All,
I’m an occasional lurker, long-time hobbiest woodworker. Ya’ll take it easy on me, this is my first post here….
So I go down to the shop tonight to work for a few hours, and while poking around in my wood stash I notice a bunch of black dots on the floor. These don’t appear to be part of my normal dust and clutter. Closer inspection reveals little beetles, about an eighth of an inch long and shaped like skinny footballs. They are all dead, a couple hundred under some recently aquired air-dried ash I have. A bit more investigation reveals more dead bugs on shelves, under cardboard boxes, all over the shop. Not thousands, but tens. I seem to recall reading about these somewhere, but this is my first experience. I figured I would fire off a plea for advice here before I start cleaning up the shop (it needs it).
My shop is in the basement of my house, under the garage. I live in Utah (hot and dry) if that makes any difference. I have a couple hundred board feet of mahogony, cherry, maple, and walnut next to the ash (which I’m now suspecting is the culprit, I found it to be full of pinholes). I also have several, er, works in progress (years) of cherry and alder which I found bugs under. All my lumber is kiln-dried except for the ash and a few walnut boards, which I have had for 4-5 years.
Is the lumber I have “infected”, and if so, can I still use it? If I complete my unfinished projects and apply laquer will that kill any bugs already inside? Do I need professional help (for the bugs)? Should I get rid of the ash? Any advice is appreciated!
thanks….
Donald
Edited 8/12/2004 10:46 pm ET by donp
Replies
Awhile ago, when researching the whole topic of "wood bugs" in general, I read that they (beetles, not termites) tend to be specific to a given type of wood. Your thread will provide and opportunity to verify that statement. I'll give Jon Arno a heads-up and see if he can give us some info.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Don, I suspect the little critters are powder post beetles. They love ash. And they will sometimes invade the sapwood of other species, even when the heartwood of these other species is relatively resistant to them.
The time to really worry is when you find not only the dead bugs, but also little cone shaped piles of fine dust under your stacks of lumber. That's a sure sign that they are still active.
There are several techniques for sterilizing the wood, but they tend to turn into a big production. you can build a chamber and gas them with carbon dioxide. Museums sometimes use this technique on valuable antiques, because it has virtually no effect on the wood once the treatment is over. Another means of sterilizing wood is to heat it. Temperatures in the range of 150F for a few hours (depending upon the thickness of the stock and it's moisture content) is usually enough to do the trick...but if you overheat the wood in an uncontrolled manner you can leave it with drying stresses. There are also commercially available chemical dips for soaking contaminated wood, but they leave residual compounds in the wood that tend to alter its color somewhat.
As for practical solutions, years ago I had the same problem you describe here. I had bought some air dried ash (at a great price :O)) and it introduced these critters into my inventory...And because, like you, I had some of the more valuable species including walnut and cherry, that I didn't want to part with, I sorted through the ash, throwing out any pieces than showed signs of contamination. Then I took what looked to be good and stored it in a location well away from my more valuable woods (in a garage several miles away).
I then simply continued to use up the other species, while watching the ash for signs of activity (the little dust piles). After several years...and no dust piles...I went ahead and also used up the ash. None of the pieces of furniture I made during that time has shown any signs of infestation.
hello donp,
Sorry about the beetles but they could be common furniture beetle (Anobium punctatum) active in UK april to August (so you will need to make adjustment for your area) The Lyctus (powder post )beetle has a long narrow body and goes for unseasoned timber and usually dies out as the timber is seasoned ,the furniture beetle has a oblong shape . If you want more infomation try THE TECHNIQUE OF FURNITURE MAKING .by Ernest Joyce OLD BUT GOOD.
regards Teabag
Tea Bag, I doubt if they'd be the European furniture beetle showing up in an ordinary shipment of American ash lumber...but it's probably worth trying to make that determination. The Old World furniture beetle is a much bigger problem in that they don't give up once the piece is thoughly dried and finished...and they aren't as selective in their diet.
hello jon.
We sent many things over on the MAYFLOWER not all of them listed in the manifest.
regards Teabag.
>>" We sent many things over on the MAYFLOWER not all of them listed in the manifest."<<
Yes, and to think we're still allies, Tea Bag. :O)
The fact that there are dead beetles lying around is a fair indication that they have mated and laid a fresh lot of eggs -- not necessarily only in the ash.
IanDG
No doubt about it, Ian. The risk of contamination is always there, especially when you lay out a juicy morsel like a pile of ash lumber. Even if there wasn't evidence of the beetles being present already, the risk would still exist. They love ash. It's like taking a megaphone and yelling "FREE BEER!" They'll also attack other species and even the sapwood of species that are otherwise relatively immune, especially if the moisture and temperature conditions are right.
The only reason for hoping they are our own kinder and gentler powder post beetles is that those British buggers just never give up. They'll crawl out of an 18th century Queen Anne, if you don't watch it. :O)
Edited 8/14/2004 5:10 pm ET by Jon Arno
Thanks Jon. I'll take one even if it is only that gnats piss Bud you're buying.
FREE BEER, and mention of Dolly the sheep or others of her ilk gets my attention.
What's this thread about? Slainte.RJFurniture
Thanks to all who have replied. Further investigation over the weekend revealed small dust mounds on the new, and some older ash. I have removed all of the ash from the shop, like John I got it cheap so it isn't a great loss. I'll monitor the remainder of my wood supply for the little dust mounds now that I know what to look for, and take more aggressive action if necessary.
Donald
I agree that they sound like furniture beetles -- the grubs hatch from eggs laid into the pores of the timber and spend the next 7 years or so eating away inside.
They pupate close to the surface -- the adult beetle emerges [your 'pinholes'] and mates, lays eggs and dies -- all within a few days.
The majority of the eggs will be laid in the ash but there will also be some in the other timbers -- at the moment they are vulnerable to surface treatment but once they hatch and the larvae move into the interior of the timber they are extremely difficult to treat.
Personally I'd ditch the ash -- there is the chance that there are still larvae working away inside which have yet to pupate and emerge to lay eggs. The larvae look white, fuzzy and carrot-shaped and different sizes indicate several infestations.
IanDG
You never said you saw small exit holes in your wood or hourglass looking piles of fine sawdust around your lumber. If in doubt, collect a few bugs and take them to your extension folks. Ask them to send the bugs off to their college for indentification.
Good luck,
Dale
Looks like I miss the holes in the ash, my bad. But, I still stand by what I said about the extension folks. You might be lucky and they are ambrosia beetles. Ambrosia beetles generally do not reinfest due to drier wood moisture content of aged lumber.......Dale
Edited 8/15/2004 11:08 am ET by Dale
Donald, I'm trying to remember if you have subteranian termites in Utah which can be controled by treating the soil, or do you have to tent the house and fumigate with methelene bromide?
If it is the later, why don't you contact a exterminator, and ask if you can put a little lumber in the garage of the next house he treats? It won't cost him anything extra, but it will take care of your problems.
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