Replies

1. 
   Dave45 | Mar 23, 2004 01:51am | #1

   DROP THE SAW!! - lol

   I'm guessing that your top twisted and is pulling one leg up a little.

   Put the table on a workbench or other flat surface so one leg is over the edge and see if that leg is above (or below) the surface.  Rotate the table and check each of the other legs.  Decide which leg needs to be shortened (or lengthened) so the table doesn't wobble. 

   I usually put those nail-on plastic pads on my table legs and I've fixed this in the past by adding some small washers under the pad on the short leg.

1. 
   billballeza | Mar 23, 2004 04:47am | #5

   The nail on plastic pads (augmented) by washer shims where needed.. sounds like an ideal solution.

   Absent any other suggested solution I can accomplish with confidence.. this is the way I will go.

   Thanks, Dave.

   Bill

2. 
   DavisHolt | Mar 23, 2004 01:54am | #2

   If it is wobbly-- and the wobble is obviously "glued in"--you have to find a flat surface and mark one of the longer legs.  The amount will be the distance one of the short legs stands off the floor.  Trim that off with precision and your wobble will go away.  Nobody will be able to detect the table is off by that small amount.

   If you really want to be finicky about it, shorten both of the longer legs half as much as that distance shown above.

   Dave

1. 
   billballeza | Mar 23, 2004 04:42am | #4

   Dave.. I thought about trimming one or both "long" legs to match the shorter ones.. but can't think of how to accomplish this now that the table is fully assembled and finished with Maloof's oil and poly mixture.

   I don't know which tool to use nor how to position the table for the cut. Can you elaborate?

   Thanks,

   Bill

1. 
   Dave45 | Mar 23, 2004 03:13pm | #9

   The solution I suggested should be directed at finding a short leg that can be extended to get rid of the wobble.  That way, you aren't making cuts that you can't take back.

   I use my workbench for this kind of thing.  It soesn't have to be level, but it must be flat.  From the original description, I would bet that one of the legs will be ~1/8" above the surface and can be built up in a way that will be virtually invisible so the table doesn't wobble. 

   Someone mentioned the possibility that the floor may not be flat and that's also possible.  Check this by moving the table to another location.

   Whatever you do, leave the saw in the toolbox until you know for certain that cutting a leg (or legs) is the only answer.

3. 
   jako17 | Mar 23, 2004 02:14am | #3

   Sounds like a receipt for a walnut coffee table if you arn't careful!  <g>

1. 
   billballeza | Mar 23, 2004 04:49am | #6

   This exact thought has crossed my mind, jako.

   And I shudder at the prospect!

1. 
   jako17 | Mar 23, 2004 05:28am | #7

   On a serious note (this may be a repeat of a previous post,in which case I appologise) The method I have used is:Level your work bench or assembly table with a level 2) place table on bench and level top using shims under legs leaving long leg without shim 3) take a carpenters pencil laying flat on the bench and scribe round all legs.If the pencil does not reach above the highest shim to mark the leg put plywood under the pencil till it does.Scribe round each leg and cut to that line.I use a Jap saw.You will take the most off the longest leg and less off each shorter one with almost none off the shortest.This will ensure that the leg end cut is parallell to the  floor as well as not rocking.

   I keep cutting and it is still too short!!!

4. 
   4DThinker | Mar 23, 2004 06:42am | #8

   Uhm...   Have you checked the floor for flatness? 

   4DThinker  ;-)

1. 
   billballeza | Mar 23, 2004 10:45pm | #12

   I get the same wobble on my table saw.. the hardwood kitchen floor.. and the one flat and level section of my shop (garage) floor.

   I found some adjustable leg sliders that should solve my dilemma. Thanks for the fourth dimension thinking. I'm still thinking in the first dimension.

   Bill

5. 
   joinerswork | Mar 23, 2004 03:51pm | #10

   Bill,

   No-one has yet suggested the use of winding sticks.  Turn your table upside down on a pad or blanket.  Make or find a pair of straight edges ( sticks about 2" wide, parallel edges), you may be able to use a pair of carpenter's squares if you have them.  Lay them across each pair of upside down feet.  Step back as far as you can, and sight across the sticks.  Might help to close one eye.  Attempt to line the edges up with one another.  If the table is in a twist the sticks will not be parallel, and you'll be able to see which legs are "high".

   If you are not too far off, stacking washers under nail-on glides will be the easiest solution.  Otherwise, you can saw the "high" legs off by standing the table on your bench or worktable. Put a thin, sacrificial piece of plywood or formica under one pair of feet at a time, and lay a fine toothed panel saw on the plywood.  If you're careful, you can kerf around all 4 sides of the leg, then saw the end of the leg off.  You may have to do this several times to get the job done, but it  is an incremental process, so you're not likely to end up with a coffee table in the end.  My 12 point handsaw takes off about a sixteenth and a half kerf.

   With a chisel, pare a small bevel on all 4 sides of the leg(s) you trimmed, and touch up the finish.

   Regards,

   Ray

1. 
   billballeza | Mar 23, 2004 10:40pm | #11

   Ray.. and everyone who has weighed in here. Thank you very much. I've learned a great deal and am certain I will be able to use this information in the future as I continue to make tables and, soon, chairs.

   I was at Lowes today and found some levelling leg gliders that allow you to drill 3/8" holes in each leg.. insert a plastic sleeve.. and then screw the glides in and then adjust them to level. This seems to be the most efficient way to correct my mistake.. particularly at my skill level.

   Thanks again.. I really benefit immensely from your generosity.

   Bill

6. 
   ChasStanford | Mar 23, 2004 10:52pm | #13

   If you start sawing legs all you are doing is making it sit level on the area of floor that it is currently situated (see 4D Thinkers post).  A much more elegant and flexible solution is to determine the short leg(s) using a referance flat surface as the other posts have mentioned, then drill a hole in the bottom of that leg and insert a dowel of the same diameter, wrap it with a little Kraft paper if it's too loose; do not glue it in.  Trim the dowel until the desk sits level.  Stain the dowel.

   In this situation, I would not trim the legs of the table.

   Next time, be careful not to glue up twist into the table or tighten the screws too tightly when you attach the top.

   I'll try to post a pic in another post.

   
   

   ---

   Edited 3/23/2004 4:02 pm ET by CHASSTANFORD

1. 
   billballeza | Mar 24, 2004 01:07am | #14

   Thank you very much. The dowel solution is one of those, "gee, why didn't I think of that."

   Of more interest to me, however, is your diagnosis about "gluing in twist in the table" and/or screwing in the top to tightly.

   I'd been wondering what caused the uneven legs. Here's the thing.. I used pockethole joinery for the entire table.. legs to aprons, top to aprons. I didn't use any glue whatsoever. Can you please critique this methodology for me?

   Thanks in advance,

   Bill

1. 
   ChasStanford | Mar 24, 2004 03:06am | #15

   I have to confess that it's my view that pocket hole joinery and the concept of fine furniture are mutually exclusive.  That said, you can really cinch down a pan head screw when using pocket joinery.  They're strong.  I think it is highly likely you have pulled twist into the desk.  And if you've joined the top of the desk to the base with pocket screws it is destined to split as they allow no room for expansion and contraction.  You can somewhat alleviate this by elongating the screw hole and using the smallest shank screw that will do the job. 

   With due respect, you really should read a good, basic book about furniture construction.  Taunton has some good ones.

   Another sure fire way to attach a top to the apron assembly and allow for movement is with cabinet maker's buttons.  Do a search.  A picture is worth a thousand words. 

   Edited 3/23/2004 8:11 pm ET by CHASSTANFORD

1. 
   billballeza | Mar 24, 2004 05:00am | #16

   I agree with all you say and I have to admit that I chose this joinery method because (a) I was impatient to MAKE something.. and (b) pocket hole joinery is easy and it's something I can do.. whereas (c) I have yet to even attempt mortise and tenon joinery.

   I do have books and tapes from Taunton Press which I am learning from and my next project will be done the right way.. not the most expedient way.

   I read that walnut is much more stable and forgiving than other woods and I'm hoping the top won't split.. but if it does.. I have it coming and will learn a valuable lesson from the experience.

   Thanks again.

   Bill

1. 
   trialnut | Mar 24, 2004 03:28pm | #17

   Bill

   I have found that twist is usually a product of how square the various pieces are cut rather than how they are glued, screwed or clamped. With a table if just one end of one apron is 1/2° out of square, the frame will have twist in it when assembled. Take four pieces of wood about 3" wide by 8" long and cut both ends square while keeping the length as close as you can to the same. Now on a flat surface assemble them in various squares without glue to see how tight the joints are. Keep practicing this untill you can assemble them any way you want, fliped over, end for end or whatever without seeing any gaps anywhere. Once you have mastered these skills (square cutting and accurate length) you should not be plagued with twist in your glueups ever again. The only way I see that twist could be introduced with a screwed together assembly is if the screws are tightened so much as to cause crushing of the parts, I think the screws would strip first, or if when driving the screws they displace wood into the joint pushing the two parts apart.

   Hope you find this helpful.

   Rich 

   The Professional Termite

   Edited 3/24/2004 8:34 am ET by Trialnut