Replies

1. 
   DHAM | Dec 31, 2006 08:59am | #1

   Take a good close up picture of the end grain that has been sliced with a sharp razor knife, then post the picture. A number of people will be able to help you identify it.

1. 
   eps355 | Jan 04, 2007 04:39am | #9

   Here are three photos of the wood that I am trying to identify. One is a slice off the end of a 4X4, the other is a along the grain of the wood, and the third is the endo of the 4X4.
   Thanks for all of your help.
   Ed

   
1. 
   DHAM | Jan 04, 2007 04:56pm | #10

   Hard to be sure without a sample in hand, but from what I can see from the photos, I would say hickory.  It is possible that it is ash, but where I can see the latewood pores, it looks more like hickory than ash.

1. 
   eps355 | Jan 04, 2007 06:32pm | #13

   Thanks again. I'll run the 4X4 over my jointer and take some photos of the surface grain. Someone, (Jackplane) suggested that it might help.
   Ed

1. 
   DHAM | Jan 04, 2007 06:58pm | #14

   Good.  If you can get a cleaner cut on the end grain that will help too.   It is hard to see the cell structure unless it is sliced cleanly, like with a razor knife.  A small section about the size of a quarter (coin) is enough if it exposes a couple of growth rings.  That would help increase the certainty. 

2. 
   eps355 | Jan 05, 2007 04:05am | #15

   The attached files are photos of the 4X4 after running it over my jointer. I'll try to get the end grain slice that you recommended.
   Ed

   
3. 
   Rich14 | Jan 05, 2007 05:02am | #16

   That's ash. Rich

4. 
   DHAM | Jan 05, 2007 06:51am | #17

   Could be, but it could be hickory as well. That color, especially the dark heart spot is very hickoryesce. The parenchyma cells in the end grain will tell the story! To me, there is a color difference in ash and hickory. There is more "reddish" in hickory and more "yellowish" in ash. Not very scientific, I know. At this stage with what we have to work with, I cannot rule out either one.

5. 
   eps355 | Jan 05, 2007 08:00pm | #25

   Thanks all. I'll try shaving a thin slice and sending in the photos. Its raninig here today and I'm off to the Baltimore Woodworking show.
   Ed

6. 
   Rich14 | Jan 05, 2007 08:06pm | #26

   Sure, fine. Go ahead, go to the show.

   Leave us hanging here with this wood identification mystery.

   See how you are!

   Sheesh!

7. 
   eps355 | Jan 05, 2007 08:57pm | #27

   Wow! Now I feel guilty. So I'll take along some wood samples and try to find an "Aficionado" at the show. Perhaps we can put an end to this mystery. Although I am not just interested in identification of the wood, I am enjoying the process. I am just getting started in serious woodworking so I have a lot to learn.

8. 
   Rich14 | Jan 05, 2007 09:06pm | #28

   Hey,

   Have a good time. It will interesting for you to have someone "eyeball" the wood vs the images we have seen here.

   Rich

9. 
   user-211435 | Jan 05, 2007 08:18am | #19

   It looks like firewood to me.  Is that one of the better pieces?  Your endgrain samples were all checked and poorly dried.  The jointed pieces looked like reaction wood.

   I hope I don't come off as being a meanie, but I burn a lot nicer wood than this every day at happy hour.

   You should pick out the very best piece and stand back and take a clear photo of it.  Or even better, surface a bunch of boards.  Hard to tell by one stained piece.

   Hal

   http://www.rivercitywoodworks.com

    

10. 
    woodman2263 | Jan 05, 2007 04:07pm | #23

    I think hickory is down the right road.  Not only hickory, but I "think" it is pignut hickory.  And no, pecan and hickory are not the same thing.

     

    Jeff

11. 
    gb93433 | Jan 05, 2007 11:07am | #21

    It is often very difficult to tell the difference between Ash and Hickory until you flip the board. The dark reddish-brown area in one of the pictures reminds me of hickory. I have never seen that color in Ash. Typically in Ash that kind of blemish would be a different color. One of the pictures reminded me of Sassafras but too much of the others appeared to be Hickory. Some of the pictures reminded me of Sassafras because of the colors. If you could take a picture of the entire board might be more helpful. If you could calculate the volume of the board and weigh it that would tell a lot. My best guess is that it is Hickory because of the reddish-brown areas which are quite small. That is typical of Hickory. Especially images 133 and 136.

12. 
    Rich14 | Jan 05, 2007 03:41pm | #22

    Looking at the images this morning, I'm not so sure they are ash now. Either ash or hickory. Hard to tell from these pictures. Rich

2. 
   jackplane | Jan 04, 2007 05:05pm | #11

   A picture of a milled piece of the face would be a lot easier to identify than a pic of the end grain.. 

1. 
   eps355 | Jan 04, 2007 06:29pm | #12

   OK I'll run the 4X4 over my jointer and take some more photos.
   Thanks Ed

2. 
   terrylee86 | Jan 01, 2007 01:52am | #2

   Heft will give you a good idea.  Pick up one of the boards and if it feels about as heavy as oak it is ash.  If it feels heavier than you expected for a board that size and is a lot heavier than oak it is hickory( old growth hickory is really heavy for it's size).  Ash is a little more open grained than hickory, but the best way is to post a picture and most will be able to identify it for you.

1. 
   eps355 | Jan 01, 2007 04:47am | #3

   Thanks, most of the boards are full two inches thick and about six feet in lenght. I'll try the comparsion test that you suggested and try to get ome good photos.

3. 
   DHAM | Jan 01, 2007 06:07am | #4

   The reason that I suggested you post a pic is that ash and hickory look very similiar when you view a cross-section. Both are ring porous, with the earlywood pores very distinctly larger that the latewood pores. However, the difference between the two is determined from the arrangement of the parenchyma cells in the latewood in association with the latewood pores. The parenchyma in ash is paratrachial, that is, the parenchyma run through or circle the latewood pores. In hickory, the parenchyma is apotrachial, or not necessarily just associated with the latewood pores. In hickory, there will be bands of parenchyma cells running thru the latewood irrespective of the pores, whereas in ash, the parenchyma tends to connect the latewood pores. So, instead of trying to explain all this is excrutiating detail, a picture is worth a thousand words.

1. 
   eps355 | Jan 01, 2007 09:35pm | #5

   Thank you for the detail reply. Its raining today so I'll wait for a sunny day to get some good photos of the lumber. I will hand planing one of the planks to reveal the grain structure and try to get as much definition in the photo a I can. I want to build a woodworking bench with this material.
   Ed

1. 
   DHAM | Jan 02, 2007 04:42am | #7

   Good. Take the pics of the end grain. You will have to use a razor blade or a very sharp knife to slice a clean section to photograph. Take as close-up of a picture as you can that you can get in focus with your camera. Hopefully, that will give enough detail in the pic to make a determination.

4. 
   gb93433 | Jan 02, 2007 01:22am | #6

   Hickory and pecan are a lot heavier than ash. When you flip it the first time you will know. Even the NHLA will tell you they cannot tell the difference between hickory or pecan. If it has bird pecks then it is doubtful that it is ash.

1. 
   eps355 | Jan 02, 2007 05:01am | #8

   Thank you. I'm sure that it is not pecan, the tree was cut near Syracuse in upstate NY about 30 years ago. +

2. 
   user-211435 | Jan 05, 2007 08:03am | #18

   Aren't hickory and pecan the same thing?

1. 
   gb93433 | Jan 05, 2007 10:48am | #20

   I think that http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hickoryand http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pecandoes a great job of explaining the difference.

1. 
   user-211435 | Jan 08, 2007 03:30am | #33

   Thank you.  This is much better than the replies I received simply saying that pecan and hickory are not the same thing.

   I hope they also take a look at your links.

   Hal

2. 
   DHAM | Jan 05, 2007 04:21pm | #24

   No, hickory and pecan are not the same.  Pecan is a hickory but a hickory is not necessarily a pecan.  The genus Carya includes the "true hickories" and the "pecan hickories".  The true hickories ususally have 5 to 7 leaflets on the leaf while the pecan hickories have many more leaflets per leaf.  Of the pecan hickories, there is water hickory, bitternut hickory, and pecan.  These three are all "pecan hickories", but they are each their own species.   The wood in pecan is actually more disticntly different from the other species in Carya, as is the nut.

1. 
   user-211435 | Jan 08, 2007 03:32am | #34

   Oh, now I get it.  This is like Douglas Fir and Pine both being pine, except that it's a hardwood thing.

   Hal

5. 
   Truejoint | Jan 05, 2007 11:01pm | #29

   I thought I saw some bark in one of your photos.  If so, send a photo of that and let me know what state it was cut in and if known what sort of woods it came out of (wet soil, dry, ridge top, swamp that sort of thing) and I should be able to tell you the species of tree it came from.

1. 
   eps355 | Jan 06, 2007 06:27am | #30

   Well the mystery is solved. I spoke with "The International Wood Collectors Society" at the show. They had about 75 different wood samples on hand and good reference books, a great bunch of guys. Than I spent some time with the folks from Maryland Select Hardwood, they had large samples of both Hickory and Ash.
   For those of you that have been following this saga for the last five days the wood that I have is HICKORY. The follow up question is what particular type of Hickory. There are at least 7 or 8 varieties of Hickory.Many Thanks to all of you that offered your help and advise.
   Ed

1. 
   DHAM | Jan 06, 2007 07:12am | #32

   Outstanding!! Still, if you want to post the pics of the sliced end-grain, I will show you how hickory and ash differ if you are interested. I have enjoyed the mystery. Thanks for posting it!

2. 
   DHAM | Jan 06, 2007 07:10am | #31

   If there is bark, then I will be in high heaven. I am a "bark man". That could put the proverbial nail in the coffin!!