Looking for suggestions on a wood species to be used for building a small bench/seat/shower caddy to be used in an active master bathroom shower. Subject to at least two to four daily soakings and subsequent drying periods. I was thinking teak, don’t know how it will look after time. I can’t imagine putting any type of finish on the wood as it will simply not hold up.
Replies
Epoxy would hold up. That's what they use for wooden boats.
Dare we inquire as to whether it is the "master" who is active or the "shower?" you must be one clean individual. ;-)
A good marine spar varnish finish will hold up for a very long time in a place where its only challenge is temperature change, and not sun. Its UV from the sun the destroys exterior finishes. Seal the teak with a low viscosity epoxy such as that made by Smith & Co. and then apply half a dozen coats of a good spar varnish such as Epifanes and I would expect many years of service.
But unfinished teak will hold up quite well, though you will probably have to sand it periodically to freshen it up. It wouldn't turn grey very quickly out of the sun. It could also be subject to mildew if the shower isn't well ventilated. The finish would pretty much eliminate that.
How about using a cellular PVC such as Azek used for building trim. You have to allow for expansion with temperature change more than with wood, but it should fair pretty well.
Cypress. Reasonably priced and with plenty of natural oils already in the wood. Lasts many years even when used as unfinished boat material in southern swamplands.
Teak would be my first choice.
On the domestic side Cypress is more decay resistant than White Oak and it will not turn black.
As for finish oil would be my first choice, boat decks are normally oiled and hold up very well even on tropical climates.C.
White oak.
Rich14
I second white oak.. it's affordable and extremely decay resistant. I'd splash some varnish on it because that's the kinda guy I am but you could do without..
This is the first time I've heard white oak described as "extremely decay resistant". Compared to redwood, cypress, WRC, teak? Why don't they build boats out of white oak; it's alot cheaper than teak?
When was the last time you heard of a boat with teak ribs? Or redwood? There is a lot more to wooden boat design than rot resistance. I had a 40' boat built in new Orleans in 44 with white oak ribs and a cypress keel that was still as strong as the day they built her in 91. Her sides were yellow cedar and an inch of ironwood.------------------------------------
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. -- Herbert Spencer (1891)
White oak for boats, Yes Sir. USS Constitution " Old Iron Sides"Work Safe, Count to 10 when your done for the day !!
Bruce S.
BruceS said: White oak for boats, Yes Sir. USS Constitution " Old Iron Sides"
Not quite. While white oak is fairly weather resistant, and useful in shipbuilding, the USS Constitution is not constructed of white oak, but of live oak -- native to the SE United States, this member of the oak family is an evergreen with a large, spreading crown. (Hmm, since it doesn't drop it's leaves, from a woodworker's perspective, this dense wood may be classified as a "softwood"!)
BTW, the USS Constitiution is a really neat ship. If you're ever in Beantown, you should make a point of visiting her.
Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PA
Mike, Well we're both right. Live Oak frame, White oak keel. The Hull itself has three layers. Inner is Douglas fir, Middle layer is Live Oak, Outer hull is White Oak.Work Safe, Count to 10 when your done for the day !!
Bruce S.
BarryO
White oak is extremely rot resistant and often used to build boats out of, maybe you heard of old Ironsides? Sometimes a particular wood is selected for reasons that has little to do with decay resistance.. For example some boats are built out of light weight woods like cedar for speed or flexibility.
Black walnut too is extremely decay resistant and frankly I've never seen a boat built out of black walnut.. When I went on wooden boats web site and asked the question I got a lot of "I donknows" and some speculation that black walnut was too expensive or bad luck.
IPE
Old Ironsides is a ship, not a boat. ;)
Important difference, since I really was thinking a small vessels without alot of structural members.
But apparently I was wrong. So why don't you see more use of WO outside? Furniture, siding? Makes me want to bury a chunk outside in the dirt for the winter, to see how it'll do.
A quick search turned up lots of links to white oak outdoor furniture. This was an interesting one.
http://www.sittineasy.com/content/view/26/38/ ------------------------------------
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. -- Herbert Spencer (1891)
It is my understanding that most of the 100 year old barns that you see in the east here are of solid oak. My neighbor has one that cost some $2.00 per thousand when it was built. That was cheap even at that time. Some years ago I visited an army buddy where there was a solid walnut barn.
Here are some nice small boats using white oak.
http://www.cwb.org/BoatDatabaseRowboats.htm ------------------------------------
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. -- Herbert Spencer (1891)
BarryO
Simple, white oak like most decay resistant woods has a lot of tannic acids.. nails rot unless they are stainless steel. stainless steel is too expensive for most people..
White oak is denser than teak and parts of boats have been made of white oak for centuries. That was back in the days of European oak groves and not thinking about any ramifications of cutting without replanting. OTOH, I don't know if they had a lot of oaks on Hawaii so they obviously used what they had but on the mainland and in Europe, WO has been used a lot."I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
Edited 10/29/2006 11:58 am by highfigh
You might take a look at ipe. Costs a lot less than teak.
Troy
I'm going to be doing the same thing for my shower. I was planning on using teak, but like the idea of white oak also. Then again, I have a bit of koa that might work out. I'm not going to use a finish on mine. There's always a way for water to get in under unless it's an oil finish. And although I'm partial to oils, I don't think it would last for long in a shower. I'd rather sand an unfinished stool from time to time to freshen it up. (after it dries of course, or I could use wet/dry paper while I'm in the shower!)
Post a follow-up after you've had it awhile. Mine is several months down the road. (gotta finish the shower first)
You might consider jarrah. I bought some at Rockler Hardware here in Houston. Tough stuff.. and pretty too.
Here is a quote from a source on Google:
"When fresh, jarrah is quite workable but when seasoned it becomes so hard that conventional wood-working tools are useless. It is very durable, even in wet and weathered situations, making it a choice structural material for bridges, wharves, railway crossties, ship building and telegraph poles.
Jarrah wood is very similar to Karri wood, and as both trees are found in the south west of Australia, the two timbers are frequently confused. They can be distinguished by cutting an unweathered splinter and burning it: karri burns completely to a white ash, whereas jarrah forms charcoal. Most of the best jarrah has been cut out of south Western Australia."
Edited 10/20/2006 10:45 pm ET by billballeza
I believe the best wood you could select is Mesquite. Not only is it highly resistant to water it is one of the most stable wood, is extremely hard, and has beautiful color and grain. I just visited the largest Mesquite lumber mill in Texas. They actually make sinks out of Mesquite. I used a Mesquite sink they have installed in their office restroom. It has been used daily for several years and looks like new. See https://www.waterlox.com/site/523/default.aspx, http://sinksgallery.com/item-2-2-16-1-4590-0-catalog--1.htm, & http://www.mhmdesigns.net/. The lumber mill is equipped to make almost anything you would want from sinks to huge counters, etc.
TREX !! ;-) Well it's part wood anyway.Work Safe, Count to 10 when your done for the day !!
Bruce S.
Ipe.
John
Teak - old stuff without any sapwood. If you can't find old growth, heartwood lumber at a lumber yard, try naval salvage yards for what was once decking material.
It weathers well and can outlast almost any other species when burried in the ground. I like its weathered, gray appearance, but it can be finished with a good marine "teak oil." However, once you start, you'll spend lots of time keeping it up.
Gary W
gwwoodworking.com
Edited 10/24/2006 3:25 pm by GaryW
Edited 10/24/2006 3:26 pm by GaryW
The dark areas can be cleaned out with a pressure washer and water. If the rings become too deep, it'll need a good sanding. They're used for swim platforms on tournament ski boats and outside, they need to be oiled regularly. Inside, it should take a lot longer to need as much care. I would think about how people's skin reacts with whatever sealer is used, though. Non-drying oils can cause bad reactions.
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
Highfigh,
I think your response must be intended for someone else.Gary W
gwwoodworking.com
Yeah, probably.
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
Jon,
In addition to all the other suggestions, I'll add eastern red cedar, chestnut (if you can find it) and yellow locust. Although the locust might be inclined to sprout and take root in such a damp environment, unless you orient the wood upside down to the way it grew as a tree. Used to do that with locust fence posts.
Ray Pine
Thanks to all who responded. I guess I have a lot to choose from. I've ruled out teak only because of the insanely high cost. Leaning toward ipe or jatoba. Although I have a good stock of black locust, I doubt it would hold up well to a constant wet-dry environment. Not so much rot, but movement and splitting/cracking.
Huon Pine is the way to go. You might not be able to get it in the states. It only grows in Tasmania, Australia. The local goverment here outlawed cutting it down a few years ago. But they have stock piles of the timber that they submerged in all the local rivers and they pull up a certain amout every year for sale. But the wood is extremly water resistant. And it's absoloutly beautiful.
Kaleo
http://www.kalafinefurniture.blogspot.com
I'm suprised that with all the talent round here that no-one suggested Elm.
It is, as far as I know, the wood of preference for water wheels in old mills , not to mention the wood of choice for wagon wheel hubs.
I suspect it is because of it's interlocking grain (hey, take a piece and try and split it with an axe!)
And, if you get near crotches (in the elm-wood!) there is some interesting grain.
Anyway, I thought I would offer that up. buncha elm-trees go to waste every year from dutch elm disease. A tad stinky to work with though, but not bad.
Eric
in Calgary
cowtown
Elm!?????
Please elm will decay on a damp day.. if you want a wood to warp twist split and give you infectous splinters buy elm.. otherwise avoid it like the plague..
frenchy was dis-exclimating "Elm" in real large fonts all over the place....Well. merde , mes ami's c'est dommage, but it don't change history...let me quote from an 80ish issue of Intl book of hardwoods.....(pg 259.......)Elm is used for structural purposes where the wood is permanently wet, in fishing boats and barges, for dock and piling work/This same article notes that although it is not resistant to fungi, it has a long life in water logged conditions.Alors Frenchy, where's yer refernces? and eh! will ya use the same type face/font-size . I loved the splash.eric in calgary
"This same article notes that although it is not resistant to fungi, it has a long life in water logged conditions." I wonder if that translates to it being long-lived when it's submerged continuously. Maybe it doesn't do so well when it's intermittently wet, which would allow organisms to gain a foothold, and have plenty of oxygen to foster their ill deeds? I have no idea, just wondering out loud.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
GREAT THREAD!
So far I've picked up that I can get very ill from a elm splinter.
Not to cut Ipe w/o respirater, (what can happen)? Too late, I did a small cut already!
Old Iron Sides, which I've visited before, has three layers of skin.
Went to Australia, on a Website.
Learned plenty on white oak. Darn, I have a pile of red.
But best, picked up a bunch of tips on woods that I have not used yet, but good to know for the future.
PS, I am using cypress for the first time on some moulding for a shed. I have gotten more than my fair of splitters from Cypress. Fair amount of tearout also, have to use sacraficial fences.
joe p
Elm is extremely strong and tough to split. However, I must agree with Frenchy - it is the epitome of rapid decay. Dutch and American elms will die and be rotten within a year's time. I need to saw and process and rapidly dry elm firewood or it rots within a season. Even dry, it will stain and harbor fungi. No, I think that would be one of my worst choices for a shower bench and shelving.
Ipe is an extreeeeemly weather resistant wood. It also weighs a ton <g>. However, I seem to remember Dennis having some kind of problem with it when he built an outside-the-shower bench for it at his house. I'll see if I can drag him in here to describe.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Jon -
I built a similar bench of ipe. It's a slatted design with spacers between the slats. It's approx. 14" deep, the slats and spacers were glued with epoxy plus I ran a piece of allthread front to back at each end. My bench is situated in a niche about 3' wide and 16" deep. Does not get full spray from the shower but ipe is the wood of choice for exterior wood decks here in the northwest.
It's nowhere near as dimensionally stable as I was lead to believe, however. Each slat has shrunk enough that most of them have spearated at the joint between the slat and the spacer. The allthread has maintained the integrity of the bench, however. It's supported at each end with a 1" stainless steel angle bolted through the tile wall.
I chose not to finish the wood. Normally I understand that ipe will weather to a warm grey with exterior exposure but the material in my shower hasn't changed to any appreciable degree.
Teak is a nice wood but in what little I've worked with it, it's hell on tools! Ipe isn't a whole lot better but at least it doesn't have the silica abrasiveness of teak. When working with ipe, respitory protection is mandatory. It's kinda nasty stuff. I don't think you could go wrong using ipe but I would recommend mechanical fasteners (stainless steel). Even the West Systems epoxy I used failed but then I'm not that experienced with that type of glue. Your mileage may vary.
Good luck with the project. And watch out for those ipe slivers! They're murder!! (grin)
best wood in water
Any body tell "Is White Ash or Maple wood are best in water such as kitchen work?"
Completely agree that white oak it's a pretty good solution. It will serve you long time. Epoxy is another good variant. By the way, if it's possible you can use the protective primer for wood or decorative azure.
Bamboo and teak are perfect wood options for bathroom caddy and benches.
Teak wood oiled w/Teak Oil.
Freshened 3' x 4' shower alcove, new ceramic tile, no niches. Bought teak shower stool and corner 3 shelf unit, 2 - 3 showers daily (depending on how hard I work/play) and so far excellent. Two coats of Teak oil before use and they're working out great, looking new. I will add fence (1 1/2" - 2") to keep small items from sliding off the back of top shelf and we use soap saver/dishes, prolonged direct contact with bar soap "should" adversely affect oil permanence. Mine doesn't seem to need anything else so far, we just rinse, squeegee the shower/doors and leave door (sliding) open 30 mins. or so to dry shower. My favorite type of finish, simple, idiot proof!, which fits me to the ground.
Some of the woods being described here, I sure would not want to get a sliver/splinter in my bottom side or foot for that matter. Secondly using woods off of navel/ocean vessels would doubly smart due to all the chemicals used to perserve it. Woods with high resin content might be on the slipery side and may need to be textured.
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled