I was following the ‘Handplanes for a novice’ thread recently and read something I see come up all the time which I’d like someone to put a finer point on (well, lots of someones is okay also).
Lots of folks consistently tout the merits of tuning up old Stanley planes as an option to purchasing new planes. Okay, I’m ready to bite, but now what? Specifically, how do I find planes worth restoring for use (as opposed to collecting)? When I search online for anything resembling a quick buyer’s guide I only seem to find way too much or way too little info. Please help!
I plan to look online out of pure necessity. I haven’t found this mythical flea market with old handplanes galore just praying for a new home. Around here we have ‘antique malls’ filled with mostly what even I can identify as junk. So I guess it’s eBay. I know what sizes I’m interested in, but I don’t know what to look for as far as condition or era of production (I also keep reading not all old Stanleys are created equal). What do I look for in photos and product descriptions? What’s all this business about patent dates and logo variations and the like? Bailey vs. Bedrock? Blah, blah, blah, you get the idea. Are there any sure signs of junk? If noone else is bidding on a given plane, should that tell me something? Or could it just mean everyone else already has one?
Last thing is price. I’m going to limit my search to sizes 4 or 4 1/2, 5 or 5 1/2, 6 and 7. This may be too vague, but for any one of those planes, what might be a good deal? Or is there a rule of thumb for a cutoff point as a percentage of the price of, say, a new Lie-Nielsen? In other words, if I find out I’d have to invest half of what I’d pay for a new plane (nice one) in an old one, then I won’t do it. Just wouldn’t make sense to me, but if that’s the case, I’d still like to know. If not, what do y’all find reasonable? A third? A quarter? What about adding aftermarket irons and chipbreakers? Essential or no? If yes, then obviously it becomes part of the total price.
I really appreciate any help on this topic. I have some klunker planes I’ve survived with so far, but finally got to use some nice ones in a class so I want to upgrade. Thanks!
hypecast
Replies
Hypecast,
For a thorough primer on Stanley planes (much of the information is generally transferable to other manufacturer's planes, as well), try this site:
http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan0a.html
Below, I will post my notes for tuning up hand planes. From that you can deduce what to look for in a "decent" user plane.
_____
John Walters has a little blue paperback book that tells more or less current values for Stanley tools (the latest edition I've seen is 2004). This book is usually available at Woodcraft for about $12.-- or so.
Typical ending auction price ranges of some of the more common planes, on eBay:
#4: $15 - $40
#5: $25 - $60
#7: $40 - $125+
#8: $40 - $125+
#9½: $10 - $30
#60½: $10 - $30
The better shape the plane is in, the more likely that it will be toward the upper end of the range, but it also depends on how many people are interested in that particular plane. Fairly frequently, you can get a really nice plane for a very good, lower-end-of-the-scale price.
_____
The best quality planes are the WW II and earlier. To be able to determine the approximate date of a Stanley plane, try these sites:
https://home.comcast.net/%7Erexmill/planes101/typing/plane_typing.txt
https://home.comcast.net/%7Erexmill/planes101/typing/typing.htm
http://www.hyperkitten.com/tools/stanley_bench_plane/dating/ts_1_frame.html
http://homepage.mac.com/galoot_9/ascii_dating_chart.html
For user planes, the most popular seem to be Type 11 and Sweetheart (Types 12 - 15). WW II era planes are also very popular because of their heavier castings.
Bailey planes were Stanley's regular-grade hand planes. The Bedrocks were Stanley's top of the line planes. The main (but not only) difference is in the frog: the adjustment mechanism and the machining of the frog surfaces themselves are far superior to the Bailey frog, and a lot easier to adjust. There are other differences, as well, but the frog is the prime one.
_____
Whether you add an after-market iron and/or chipbreaker depends on the one you get with the plane. Some may need to be replaced because they are damaged, worn out, or won't hold an edge. Depending on the size of the plane, a replacement iron from Hock or LN could cost from $25 to $50, plus about $35 to $50 for a chipbreaker, again depending on size. It is something to factor into the decision on whether to buy a particular plane, if you know that info. Some people also like to replace the original iron with an after-market iron, simply so that they can preserve the original iron for historical reasons.
_____
There are a number of vintage (mostly Stanley) in my plane arsenal. I also have a number of LN planes. I would suggest that you consider buying an LN so that you have a bench mark from which to judge the performance of the vintage planes you buy. If you don't already know, that will let you know what "right" looks (feels, sounds, etc) like. I suggest this, because, realistically, if you buy vintage planes, you're going to have to tune them up. You need to know (again if you don't already) what it is supposed to look like, how it is supposed to operate, etc., when you finish tuning it. The LN will give you that information.
_____
Here are a couple of other places that you can buy planes from for pretty reasonable prices (although not as inexpensively as you sometimes can on eBay):
http://www.thebestthings.com/
http://jonzimmersantiquetools.com/
(No affiliation with either; just a very satisfied repeat customer of both.)
_____
If you have other questions, by all means, feel free to ask. Welcome to the slippery slope: Enjoy the ride.....
___________________
There are several types of bench planes (I'll use Stanley plane numbers to illustrate):
Smoothing planes (#1, #2, #3, #4, #4½, #5½): These are used for putting the final surface on the board just prior to applying the finish. (There are those that argue that a planed surface is not ready to finish....I disagree with them, and will leave it at that for now.)
Jack planes (#5, #5½): These are used for rough flattening and thicknessing of boards. The can also be used as longer smoothing planes.
Fore/Try/Trying planes (#5½, #6): These are used for flattening (after the jack plane) board faces or edges. A #6 is often also used as a short jointer on shorter boards, and in traveling toolboxes, because of its smaller size and lower weight than a standard jointer (#7 or #8).
Jointer planes (#6, #7, #8): These are used for making the faces and edges of boards flat. A #7 or #8 is particularly useful for flattening edges ("edge jointing") when making (wide) panels such as table tops, etc.
Bench rebate/rabbet planes (#10, #10¼, #10½): These are used to create and clean up rebates. They can also be used for things like trimming tenons.
Block planes (#62, #164): These are a low angle jack plane and a low angle smoother, respectively. They are about the same size as a #5 and a #4, respectively, but are built as block planes -- with the bevel on the iron facing up, and no chip breaker. The adjustment mechanism is also a bit simpler than on standard bench planes.
Block planes (#9½, #60½, etc.): These are sometimes also considered part of the bench plane group, although they are actually a separate category. Regardless, they are used for trimming end grain, cutting chamfers, and general trimming work.
Misc planes -- most of these are special-purpose planes (#40, #40½, etc.): Scrub planes (#40, #40½) are used to remove wood quickly. They have a wide, open mouth and a thick, heavily cambered iron. Often used for initial dimensioning of rough-sawn lumber. There are lots of others.
You'll notice that some sizes (the #5½, for example) have can more than one function.
That more or less covers the Bailey-pattern metal bench planes.
There are also wooden bench planes, which are pretty much the same, functionally, as the above-listed metal planes, except that wooden jointers tend to be longer: up to about 34" or 36" long.
Also available are the transitional planes (#21 - #37, #122 - #129, and #135): These are wooden-bodied planes with metal plane iron adjusting mechanisms; sort of a hybrid between woodies and metal planes. The name is somewhat misleading, in that transitional planes came about after metal planes had been on the market for a number of years.
And, finally, there are the infill planes, which are generally about the same as the metal planes functionally, except that there is a longer and wider smoothing plane called a Panel Plane, used to do final smoothing on long(er) panels. (If you don't know, an infill plane is a [usually dovetailed] metal plane that has been "stuffed" with wood -- often a lovely tropical hard wood -- and is equipped with a thick heavy iron. A couple of the better-known makers were Thomas Norris & Sons, Stewart Spiers, and Mathieson and Son. A couple of current infill makers are Karl Holtey, Konrad Sauer, Wayne Anderson, and Ray Iles.) One thing that stands out about infill planes -- aside from their classic looks and great utility -- is that they have various iron bedding angles: 45°, 47½°, 50°, 55°. The higher-angled planes are specifically designed to be used on gnarly-grained tropical hardwoods. As a category, infill planes tend to be rather expensive.
There are, of course, also other types of planes -- block planes, joinery planes, etc.
____________
Now, what to do with your new bench plane....
Here's what I do when I teach plane tune-up classes (some of this will be the same info as others have already posted) (This assumes that your plane is complete, generally undamaged, and not too rusty or grimy.):
1) Disassemble and inspect the plane. Take everything apart: knob, tote, lever cap, iron, chip breaker, frog, iron adjustment wheel, all screws. Inspect for rust, grime, missing parts, damage to parts, etc.
2) Clean everything. Mineral spirits and steel wool/scotchbrite-type pads work well for most cleaning. If the rust is really bad, you can use electrolysis. A brass/bronze toothbrush-sized brush is also handy for getting in to corners and such. I generally don't use a wire wheel because it can damage parts, but that's up to you whether to use one or not.
3) Re-inspect and note any damage, etc., that might have been hidden by rust or grime.
4) Determine whether the frog bosses on the casting are flat and parallel: set the frog on the bosses and try to rock the frog. If it rocks -- doesn't sit flat and square on the bosses -- then either the frog boss(es) on the casting or the bottom of the frog are not flat/parallel. Or both may need work. Use a fine file to make the bosses on the casting flat and parallel, as necessary. Use a light touch here, and try to remove as little metal as is absolutely necessary.
5) Flatten the bottom of the frog, as necessary (see #4, above). Also, use a straight edge to determine whether the iron bedding surface of the frog is flat and parallel. If not, use a file to flatten/make parallel, as necessary. You want the iron to mate tightly and as completely as possible with this surface -- it helps make the iron rigid, reducing chatter. Again, a light touch with the file is best.
6) Inspect the mouth. The forward edge should be flat and square to the sole. If not square it and/or flatten it, as required. This is one place where you really, really want to remove as little metal as is absolutely necessary. The tighter the mouth can be made, the better results -- i.e., less tear-out -- (all other things being equal) you will get when use it as a smoothing plane.
7) Inspect the mating surface of the lever cap. File it square and flat, as necessary. Remove the file marks on a medium and then fine smoothing stone. Lubricate the lever mechanism on the upper end.
8) Inspect the mating surface of the chip breaker. File it square and flat, as necessary. Remove the file marks on a medium and then fine smoothing stone. Polish the upper portion of the leading edge with 400/600 (and higher grits, if you desire) sand paper. The mating surface should completely mate with the iron -- with no gaps. This will help prevent shavings from sticking between the chip breaker and the iron, and jamming your plane. It also makes the iron more rigid and helps prevent chatter. The polished upper leading edge helps move the shavings up and away from the mouth.
9) Inspect the iron. Grind as necessary. The leading edge needs to be square to the sides. Polish the reverse (non-bevel side) of the iron (about 1" to 1½" back from the cutting edge) to a mirror polish. You should be able to see fine details in the reflection. (You normally have to do this only once; subsequent sharpenings/honings will keep it that way.) Then hone the bevel side of the iron progressively up through your finest sharpening stone, also to a mirror polish. Add a micro-bevel, if desired.
10) Put a very light coat of oil on all screws and pivot points. Clean and polish the brass iron adjustment wheel, as needed/desired.
11) Make any necessary repairs to the knob and/or tote. Sand off any old nasty finish and refinish the knob and tote with oil, shellac, etc., as needed/desired. I strongly recommend against polyurethane; it looks horrible on wooden plane parts.
12) Reassemble the plane. Withdraw the iron above the level of the sole. You want the plane fully assembled to introduce whatever stresses will be present when planing into the lapping process, so that the sole is flat when the plane is set-up for use. Lap the sides if desired (not really needed for a smoothing plane, unless you're going to use it on a shooting board. If so, then make sure that you lap the sides at exactly a 90° angle to the sole.) Now comes the fun part: lap the sole. Use a known flat surface (float/plate glass, surface plate, etc. Some recommend using the wing of a table saw or one of the tables on a jointer; personally, I cringe at the thought of deliberately introducing grit into fine machinery....) Start with 80 grit and progressively work your way up to 220 grit; don't skip a grit. You can go higher, but once you pass 220, you're just polishing the surface. Water or a light machine oil on the sand paper makes a good lubricant to float the swarf away. How flat is flat? Well, for smoothing planes, the general rule of thumb is "flatter is better." At the least, you want the first 1" or so of the toe, the ½" to 1" in front of the mouth, the ½" to 1" behind the mouth, and the last 1" or so of the heel to be co-planar. Using a permanent marker to mark wavy lines on the sole will help you see your progress. Continue lapping until you have reached the desired level of flatness. This is quite boring, but you need to maintain your attention to the task at hand to do a good job. It may take only a couple of minutes or it may take a couple of hours, depending on what shape the sole of your plane is in and how flat you want it. Use an accurate straight edge to check flatness from toe to heel and from side to side, especially in front of the mouth. Once you have finished lapping the sole, disassemble and clean as necessary. If you used water as the lubricant, make sure that you get all of the water off your plane, to prevent new rust!!
13) Reassemble the plane, and adjust the iron for a light cut. Test your newly-tuned plane on a nice piece of hard wood. You should be able to take nice, full-width, translucent shavings. Enjoy!
There are many different possible sequences to do this; the one listed above is merely the one that I use.
_____
You can expect a well-tuned smoothing plane to put a surface on a piece of wood that is ready to apply finish to. When you look at the surface against a light at a low angle, the surface of the wood should reflect the light like glass, and it should feel almost glass-smooth.
Have fun, and good luck!
.
Tschüß!
James
"I'm sorry, Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that...."
-- A.C. Clarke
Hype,
Was just in your fair city a week ago. Was born in Searcy. Sister and b-i-l in Little Rock.
pzgren has given you an excellent overview. I would agree with his prices. Planes on the high end of his prices should be in excellent condition.
If you buy off of ebay, always ask if there are any "chips, cracks, breaks, or repairs" to the metal or the wood. Except for the shipping, ebay prices are going to be generally lower than your local prices.
I have been in most of the "antique" stores/malls in the L.R./N.L.R./Conway/Searcy/Beebe area. And you are right. Not many tools like you are looking for there. And the ones I found were generally priced much too high. They aren't selling to users. They are hoping for the decorator to buy. One of the advantages of living in Pennsylvania is there are tons of tools in flea markets and auctions. I could go to 10 auctions a day 7 days a week up here.
There is another Knothead (don't recall his "handle" here on Knots) who is from L.R. As I recall his personal info says he is a professional woodworker. Might be a good idea to find him and see if he has ideas.
And, if you aren't familiar with Larry Williams up in Eureka Springs http://www.planemaker.com/ you need to get to know him. His planes are new and made of wood, but you would be working with some of the best planes made. He is worth a trip up to E.S. whether you use his type of planes are not.
Enjoy,
Alan - planesaw
HC-
It's real easy to get information overload about planes...
So look for a No. 5 to start with, they're plentiful and not too expensive. Make sure it is complete, that is, it has all its parts. Make sure there are no cracks in the castings, make sure that the tote is not too broken up, a tight, repaired crack is okay.
Look at the type studies that others have linked you to. Try for one made before WWII if possible.
If it is in good shape (i.e. complete and not too rusty) buy it for $50.00 or less if you can. If it is rusty, but not pitted, try to get it for $30.00 or less.
In either case, you'll need to read up on fettling and setting it up.
If the castings are good, most any plane can be restored, irons can be replaced as well as wooden parts, but you can spend quite a bit of money. It's probably better to spend a bit more on the plane and get something that doesnt need anything but some TLC and time.
David C.
A good rule of thumb when it comes to buying old Stanley bench planes. If there are patent dates (one, two or three) behind the frog then it's a good user plane. If the tote is broken, it's better because it will scare away collectors and it's easy to fix. You can pick up 4's and 5's for around $20.00 plus shipping. 7's will fetch $40-50.
mike
mvflaim,
I just got a Millers Falls No. 9 (same size as Stanley No. 4 I believe) on ebay with a broken tote for $12. It's in great shape otherwise and is the kind with the three point lever cap. What is your method for fixing the broken tote?
Stanley wasn't the only good plane maker back in the day. There are some other nice ones out there everybody.
Rob
Rob,
If the tote is cracked in half in the middle, clean up the crack a little and reglue it using Titebond wood glue or Gorilla glue, whichever you prefer. I always use a Bessey parallel clamp to clamp the tote together as it dries. It hits the tote at just the right spots to keep it stable as it dries. If you try to use any other clamp like a Jorgensen bar clamp you'll never be able to keep the two pieces of the tote together as the clamp will have a tendency to slip off. Trust me I know.
Once the tote has dried, you can fill any gaps that may still exist with wood putty if you like. Since I work with rosewood totes much of the time, I wipe a permanent marker on the wood putty once it dries so that it blends better with the dark wood of the rosewood.
If the tip of the tote is gone, sand the remaining of the top clean by taking it to the stationary disc sander. If you can, try to keep a little bit of the hole for the brass screw remaining. It will help you establish a new hole later. Cut a piece of rosewood 3/4"W x 1/2"T x 1 1/2"L and glue it on top of the fresh cleaned tote. Let it dry overnight.
Once the tote has dried, outline the shape of the tote on the piece of new rosewood either by eye or by using another tote as a template. Cut it out on the bandsaw and shape it with rasps and files. If the new piece of rosewood covers up the original hole for the brass nut, chuck a 5/16" drill bit in your drill press and turn the tote over and drill from the bottom of the tote through the top to create a new hole for the brass nut and screw rod.
Take the tote over to your bench and with files and very small chisels, try to find the original brass nut hole by poking and filing around the 5/16" hole that you just drilled on the drill press. Don't assume that the original brass nut hole is perfectly centered around the 5/16" hole and drill a 3/8" hole on top of it using the 5/16" hole as a pilot. You'll be wrong. Keep filing around the 5/16" hole until it opens up and test fit the brass nut by trying to stick it in the hole until it fits.
Once everything is done, you can wipe danish oil or shellac on the tote and put it back on your plane. Since you have a Millers Falls plane, I'm not sure if your tote is rosewood or painted beech but hopefully you get the idea.
mike
Edited 4/25/2007 2:51 pm ET by mvflaim
Hey Rob,I have a #9 that my grandfather gave to me many years ago. How do you like yours? After I got the blade honed real sharp it works GREAT!Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Bob,
I haven't had a chance to get out in the shop as often as I'd like lately (too much overtime and yard work), so I haven't done much to it except admire it since I got it. :^) I'll get to it soon hopefully.
Rob
hypecast, just a note to comment on the following quote from the original post:
'I haven't found this mythical flea market with old handplanes galore just praying for a new home. Around here we have 'antique malls' filled with mostly what even I can identify as junk.'
I see from your profile that you are in Little Rock. You might try coming down to Texas for a weekend and shop for used hand planes during Canton First Monday Trade Days. Canton is about an hours drive east of Dallas.
http://www.firstmondaycanton.com/
Pay attention to the dates if you intend to visit. The trade grounds are only open 1 weekend a month. Do not wait til August.
I will not guarantee that you will find an ideal plane for a steal but you will find a wide variety and frequent bargains. There are some dogs as well. If nothing else you will get an education on hand plane condition and prices.
Beware of the so called tool experts. Some believe that if it is rusty and broken with missing parts it is an antique worth 10X true value.
Steve Pippins
I bought about 11 planes on eBay in the summere of 2005. Prices were somewhat higher then. And the eBay sellers didn't describe the products well, so I ended up with some stuff that needed a lot of tuning. The lack of experience of some sellers can dump some surprises in your lap.For the life of me, I could not get the soles flat using sandpiper. My neighbor is a machinist and he came to the rescue with his shop surface grinder. Then on a move from LA to Northern California, I stopped by the forge of Ron Hock in Fort Bragg and bought new irons for all these planes. He sells blemished blade to walk-in traffic only. Hock blades are the best.In major cities old tool lovers, referred to as Old Galoots, have tool swap meets. Make enquiries at a local lumber store. Some truly gifted galoots offer beatifully restored planes and such at about 40% of the high eBay prices commonly found. I got a Stanley 4 1/2 smoother plane for $17. On eBay prices were currently in the $150 range. At a quarterly meet in Culver City.Good luck. And be patient. There are a lot of planes out there.Gary Curtis trinity county calif.
I know Canton well -- have been there manyl times., but not recently. Everything you say is true, but I would add some extra emphasis to your warnings. There are some real, shure-enough small-time sharpies there. Some will lie; others are merely ignorant, but you really can't rely on what most vendors say.
That said, I have had a lot of fun and mostly good luck there. The bset bargons tend to be found in the areas that cater to drive-in dealers rather than the established crowd who more or less operate store fronts. The drive-in crowd whether mom and pop cleaning out the basement, or gypsy junk dealers just spread out on tables behind their cars or RVs.
It takes more than one day to really cover the grounds, so if you don't plan to stay, you need to be relentlessly focused.
Avoid hot months.
Joe
Joe, sounds like you know Canton well. You would not believe how it has grown in the past 5 years.
Maybe hypecast will heed our warnings when and if he comes to visit.
Steve
Thanks for all the replies. I've learned a lot already.And you guys from Dallas... I've been there in August... it's not so hot :-)
hypecast, the weather may not be a factor for you but the August heat drives away the vendors. The selection is poor during the late summer months.
A little over a year ago I went to a MWTCA meeting to search for old tools. I got just about everything I wanted and more. I guess that's what happens when your a woodworking kid amongst mostly retired adults (no offense to anyone)! But in any case here's my list of planes and their prices:
Standard angle block plane Free (I have a 40° bevel ground on the blade to make it a small high angle smoother. It works great!)
Stanley No. 4, from ~1895 Free
Stanley No. 4 ½ $25
Stanley No. 5, Sweetheart $20
In addition I found some old irons to make wooden planes from. I've used only one out of three of those blades. All of those planes have their original blade, and work extremely well. They can handle bird's-eye maple without a problem. I mostly make boxes, so I didn't need any larger planes, but next MWTCA meet I will probably look for a 5½ and some joinery planes.
Hypecast, I've recently have found E-bay to be a good source of vintage planes, search under vintage tools.
Starting about six years ago, I have restored around fifty planes for self and friends. Most were old Stanley planes bought on eBay. In addition to what everyone else has said, look carefully at the pictures. You want to see several shots, the mouth, frog, lever cap, etc. Look for chips, cracks, pitting, and extreme rust on the metal parts. Compare the pictures on several different planes until you get a feel for how wide the mouth is. In general, I have found the tighter the mouth, the better the older Stanley planes are regardless of when made (1940s vintage or older). Bought what I thought was a dog late 1940s No 5 just to see if I could restore a really rough looking plane. It was rusted, needed a new tote and knob, was covered in crude and only cost $19 including shipping. Cleaned, tuned, and sporting new wood it is the best performing bench plane I have (own 3 LN). I'm not going to tell you every plane I have restored is as good as a LN, but I would say about a third of them measure up nicely.
Look up David Charlesworth's article in Fine Woodworking on tuning bench planes, do everything he says, and you'll be surprised at the results. The more planes you fettle, the better you'll get at it. I went back and reworked a couple of earlier attempts that yielded disappointing results and was relieved to discover I hadn't ruined them. Both planes work extremely well now. Good luck.
As another alternative for you I placed a classified ad in the local newspaper in the Wanted section entitled: Old woodworking tools, hand planes, spokeshaves, chisels, etc.
I got many calls and I got a several good users for free. Granted some were in desparate need of repair/fettling. I now have a pretty good collection of old Stanley/Baileys, for free. #2, 4, 2 #5s, and 2#7's. Also got a Type 3 for free!
Haven't had much luck finding Bedrocks, but am still searching.
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 4/25/2007 9:10 pm ET by KiddervilleAcres
Bob,
Do you mean to tell me you got that type 3 plane you posted about a few weeks ago for FREE just by posting a wanted ad in the paper?!? HOLY COW!!!!!!!!!
You must be the Pied Piper of antique tools... : )
I sheepishly plead guilty.
When I found out what I really had I went back to the elder gentleman that I got it from and told him all about it. He insisted that I keep it as he told me that it didn't matter to him as long as it went to someone who would value it.
It is in my will to go back to him should anything happen to me. Oh yes, and he also gave me a Carriage Makers plane, a #98 & #99 and a #48! He also told me that he has a really small smoother, but can't remember where he stashed it, and it's still in the original box!
A #1????????
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
My God! You met an actual antique tool fairy. Congrats!
I'm still not sure what it's actually worth. I asked Patrick @ SuperTools and havent heard back yet.
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
well it it helps, a Stanley no 3 Type 2 just sold on eBay yesterday for $637.98 and yours is considered rarer.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=010&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=200101430630&rd=1&rd=1
BTW, if the old man actually does have a boxed Stanley No 1 like you said he may, one of those went for $5000.00 a few weeks ago. May be worth digging around his place to find it.
mike
Edited 4/26/2007 3:14 pm ET by mvflaim
mike,
Holy Smoly!
If that's the case I would certainly have more that a sheepish confession to make. As for the Type 3, I told him that I heard it could be worth as much as $800 so your input is close.
I will certainley advise him as to the potential and I thank you for the info. I should think that this will provide impetous for him to find the plane, whatever it is.
That would provide a nice nest egg for him, as he is not well off. He was a good friend of my Grandfather and I would very much like to help him. He's not rich by any means, but he may be richer than he realizes!
This man has a 40' horse trailer full of old tools that we are going to investigate when the weather gets warm. That is finally just around the corner, this weekend we are hoping. The tools date back to the early 1900's. I also have a 12 piece set of Buck Brothers chisels that are in mint condition that he has given me. They were rusty when I got them but we have restored them.
This is so much fun! This man is a daily visitor to my woodshop and is helping me work with wood. He doesn't like my modern tools, but we are making progress. You should see him working on the lathe!
I am indeed fortunate and will post our findings. All this from a simple ad in the local weekly newpaper! I'm salivating!
Best Regards,
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 4/26/2007 9:11 pm ET by KiddervilleAcres
Have fun treasure hunting! Even if the boxed plane is a No 2 it would still be worth about $500-700. Let me know what you guys find in the trailer and I'll help appraise them as best as I can.
What an opportunity. User/collectors (like us?) value tools because of what they are but also because of the connection to the craftsmen of the past. How fortunate you are to acquire them, but far more important is getting to know the man the owned and used them. Learn everything you can from him and when you get old do what he is doing and pass everything on to someone that understands.
My sentiments exactly!
Now the question becomes, how old is old? I'm quickly approaching a young 61. I guess you might say that I'd better get started. Well, I have in fact. I've yet to find a youngster in my world who is interested in what I consider the Finer parts of woodworking. They all seem to want to bash wood with the latest power tools.
Not that I'm against that as I feel that they both, when used properly can compliment each other. My preference is to use power tools to get it close, then polish the project off with hand tools. In recent years I have developed a liking to restoring old hand tools as mostly users; and USING THEM.
Every once in a while I stumble on a keeper/collector and not just planes either. I'm not sure if you caught an earlier post regarding the Type 3, but I don't plan to use it. The frog is too delicate to take a chance on ruining it. I have willed it back to the original owner.
I guess I am a collector, meaning primarily user type tools. Recently I found a turning chisel that is stamped Warranted Cast Steel, Humphreys Mfg. Co. and a measuring square stamped R. W Bangs that also says Warranted Cast Steel. One side of the square has some strange markings on it that I haven't seen before. Also there are what appear to peen marks in several places indicatibg that it was squared by someone.
Wouldn't it be great to be able to talk with the folks who actually owned/used these magnificent tools!
A new adventure is in the making! Thanks for your post.
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 5/1/2007 8:53 pm ET by KiddervilleAcres
"I've yet to find a youngster in my world who is interested in what I consider the Finer parts of woodworking. They all seem to want to bash wood with the latest power tools."
Hey now! lol. Watch it! I'm 16 and looooove hand tools. Seriously, if you don't believe me look me up. I'm "Ryan Cathey" at Sawmill Creek's "Neanderthal Haven" and "RyanC" at Woodnet's Hand tool forum. Anyways, I didn't mean this post as a yelling rant but just to show that there is at least one youngster who understands the finer points.
-Ryan C.
Ryan,
I'll back you up on that one. I'm 33 now but I've been collecting and using antique tools since I was 14. I still remember to this day when I went to an antique show and bought an adjustable boring machine for $60.00, the old guys who sold it to me started laughing as I walked away and I overheard one of them say "what's that kid want with that thing?"
mike
Ryan,Nothing intended. It's just that where I live all the young folks want to do is party and have fun, all the time. Even the local schools have dropped their woodworking programs. There's very little emphasis on teaching/learning the ways of our forefathers and I for one think that's a shame.Also, skilled woodworkers can earn a very respectable income these days if money is the incentive. I applaud your position and wish you continued success in the future.To ThePosterFormerlyKnownAs: Hope you have a nice day! Along with your planes you might consider sharpenning your social skills.Regards,Bob @ Kidderville AcresA Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!Edited 5/2/2007 11:39 am ET by KiddervilleAcresEdited 5/2/2007 11:41 am ET by KiddervilleAcres
Edited 5/2/2007 11:48 am ET by KiddervilleAcres
Bob,
A Stanley 3 type 3 just sold on eBay for $332.00. It had a cracked tote just like yours but this one also had a chip at the back of the bed and it still got $332.00. Yours should be worth more. Condition is everything. Fix your tote!
mike
hypecast,
Let me add this to the excellent suggestions you have already received: I go to garage sales (aka rummage sales) that list "tools" in their ads and have found many Stanley bench planes as well as other treasures. It's more effort than eBay, but you can handle and inspect the tools. And, the prices are usually amazingly low. Sometimes the "tools" are just a few rusty wrenches. Sometimes, a workshop full of good items. I go to one or two garage sales a week during the warm months. If you have the time, its another potential source. Good luck!
BrazenBit
Forget all the sentimental bull$hit being bandied about. Find a good user and put it to work. I don't know whose dead Grandpa used the old planes I've acquired and don't give a hoot in hell. They work. The irons are sharp and the soles flat enough.
If you've got the bucks, just get a Lie Nielsen. This is a no excuses plane. It won't need any tuning. The iron might need five minutes worth of honing. You'll be able to work wood immediately.
A little education goes a long way. Garrett Hack's book on handplanes is a good investment. Astralgal press for books on tool values. There is a website. There's other places than ebay to look. In the back of FWW there are some antique tool dealers listed, Bob Kaune and MJD. Both are very fair and reliable sources for tools. There's more out there if you do the research.
As mentioned before Patrick Leaches Blood and Gore site is a good Stanley plane guide for info.
Edited 5/7/2007 10:26 am ET by RickL
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