vent)  45,000 BTU  natural gas heater put in my soon to be 840 sq. ft. workshop. I chose the unit because the lack of an open flame is conducive to paint/finish vapors, and also doesn't contribute to humidity from the combustion process. Unfortunately I won't be ready to sire the place for another 2 weeks, so I'll have to wait to see how it works.