how often do you work with 12″ plus wide boards
joeleonetti
| Posted in Power Tools and Machinery on
For a long time, I have been thinking for machines, I should get the ones that can support the widest boards possible. Over the past seven years, I can count on one hand the number of times I’ve found boards wider than 12″ at the good local lumber store I go to. As such, does it make sense to spend extra money for that capacity that may never or very infrequently be used? For the amout of times I would actually need it, I could likely pay to have the service done for me and likely come out ahead in terms of money and less crowing in the garage. Just curious what you have found to be the case. I build nightstands, other “normal” furniture and have some book cases in my future.
Replies
It is very rare indeed that I would work with boards wider than 8".
I have in fact only once ever used wood too wide for an 8" planer-thicknesser, though of course, glue-ups needed to be spot on.
So why did I buy a 16" planer-thicknesser?
Good question.
It's mostly for the thicknessing - I have aspirations to plane small table tops and cutting boards, but the difference between jointing an 8" board on an 8" jointer compared with jointing an 8" board on a 16" jointer is chalk and cheese. The power. The sheer, unbridled power. The convenience - the ability to shear-cut (even a spiral head will tear out sometimes) and the longer tables - everything is just so much better when it's bigger.
It does no harm that due to the design, it does not take up that much more room than my 8" either.
But have I ever built anything using it that I could not on my 8" machine?
No.
And if I do, I might be doing it just to justify the purchase.
If I could get wider boards, I would. But the wider planer helps on glueups. If you use the full width of the planer with narrow boards you can go longer in between blade changes.
Most of the 12 inch machines are lots of plastic, universal motors, and pretty lightweight. Wider machines are more steel, cast iron, bigger and better motors. It's not just wider width.
Your question is somewhat dependent upon the woods you most commonly work with, there are species that are readily available in wide slabs, but most NA hardwoods are less than 12" or you pay a premium for wide boards.
Since I am going to assume your question is in reference to planers and jointer, I will relay my experience as the owner of a 12" planer combo machine. First the jointer, having a 12" jointer is a godsend and I would never want to go back to a smaller machine it is just so much easier to flatten boards prior to planing. The majority of boards I work with are between 8"-12" and this jointer handles them beautifully. I will add pushing a 10" board through a jointer purely with arm power is a workout. I had occasion to run 300bf of wide hickory once and I can't imagine doing boards wider than 10-12" so I don't see much value in a wider jointer.
The planer is another story. If I had it to do over again I would probably have found away to a 16" combo machine, not for the jointer but for the wider planer. Running wide boards through the planer is a challenge since boards often skew slightly as they are pulled through and, at least with my Grizzly, this can mean it will leave unplaned ridges along the edges. A wider planer also gives you options to run wider glue-ups through as mentioned earlier which if you don't like hand planing and scraping can simplify your life, although I find tearout to be more of an issue when running glued up panels through as it is all but impossible to get the grain on multiple boards to align perfectly.
What, me worry about wide boards? I have a friend with a 40" double drum sander. Not exactly sure about the exact 40 number but that machine is BIG! He ran some 30" wide table tops for a project I just finished, came out fine.
The shop I work out of has a 12” jointer but I will still often rip wide boards in half. A 12” 8/4 board that is badly cupped is gonna end up wasted in chips otherwise. If you are strategic you rip along the rift portions for a clean glue up. Wide boards are nice for keeping a project to a single board or two. If you can lay out all your parts on a single board choosing grain and whatnot, you’re one step ahead. Cut out the parts then joint and plane.
What you can handle influences what you do. I have both a 8" and a 24" jointer, and a 26" planer. This allows me to face joint glue-ups, as well as not having to glue up. I can make wide panels for doors from one board. I live in rural Tennessee, and have cruised sawmills looking for large logs. I once bought a 24" walnut log, and had it sawed into 2x18s. Made gorgeous bookmatched table tops. Made a cherry sugar chest from 20" wide boards; one board for each side and the top. And I have a stack of 8/4 cherry planks waiting for the right table project. If you can deal with wider boards, you can go looking for them!
For me it would come down to available space and price. That you have to figure out for yourself.
Gorgeous
Beautiful. Well done.
Thanks all for the feedback. Yes, it is more in line with jointer considerations, but I wanted to be a bit more general. I am also fighting internal biases of buying more than I need for many things in my life.
I face the same problem - I would kind of like a CNC, but would really mostly want it for making templates as I'm not a production woodworker.
I could easily get this work done very cheaply locally by people who are good at it, then get on with what I enjoy, but I still want that CNC...
It is VERY hard not to hoard tools, but it is very important to buy tools you are GOING to use, not tools you would LIKE to use - they just gather dust and lose value. The psychology of woodworkers is most interesting!
LOL don’t we all!
He Who Dies With The Most Toys Wins !
Having said what I did above, if I couldn't have a jointer wider than 12", I would make sure I had a jointer sized hand plane. Even with a 24" jointer, I resorted to a hand plane to take the cup (actually the associated hump) out of a 12"x12' oak board that was too unwieldy to run over the jointer. And I've done the same with a 2'x14' strip laminated ("butcher block") cherry countertop. Doing this doesn't require that you get it smooth, just flat enough that the planer rollers don't distort it so it can come out of the planer flat. The plane needs to be sharp, but not perfectly set up.
I do have a No 8 jointer (plus scrub planes, etc) so from a hand tool perspective, I can take care of wide boards. At one point, I posted a topic about electric hand planes. My thought being if I can easily get it reasonably flat on one side then I can use the planer to finish it off (that whole sled and shim trick).
The bandsaw and planer were definite tools to purchase. Jointers get expensive and I am a bit more on the fence about them. Obviously, boards need to be flat but I have options.
It's a bit of an added risk exposing the jointer cutter, but I've flattened wider boards a few times on the jointer by removing the blade guard, jointing 8" of the wider board and then shimming the jointed portion with another board to raise the unjointed portion off the planer bed and running it through the planer that way to get a flat side.
I've been working with a 12" combo maching for a few years. I buy wide boards when they present themselves that I walked away from before. As JHB says, the capacity you have influences your shopping in a big way. I still walk away fron cupped or twisted boards. If I had more space I would have bought the 16" J/P combo.
Which one do you have?
That's a good point. Nothing I am doing today but will keep in mind. The other thing I am trying to keep in mind is that I have and am taking classes at the Mt. Diablo Adult Education Center in the SF Bay Area. After you complete the two prerequisites, you can take an open class (for like $75 or $250) which then gives you access to their impressive array of machines, which they constantly upgrade. Lots of Powermatic equipment. They have a 24" Powermatic planer in addition to a 15 (or is 16") Powermatic planer. They have three jointers. None of them are 12 or 16" yet. If I had to guess, at some point, I could see where they might upgrade. Basically, for little money, I could use their equipment if I do get the opportunity for a wide board. All good problems to have. Top notch instructors as well, some of which write for FWW.
Scorpion by CWI with the helical "stinger" cutterhead. I got a sweet deal on it during the "border war" with Canada... it was in a Stateside warehouse and redirecting it to me in NY was cheaper than getting it back to Canada.
A few times over the 20 years I’ve owned an 8” jointer I’ve had planks wider than the knives.
Usually only at most two inches.
I’ll joint the face as wide as I can then hand plane the 1” strip the knives could not reach. It works well enough. I’m in the basement though, and not trying to earn a living from it.
I have a 13” lunchbox planer for final true up.
I wouldn’t get a 12”. Other things first I’m sure.
As an aside, I have a 10” non sliding miter saw. Even that is good for me on a single cut 85% of the time and the other 15% I figure it out. I’d love larger but would need to cut a hole in the wall behind the saw.
Mike
I have an 8" jointer. It is very rare that I get the woods that I use wider than that. On the rare occasion I do I remove the blade guard, joint the width I can to the thickness of a 1/2" sheet of plywood then use my planer and the plywood sled to finish the jointing. I have done up to a 12" board this way. (There are videos on how to do this one this site). Having a 16" planer is handy for planing larger pieces after a glue up, but I prefer to get rid of the glue lines with a jack plane unless the glue up went really badly. I like the bigger planner for the mass and the power. Both make planning easier, and the resulting surface is nicer. Other options to joint wider boards - pay someone to do it for you, which is not expensive. Or, do it by hand. I use a scrub plane, a jointer plane and a jack plane to flatten wide slabs for live edge stuff from time to time. With well set up, sharp planes, it really doesn't take very long. And, its a lot quieter!
Every time I went for a larger tool, opportunities widened and it got used to its maximum capacity. A young couple came this morning to pick six, one foot diameter X 2 inches thick log slices that I had accurately slit on the Bandsaw so they could make lamp bases and they chose a section of a 18 inches wide spalted maple live edge slab that I cut to length on my 24 inches cross cut capacity radial arm saw and planed down on my 20 inch planer to remove the cupping and saw marks. That will be for a nice coffee table top.
Until 2 years ago, rarely. Then I started building a few cellarettes (bottle cases), and needed 14" for the top, and 12 1/2" for the case sides. I've used walnut and sapele. The walnut needed no additional work other than sanding and a card scraper.
The sapele, however has been a challenge. Finding boards with no twist or curvature has been impossible. To date, I have handled it with hand planes and a lot of elbow grease. Just picked up a 14" x 16 ft. piece, which I cut in half for transport. Gonna take it to a friend with a 16" planer and work on the twist. Knowing him, the blades will be nicked and probably a little dull, so I will leave it a bit thick and finish with hand planes.
all that said, I really don't have any need for a wider planer. In fact, my 12 1/2 DeWalt has not been plugged in since out move 4 years ago. But then, being retired, time is of lesser importance and and the pleasure of doing things well regardless of effort has come to the forefront.
My experience has been that a 13" standard planer is just fine 99.9% of the time for me over the last 18 years! I use a lot of Cherry, and several natural edge exotics and they mostly all are 13" wide or less. When they are wider I use homemade sled and router combination to dress the boards- only needed once or twice in 30 plus years. Generally I edge match and glue up boards. Usually I try to get sequence cut boards it makes a world of difference for doing glue-ups and the results can be fantastic and eliminates completely the need for gigantic equipment!
I have almost never worked with boards more than 12" wide but often make panels that are in the 14-16" range for doors and smaller tables. And have joined two or three such panels for larger tables and workbenches. I have a 6" joiner and a 16" planer. I wish I had an 8" joiner but the planer is just fine. The 23" planer would take up too much space for the amount of times I would need the extra width.
A wide planer lets you flatten both sides in a pinch (too wider for the joiner). I know that's not supposed to be the way to do it, but it usually works. Occasionally a little handwork with a jack plane is required but not usually. I find flattening a board with handplanes only to be tedious and leads to a lot of tear out. Others may be better at it.
Bottom line: a big planer is the most important thing, a big joiner is a nice to have. But that would depend a lot on what you make. Stuff like the lovely chest from jharveyb above probably warrants the extra size.