Friends,
No kidding. A fellow I met at an antique shop and I started chatting about repairing some of his “junque”. As I was leaving, he told me he has two mahoghany chairs off Hitler’s yacht that need some work and he asked if I’d do it for him.
I begged off saying I was not a serious restorer and might compromise the value of the pieces.
To tell the truth, I’d rather brush my teeth with goat crut then do anything to perserve anything from that indivdual/era. It gave me the willies.
Weird, don’t you think?
Frank
Replies
I agree with you in the fact it was a Horrible Horrible time in history But it is important to perserve the memory of it. If we dont remember the past then we are doomed to repeat it. Even now there are people who deny the Holocost even existed so "revisionist " are tring to change history no we need to remember those things.
Darkworksite4: When the job is to small for everyone else, Its just about right for me"
Steve,
I disagree. Private collections are a viable way of preservation. Most private collectors make their items available for public display or special exhibits. Private collectors are most often easier to work with than museums when it comes to these events.
A lot of museums have far more than they display. Tool collectors, for example, often search out museums as a place to donate their collections. It's very rare that any of these tools have been put on display and the most common fate of these tools is to be sold off. It's rare that these excess items end up in the hands of anyone who understand what the item is. A lot of these old tools end up buried in a garage shop somewhere and from there find their way to a landfill.
Museums are great resources but most don't have expertise in all areas or the financial backing to even properly store and preserve a lot of what they already have. It's kind of grim but it's also reality. I once looked through thousands of tools and mother planes that had been the working tools of H. Chapin and the Union Factory plane works. It's one of the most complete collections of wooden plane making technology to survive. It's owned by one of the most famous museums in the country but I left worried about the survival of these tools under the conditions in which they were stored and had been for years. The collection had never been cataloged and it was because of the cost of such an undertaking. I was greatly pleased to learn this collection is now stored in a new museum building where conditions are ideal but I doubt these tools will ever see public display.
Edited 5/1/2002 12:00:16 PM ET by Larry Williams
Agreed, private collections (the serious ones) are the backbone of public exhibitions.
As for the chairs, I don't think I would attach a moral question to owning them. After all, they are chairs, not an instrument of the evil acts that were perpetrated. More importantly, they probably would not fall into the category of "Nazi memorabilia." Historically significant, most likely not but that's just an opinion and others may feel differently.
Please spare me all this BS about serious collectors and the associated effete intellectualizations. First off, there would need to exist some realistic providence regarding authenticity. If that exists, the most likely purchaser of pieces like that would be some sicko Neo-Nazi who would likely create some sort of shrine out of it. I cannot imagine any "legitimate" serious collector wanting to have anything to do with such tainted crap.
I grew up in Chicago and can vividly remember seeing individuals with tatooed numbers on their forearms. Maybe you think that one of them or their relatives might be a purchaser so that they can have some satisfaction or comfort in their old age.
Were I given the option of repairing such pieces, I would immediately decline and be proud that I put my morals and beliefs above money. Forget the heebee geebies, I would never do anything to facilitate the perpetuation of Nazism or more realistically, Neo-Nazism.
provenance
from latin pro+venre, to see or to come.
Larry, I deleted my previous posts because it is obvious that I am too biased to comment on this subject. So in response to the original post, without any reference to historical value, etc., no, I wouldn't touch them either. Steve - in Northern California
The heebee-geebee factor would be insurmontable for me. I couldn't and wouldn't do it. It would be like reading Mein Kampf to my 5 year old-incomprhensible.
Frank
Frank, I don't have to read the stories, I've been told them first hand. Yes, this subject hits home pretty hard. Sorry, but I'm a bit emotional about this and probably not the best one to answer your question logically like others have. You should be commended, I might not have been so polite in my answer to the request and would probably have regreted it later. Steve - in Northern California
Interesting question. Deck chairs would never be more than a (sick minded) curiosity and would never contribute in a positive way towards preserving history lest it be repeated. Therefore on the off-chance that the chairs might later fall into the hands of some neo-Nazi sicko who would get-off on owning Hitler's deck chairs I'd burn 'em given the chance.
On a related note if you ever go to a pre-war refinery or pump-station there's a good chance you'll still see valves with swasticas cast right in to the valve body. You may even be burning gas in your car that went through one of those valves. I guess history is all over, if you look for it.John O'Connell - JKO Handcrafted Woodworking
Life is tough. It's tougher if you're stupid - John Wayne
Being a Vietnam vet and well knowing the horrors of war, I'll repair them all right.
With a can of gasoline and a match.and satnd back and watch the glow
Dave in Pa.
Amen.
Frank,
Interesting. Personally, I think that your leg was "pulled". I've read and studied a considerable amount from that era, don't recollect mention of Hitler even having a yacht. As I recall, he never even stepped aboard the Bismarck, the Graff Spree, or any surface ship. His idea of a navy was the U-Boat.....
Dano
Dano ; You are wrong about Hitler and the Bismarck. He did go aboard her when she was fully commissioned. There was a tape of Hitler aboard her on the History channel not to long ago. I think he did have a personal ship. It wasn't ocean going but it was used on a lake or river in Germany. Correct me if I am wrong on the yacht
Dave in Pa.
Dave,
As I said, I don't recall anything about him owning a yacht, vagualey recall a film clip of the Bismarck's launching and again don't recall seeing him on board. Neither Speer nor Donitz mentions him having a yacht in their books.
Both of Speer's books give more "personal" insight into the man, in terms of their relationship, than other's I've read.
It is curious though; Hitler interfered very little with his Navy and pretty much gave Donitz and Raeder full reign, certainly much more so than his Field Marshels...
The Bismarck was more a result of his megolamania than as a strategic or even tactical weapon. She spent most of her time hiding from the British Navy in the North Sea. The HMS HOOD was the first and last ship she ever sunk, if my memory serves me...Hitler never wanted a direct confrontation with the British Fleet, it's ironic that the Bismarck was sunk by Pre WWII biplanes...
Dano"Form and Function are One" - Frank L. Wright
A man flew into Shannon airport from New York and was accosted by a hawker punting a human skull. After much negotiating the American bought the skull of St. Patrick, and took it home to display proudly amongst his other interesting artefacts.
A year or two later the American flew back into Dublin on business, and was accosted by the same hawker selling the genuine skull of St. Patrick. The American protested saying that he had bought the genuine item from the self same hawker on his last trip, so this had to be a fake.
"Ah, 'tis not a fake," responded the hawker, "This is the skull of St.Patrick as a young man." Slainte, RJ.http://www.RichardJonesFurniture.com
Hi Dano,
I'm not nearly the history buff that you are but I seem to remember that the bi-planes dropped torpedos, one of which hit the Bismark's rudder, sending it into a big circle. It could not pull out of the circle and was therefore a relatively easy target for the British navy to then sink. I believe they used a surface ship but had trouble because the Bismark's guns had a longer range.
How did I do?
Will
Will,
You did pretty damn good....
Dano"Form and Function are One" - Frank L. Wright
Interesting topic. Let me begin by saying that I am NOT a WWII/Hitler history expert, but I did find a couple tidbits on the internet that point to Hitler having a yacht. Check these out if you are intersted.
http://www.yachting-greece.com/angara.htm
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~froomkin/texts/m1.html
Also, the following is an item listed for sale. A photographic album of the yacht in question:
I40-980. KRIEGSMARINE PHOTO ALBUM FROM AVISSO GRILLE CREW MEMBER -
This photo album is about 30 pages with three to six photos on each page, with onion skin separation. There is no captioning, but the main ship depicted in the photos is very familiar - after a couple of minutes you realize it is Hitler's Yacht, the Avisso Grille, and the owner of this album is a crew member. The album shows many of the places the Grille went, the Grille anchored near Fjords in Scandinavia, repairs in dry dock, visiting dignitaries, lots of scenes with fellow sailors, etc. The beginning of the album depicts sea life prior to the album owner's Grille assignment. A most interesting, very historical album. The blue canvass cover depicts a gold embossed Naval eagle and swastika with red, white and black Kriegsmarine ensign and gold lettering with the standard remembrance. First photos I have seen of this famous yacht, aside from the one picture in the early Party cigarette album.
Near Mint (16786) $ 495.00
As for the original question, I doubt they are authentic, if they were authentic I would donate them to the holocaust museum or some other suitable home (although the gasoline and match idea does have a certain appeal).
Peace.
-Rob
>> "Hitler's chairs" is a term that refers to a certain style
>> of ocean-going lounge furniture. It does not mean that it
>> specifically came from Adolf Hitler's personal property, it
>> is only so named.
Fascinating! Does the term pre-date the dictator then? Where can we read more about this?
I just got this flash of a business I could go into and feel no moral qualms ripping off - I mean catering to - skinheads. I could even use anachroistic hardware and tell the customers how advanced German technology was in the 30's. They'd lap it up.
Yeah, you could even use endangered wood from the rain forest to "craft" them. I think you'd have a big selling item on your hands.
Scott
RJT -
O.K., I'll buy that. It makes sense. I wonder who thought enough of him to name a chair after him. Unless........ It might just be the most uncomfortable lounge chair ever made. It certainly makes people uneasy just talking about it.
Steve - in Northern California
Frank
Goodness you sure got lots of comments, opinions etc. etc.
Funny how history effects us, recent history most of all. I am a student of history for nearly 40 years and I find that the worst offender of human kind in the last 500 years was good old friendly now ally....England.
If you simply add up all the death they caused it would make Hitler look like a minor thug.
!. India
2. Parts of Africa
3. China...remember its not that long ago. Could not kill enough of them so they shipped them opimium, mostly from India, and other parts of the world. sold it to them.
4. Oh yeah, don't forget America.
Much of the battles with Japan began and were due to Englands desire to continue to subject much of SE Asia to a continued rape. Japan just wanted it share.
So my point... funiture and things are netural. I still like the English, the Germans, etc. & I sure respect all those with strong opinions and feelings they are to be respected.
Whats this got to do with woodworking anyway. Man can sure be mean.
I would be interested in seeing the chairs. Will have to look through my Hitler history books to see what I can find.
Curt
Curt,
Err- maybe we are getting off topic a bit. I read alot of military history too- I wont stop making late Georgian and Queen Anne pieces.
Lots of intersting comments. Nonetheless, I wouldn't touch the chairs whether authentic, reproductions, or belonging to the class of "Hitler" chairs (I really can't believe the latter is true- not exactly a name that is a reasonable marketing tool).
Frank
>> Do you avoid riding in vehicles of that company because
>> of that link?
Some people do. Some people won't buy any German car, ever from a manufacturer less closely linked to Hitler.
VW's don't bother me;maybe they should. If he stuck to VW's instead of wars of conquest,genocide and other nastiness things would have been better...
I certainly don't buy anything made by Krupps- maybe I should be more consistent?
FB
Did you know that Dr. Ferry Porsche besides designing the VW, designed the Panzer Tiger tank? And for that the French held him in prison as a war crimminal for 2 years. He did put the time to good use though, in '49 the prototype which would become the 356 was born. The 356 evolved into the 911/912/930 and is still being made today. Altough commissioned by Hitler, the VW bug certainly outlived the commissioner. To my knowlege the VW Bug is the only car ever to cease production due to world wide saturation. I doubt that would of happened if they named it after Hitler. I don't think you can confuse product with politcal history and boycot intelligently based on nationality. No spaghetti or Ferraris because of Musolini, no Cabernet or Citroens because of the autrocities perpetrated on the Vietnamese under French rule which utimately created the conditions leading to the Vietnam War, no Newcastle or Beatles because the Brits fought our independance, no medical care because there is probably some Japanese electronic component in virtually every piece of medical equipment in any US hospital??? Where do you draw the line? What about Hondas made in Ohio?
John O'Connell - JKO Handcrafted Woodworking
Life is tough. It's tougher if you're stupid - John Wayne
Edited 5/6/2002 5:56:56 PM ET by ELCOHOLIC
When I was growing up, I doubt if I remember seeing any Fords in Jewish neighborhoods; largely a reaction to the viscious anti-Semitism of Henry Ford.
No race or ethnic group is without guilt when it comes to mindless brutality against other races or ethnic groups. Finger pointing accomplishs nothing and trying to determine who started it or who was worse is as absurd as trying to count the number of angels that can dance on the head of a pin! Hell, humanity gets pretty worked up about the superiority of their different gods. With that said, it is important to note that Euro-centric "civilzations" have really done a number of indigenous peoples in the last 500+ years. I hear a lot of press about the Holocaust in WWII while the systematic destruction of the indigenous peoples of the Americas, Australia, the Pacific Islands, etc is rarely considered. It's pretty amazing considering that it is still going on (unless you consider Chiapas MX to be just a political power struggle or the rape of the Amazon as necessary development). And when the issues of the use of Africans as slaves is truly and actually addressed and dealt with, that will be amazing.
For a very disturbing book read something by Noam Chomsky. I forget the title but it has something to due with the effects of the last 500 years since Columbus "discovered" the continents of the Western Hemisphere. And of course, one could always re-read Dee Brown's book Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee if you want to reface that reality. Personally, I don't have the emotional strength to ever reread that one.
I don't think it is necessary to go back 60 years to WWII. Hell not when we have Afganistan, Rowanda, Uganda and Edi Amin, Palestine and Israel, Pol Pot and the Khmer Rouge, Pakistan vs India, the Viet Nam war (can Agent Orange be considered a Chemical weapon?), the Civil Rights struggles in the 50's & 60's, the Chinese occupation of Tibet or your own individual favorite! The arrogance of humanity absolutely amazes me.
Dr. Porsche also made farm tractors in the very early days, so perhaps he was less motivated by the morality of the machine and more about the engineering of it. As for "Hitler's car" or whatever you call it, there certainly isn't anything evil about the idea that all common people should be able to afford an automobile... in fact, I believe that Henry Ford also started out with the same idea.
PS- the Porsche 911 legacy actually started out as the 901/911/912/etc. And to mention the 356 without including reference to the 550K Spyder is just a crime! :)
Points well taken. I was thinking of the basic production rear engine layout/evolution. The Spyder is indeed legendary, and the 4-cam itself even more so especially in specific output with the technolgy of the day. Amazing! My all time Porsche rides/drives are as follows:
1962 - Grandpa returns from Stutgart w/ new 356B Coupe ( I was 6). He dumps his Ghia immediately. 13 years later I would be pissed that he had them change the lighting for export, but intrigued by the S90 sway bars on a 1600N car.
1971- Bombing through Santa Barbara foothills in Grandpa's 356, lift throttle in downhill, right hander and discover "trailing throttle understeer" first hand, spun 2-3 times, miraculously didn't hit anything! (16 years old)
1975 - Grandpa bribes me off of motorcyles shortly after marriage, drive MY 356B home to sell Honda 400F Cafe Racer
1975 - 1st drive in my 356B after having 1600N pumped to 1760cc, 40mm Webers, lots of headwork, nasty cam (dead below 2500 rpm), 120 mm clutch, buying AVgas at the airport twice a week ... 110 real hp.
1975 - Guy that built my motor scares most of the #### out of me in his legit '64 Carrerra 2, 4-cam. Same guy scares the remaining feces out of me right afterwards with ride in extremely built early 911.
Still waiting for a drive in a Spyder, or a 936 for that matter.John O'Connell - JKO Handcrafted Woodworking
Life is tough. It's tougher if you're stupid - John Wayne
funny thing about my history with these cars is that I never liked Porsche all that much. Then I acquired a '73 911S quite by accident (someone owed me money) and it's been a love affair ever since. I've had up to 5 911s at one time, that's how afflicted I became.
Most sentimental:
- possibly the 911S, but the maintenance on the mechanical fuel injection is a bitch. No, the most sentimental goes to the '73 1/2 911T with Bosch injection (the same injection system was used through the 80's on all flavor of european cars). It was a T, but it had all kinds of S goodies like the front spoiler and instrument cluster, and factory Carrera seats... in '73! This car was a jewel that could run, but was also incredibly civil. I still own this car, that's how much it claimed me.
Most scary:
- definitely the '78 911 turbo I had. No variable wastegate on the turbocharger, it was on/off baby and when it was on... 450hp in a 2,100lb rocket. The interior was bare bones, no power assist anything, nothing that would add weight to the car... it was all about speed
Most interesting:
-Carrera 3.0. Grey market carerra with a 3.0 liter engine. Very fast and very fickle, tough to get parts for.
Always wanted to have one:
- 356A or Pre-A, or 356SC. Only getting more rare and valuable with time. These cars were so far ahead of their time. Of course, like any porsche freak, a 550K Spyder with a genuine 4-cam engine would top my list, but at over $500k each, well that says it all. You know, now that I think about it, a Speedster would be on this list, but I guess that's really the thing about these cars, there never is 'just one' that you desire.
Most awesome, wish to have one someday:
- was in Munich last month and saw a new Carrera GT rumble down the Maximilianstrasse, wow! The ground vibrated as it went by.
Makes me itchy just listening to you guys.
Most scary: - definitely the '78 911 turbo I had. No variable wastegate on the turbocharger, it was on/off baby and when it was on... 450hp in a 2,100lb rocket. The interior was bare bones, no power assist anything, nothing that would add weight to the car... it was all about speed
A friend of mine had an Austin Healy 3000 with a local mechanic's prototype installation of a turbocharger on it. He was driving fast but below boost cut-in point along a coastal road, 300 foot drop on one side and a rock face on the other when he closed on a tourist. Downshifting put him into boost so he picked the wall instead of the flight; turned the car into a hockey puck but walked away. Not a Porsche, but nice car none-the-less.
Porsche didn't run without variable for long, it was just too much power in a rear engine car... you would go into a turn, downshift and power up, and get a nice surprise when boost kicked in. The result would always be the rear end overpowering and spinning out. It was a very scary car to drive fast.
oh yeah, and an Austin Healy 3000 is a dream car in it's own right, what a pair, the bugeye sprite and the 3000.
Yeah those mechanical S's were a bitch, lug it just a little and there goes a set of $8 a piece platinum Bosch's. A good friend of mine flew out here in '76 or so to by an 'S' from the GM of Vasek Pollack (the West Coast Distributor). I think it was a '73, it was the last year of the mech'ly injected S's. It had all the factory goodies, special Bilstein susp (about 2" ground clearance), Recarro's, tweaked motor, sunroof, and a special no ashtray dash. It had the deapest Porsche alloys I'd ever seen, I thinks 9's and 11's. The GM had it painted w/ 20 coats of rubbed lacquer on delivery. Anyway I got a great nice rides in that one too. I always wanted a 2.7L RSR, but then who wouldn't. It would look good in the driveway next to the 3.0L CSA BMW I always wanted too. Then there's a 959, ... (endless list)
I hang out at this Donut shop @ 06:00 Saturday mornings. 200 + rods, muscles, Cobra's and the occaisonal serious sports car or exotic (GT40 once). Once in a while a guy shows up with a street legalized 917! Now that's serious! He has a Porsche Team ride on the Pikes Peak team and I guess he's won the class a few times.John O'Connell - JKO Handcrafted Woodworking
Life is tough. It's tougher if you're stupid - John Wayne
yeah, the Cayenne. You can get more info at http://www.porschecayenne.com
This discussion has been interesting, German Cars. I looked through my library of Hitler books, including one of just pictures complied by John Toland who also wrote a book about the guy. Interesting no pictures of Hitler on a boat. Few by the water.
Furniture was somewhat interesting. One of his early desks was rather nice interesting, other furniture looked rather typical. The blown up (attempt on Hitlers life by his "friends") conference table must have been impressive. Some pictures of Gorings place, one pornographic set of furniture, interesting taste.
Curt
Guys,
speaking of sweet rides- my highschool car(77-79)was a classic
1968 Buick Lesabre fully equipped:
3 of 4 tires were snow tires,
oxidized gold paint that turned sort of green
enough iron oxide on the body to call it a rolling pile of ore
350cc engine with a hole in the crossover pipe big as your fist(who needs headers)
Ripped Vinyl seats
Now that was a babe magnet!
Frank
Now, this is great.. we actually went from a really touchy subject to a really cool subject. The transistion was extremely well orchistrated.. Thanks to those who managed to pull this off. By the way... I've had a Vette in my garage almost since the day I could afford one... Well O.K. my first was a 78 aniversary edition then a 86 then a ..... believe it or no 53 1/2.... owned by an ex Senator.. sold it very quickly for a really nice profit and the last one.... well it was a skunky... really bad performing 1990... I have my eye on a 67 right now and if I charge the guy enough for the wood work I might just have it for a decent price.
Again, thanks to all who took this thread from skanky to cool
Steve - in Northern California
67 Stringray... big block with a 4 speed... canary yellow... it was so hot, it smoked just parked.
I was 18 with a few bucks in my pocket, needed a few more and my old man balked at it, "that car's a piece of junk, it's way overpriced." I could have had that stingray for about $14,000, it makes me sad to think of what it would cost to buy it today. I get a little weepy whenever I see a 63-67 corvette just because of that experience. My old man knew a lot about woodworking, he didn't know squat about cars.
My best car was '71 Plymouth GTX 440, Accel BEI Electronic ignition, B&M slap stik Auto trans, 4:11 rear, Edelbrock Tarantula intake manifold, Holley 1050 cfm Double pumper carb, set of headers,(can't remeber whose) and got 2 gas stations per mile. LOL. I had a buddy that had a '69 Charger with an aluminum block Hemi engine re worked by Keith Black with a fiberglass front end. Talk about no weight, dam thing was nearly an airplane with all that HP under the hood. Just add wings.
Dave in Pa.
My favourite car was a '68 Datsun 2000 GS roadster.
It was a hopped up version of the 1600 and 2000 roadsters which were the updated Fairlady. Around 5,000 were sold in North America in order to be eligible for the Production Racing class. 4 cylinder U20 block, twin dual Solex carbs and a hot cam. Not big horsepower numbers for today, but fast and great torque. Topped out at 145 mph with the top down and got there fast. Could beat any other sports car except the original 240Z, Sunbeam Tigers and the odd XKE I could get to toy with me.
Bought it for $1000 in'79. Couldn't replace it today for $20,000
Edited 5/10/2002 11:46:58 AM ET by Dick
Thanks I'll take credit for switching this one to Porsche, but from there it took on a life of it's own. I love this medium. My take on Vettes by series:
C1: Pretty, but that's all folks.
C2: Love them all, especially '66 Roadster ala Rat
C3: You gotta be kidding on anything after the '71 LS6
C4: Better, but a ways to go still. ZR1 drivetrain incredible in a production car. They're going for well over $25k in the Hot Rod market.
C5: Now your talking.
C5 Z06: Sportin' Wood all the way baby! I can't believe it's the same price as the ragtop.John O'Connell - JKO Handcrafted Woodworking
Life is tough. It's tougher if you're stupid - John Wayne
the newest vettes are in supercar league, quite an extraordinary car for the $$. I hope they hold up well over time, that's the only criticism I would have... compare a vette that's 5 years old with a 5 year old porsche and the wear-and-tear issue rears it's head. I will add that GM has been putting out quality product, I'm pretty darn close to one of the quad-steer denali pickups.
Good luck with the Denali. I still see a lot of relatively new GM trucks with big patches of dark primer. I think Ford makes the best trucks. I had an '83 Bronco that I just couldn't kill. Got rid of it 2 years ago because I couldn't get it smogged anymore with the "real" 351W I put in it in '85. I just got rid of the wife's '98 Durango very prematurely by my normal 10 year 'keep it' policy. The thing was such a gutless pig. I have buddies with 454 Subs that get better mileage. I decided to off load while the trade in was still pretty good, if you can call 50% of sticker good after 4 years/60k miles. I bought her a Passat GLX (190 hp/Tiptronic) great car and I'm sure it'll be around for the long haul. I really wanted the 'W8' but couldn't see my way to a $46k VW (incl'g $5k dealer gouge!).John O'Connell - JKO Handcrafted Woodworking
Life is tough. It's tougher if you're stupid - John Wayne
$46k for a passat, ouch! The new Volvo cross country my wife drives was 'only' $43k, and it's a lot of car... not as fast as a w8, you could get an S60 T15 for the same price for a better comparison to the W8.
I'm kinda over SUVs, it's going to be either pickups and cars from here on out. The funny thing is that there isn't alot of "utility" in the SUV class, they don't work well as a truck and they don't have the comfort or performance of a car. I guess if all you need to do is tow something an SUV would work okay.
My wife just went out and traded her 98 Grand AM on 2002 Nissan Xterra SE-SC. I had to say that I have never been a big fan of any vehicle. that couldn't hold a 4x8 sheet in the trunk. But this Xterra is one hell of a rig 210hp Super Charged V6 5 spd standard (wife never drove a standard before). It is built just like a truck and I can put the wife, little guy and the dog with all there gear and go for the weekend and still have room to bring home some stolen tools (when dad is not looking I borrow certain items) that I might be needing. It can pull a big load and gets way better mileage than my full size extended cab GMC pickup.Scott C. Frankland
Newfoundland Wood Worker
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