Replies

1. 
   joinerswork | Apr 25, 2005 08:33pm | #1

   Carrie,

   Look for a product called "Quala-renu" by Behlen's.  Sometimes it'll do wonders.

   Regards,

   Ray

2. 
   jackplane | Apr 25, 2005 09:21pm | #2

   When a finish has alligatored or checked, it is beyond its useful service life. Not sure of the product Ray described, but I'd trust his opinion.

     I'd strip it and refinish it. Sometimes there are no shortcuts, but the payoff is immense.

    

3. 
   forestgirl | Apr 26, 2005 08:38am | #3

   Even with an alligatored finish, you can often dissolve and "re-amalgamate" the finish. 

   Chances are it's a lacquer finish, but you need to check.  Take a swap dipped in denatured alcohol and rub a spot.  If the swab gets gunky, the finish is shellac.  If there is no effect, try the same thing with lacquer thinner.  If, for some bizarre reason, it's varnish, only methylene chloride would dissolve it.

   The recipes for "finish reviver" for crazed finishes are:

   • For shellac:  2 parts turpentine, 2 parts boiled linseed oil and 4 parts denatured alcohol.  Apply with a cloth or 4-ought steel wool to dissolve and redistribute the finish.  Buff dry with a clean cloth
   • For lacquer:  2 parts turpentine, 2 parts BLO and 4 parts lacquer thinner.  Same instructions

   I strongly suggest practicing on a small place, leaf, or whatever.  It took me awhile to get a routine down to make this work.  Read the instructions on the back of the commercial antique refinishers to get some ideas.

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
   Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

1. 
   joinerswork | Apr 26, 2005 02:30pm | #4

   FG,

   I personally would be very leery of amalgamating linseed oil into either a shellac or lacquer finish, for fear that it would go soft and gooey.

   The product I've had best success with, Qualarenu, is some blend of exotic solvents.  I don't think it has any oils or resins in it. Sometimes it helps a degraded finish, sometimes not.

   Carefully sanding even a badly alligatored finish with 400 or 600 grit wet-or-dry paper will level it to the point where it can be rubbed out and look acceptable. It is a painstaking process, to avoid cutting through the finish, esp at corners, on moldings etc.  It is so labor intensive that it isn't really worthwhile, except in the case of a period piece which has an old, possibly original surface.  Such a finish is likely so degraded that, while it may be made to look ok, it probably would not hold up in everyday usage.

   Regards,

   Ray

1. 
   forestgirl | Apr 26, 2005 07:12pm | #5

   Understood, Ray.  Another option, the one I've used the most often, is simply mixing 1:1 lacquer thinner and denatured alcohol.  It's basically what the commercial refinishers have in them. 

   One thing I fogot to mention above is to clean the table well before starting out.  Important to get any wax and dirt off.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

1. 
   joinerswork | Apr 27, 2005 12:31am | #7

   FG,

   Double ditto for the cleaning tip, you  wouldn't want to incorporate grunge, old polish etc into the new almagamated surface.

   Speaking of tips, a q-tip is a good way to start out, and in a place where it won't show, as I've had the finish sort of fizz up, instead of turning to liquid.  Hard to get THAT to lay back down and behave!

   Cheers,

   Ray

1. 
   forestgirl | Apr 27, 2005 01:28am | #9

   Fizz up?  Fizz up???  Yikes, toxic finish.  Weird.  Glad I haven't had that happen!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

2. 
   joinerswork | Apr 27, 2005 03:52pm | #11

   FG,

   I've only had that experience with really old, crazed shellac, the kind that's on valuable period pieces that you really want to preserve.  Even infilling missing areas of finish with fresh shellac will sometimes cause that old stuff to bubble up around the edges, instead of blending in, as you'd expect.  Grr.

   Regards,

   Ray

3. 
   forestgirl | Apr 27, 2005 08:55pm | #12

   I have to admit, I got to where I passed up the badly-crazed stuff (used to buy and sell vintage and antique furniture) because unless it was a valuable period piece, it wasn't worth the time I had to put into it.  I have great respect for those who can restore the truly wonderful pieces without degrading them. forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

4. 
   CUEMASTER | Apr 26, 2005 07:23pm | #6

   Carrie:

   Mohawk finishing supplies sell amalgamater ready to use. I've used it a number of times on old pool tables and pianos.Follow instyructions but try it on an incospicuous spot first.

   Good Luck

   Art

5. 
   Carrie | Apr 27, 2005 12:43am | #8

   Thanks for all of the info, I welcome any more so that I can procrastinate and get back out to my garden!  Really one of you knotty folks need to come hold my hand and get me over the fear of doing something wrong to the set.  I have a friend who will help me.  I will definitely clean the chairs well before I start on them and we will start on an inconspicuous spot. 

   Puttering & plant collecting in Suburban clay Z5.
1. 
   nikkiwood | Apr 27, 2005 04:53am | #10

   FG is exactly right about shellac/alcohol and lacquer/lacquer thinner. I have done a lot of refinishing, and for some reason no two pieces are exactly the same -- with regard to what concoction will remove (or reconsitute) the finish. So experimenting with different chemicals is the way to go. Here are a few other ideas/techniques to play with:1) Sometimes, but not always, a proprietary "furniture refinisher" will work. I have had the best luck with Gillespies. 2) Not all lacquer thinner is created equal. If lacquer thinner is softening the finish, but not much more, you can get a "hotter" (more expensive) lacquer thinner from an outfit that sells spray products (like Sherwin Williams).3) I often introduce acetone to whatever brew I am using, to see what happens. 4) I will also add liquid stripper, if not much is happening with the chemicals above. By then, it is probable that your finish is varnish based, and you're going to have to strip it in any event. I find the liquid is easier and faster than the semi-paste stuff -- and is much less messy.Good luck. "I would never die for my beliefs because I might be wrong."
   -- Bertrand Russell