Replies

1. 
   BoardmanWI | Jun 07, 2007 03:05pm | #1

   They're still worth sawing.  There'll be some uneven drying in them, and maybe some minor rot on the bottoms, but otherwise they'll be OK.

   Here's a place that might be a source for used portables:

   http://www.forestryforum.com/board/index.php

2. 
   ring | Jun 07, 2007 05:31pm | #2

   Look at http://www.sawmillexchange.com for used mills.

   David Ring

   http://www.touchwood.co.il/?id=1&lang=e

3. 
   frenchy | Jun 07, 2007 05:52pm | #3

   AWagner142

       if they are white oak they will be fine a decade from now,, (as long as the death watch beetle doesn't get to them)  red oak still should be ok I've seen logs in a sawmill longer than that..

4. 
   JeffHeath | Jun 07, 2007 08:54pm | #4

   Red Oak can degrade and become infested with bugs quite quickly when laying on the ground.  The only way to know for sure would be to cut them open.

   I don't mean to disagree with frenchy, but I've milled white oak logs that were felled 6 months earlier that were COMPLETELY infested, split, checked, with mushrooms growing out of them.  There's a huge difference between logs stacked high off the ground at the mill, many of them sprayed with an insecticide, and a log laying in contact with the moist ground.

   Jeff

   
   

   ---

   Edited 6/7/2007 1:57 pm ET by JeffHeath

1. 
   frenchy | Jun 07, 2007 11:30pm | #5

   Jeff Heath,

       Most sawmills I visit stack wood right on the ground.. None that I know of spend the cost of spraying insecticide. In fact only rarely do I even see them seal the ends of logs, most saw a log 6 inches longer and use that to allow for checking..  (besides that allows them to make railroad ties out of the center) 

    I too have seen white oak infested, but mostly only the early wood, not the mature wood. So once you get past the first inch or so it's usually pretty safe.. However I've seen trees that were infested before they were sawn.

    It really depends on where the tree is,, if there are a bunch of death watch beetles around they can really infest white oak..

    Red Oak?  all bets are off.

2. 
   Joe Sullivan | Jun 08, 2007 05:50pm | #6

   Jeff:

   I have had downed burr oak milled after lying on the forest floor for a couple of years.  True, you lose some of the ends, and the sapwood will be gone,  but with a decent-sized log you still get a lot of good wood.  Wcwn the rotted ends can make for some interesting projects once you stablize them.

   Right now I am sitting in my cabin looking at a fireplace mantle I made last summer our of a piece cut from a long-downed burr oak log that we found when looking for firewood and decided there was too much good wood to waste.  It was about 12 inches in diameter.

   Cheers!

   Joe

1. 
   JeffHeath | Jun 08, 2007 07:27pm | #7

   Joe

   I guess where I'm coming from regarding this topic is that Oak, white or red, is EXTREMELY plentiful in my neck of the woods.  They are everywhere, and the local tree cutting services and villages are cutting them down to make room for god knows what every single day. 

   It costs me approx. 40 cents per board foot to mill a log, and (presently, but soon to get a little cheaper) 25 cents to have it dried.  At 65 cents per board foot, I'm going to mill a very healthy, ready to go, recently cut down oak.  I'm not going to mess around with a log that has mushrooms, mold, and ants all over it, and having to work for a couple of hours handling heavy, filthy, ant ridden wood to the burn pile just to get a little bit of good stuff.  By the time I figure in the labor, I'm up to 8 bucks a board foot for those very few boards of oak that anyone can buy at Menards for half the price.

   However, I totally agree that if you're on a mission to use the resource, regardless of condition, you will most likely get "some" decent wood to work with.

   I'll snap a photo of our local drop off for logs, branches, and yard waste.  The tree services in the area create a monstrous pile of logs every week, and it's free to take from it for firewood, etc...   At the end of the month, the township that runs it grinds everything left into mulch, and it's free to whoever lives in the township.  I can take my dump truck over there around 6:00 PM when the tree guys start unloading their trucks for the day, and have all I want.  I've passed out a few business cards offering to pick up certain species at their jobsites, bobcat and all, so that they don't cut them into 4 foot lengths.  I'm getting my stockpile of logs up while I'm waiting for my new mill to arrive.

   BTW, and off subject, but how did that table you were building for your cabin turn out??

   Jeff

1. 
   Joe Sullivan | Jun 09, 2007 05:07am | #8

   Table project stalled due to time constraints, but I am at the cabin right now and will try to make some progress.

   In general we agree on the wood.  However, my take is a little different.  For example, the wood that will go into the top of that table came from the downed log I mentioned.  That tree made two 10 foot logs, running from about 14 inches down to about 10 inches (so roughly 12").  A friend and I loaded them in an F250 and took them to a local mill  the sawyer there sliced them to order for about $50.  We dried them for a couple of years in our shed, then rented a planer for the weekend and surfaced them.  For my purposes, I got lots of nice inexpensive oak, and a few "character" pieces. 

   Later this summer we will haul some true Quercus Alba out of my parent's woods.  Some of those logs will be freshly cut.  Others (about four) will have been down for over two years.  They are almost 40" at the base.  The mill will cut, dry, and finish them for about $0.80/bdft.  We intend quarter and rift saw most of it.  I expect to lose an inch or two of diameter, possibly three or four, due to it having been on the ground.  I will still get pith-free old growth q-sawn white oak in the 15" to 17" width class.  At the price, for a hobbyist like me, that is a reasonably good deal.

   Joe

   Edited 6/8/2007 10:10 pm ET by Joe Sullivan

2. 
   BilljustBill | Jun 10, 2007 05:53am | #10

   Hey Joe,

   I'd sure like to see a picture or two of your Oak mantel....

     Bill

1. 
   Joe Sullivan | Jun 10, 2007 07:12am | #11

   I am at the cabin right now, but have no pix or camera, alas.  However, for FWW it would be disappointingly simple.  The fireplace is stone and quite old, but the maneltpiece was a fairly ugly pine affair that was disproportionately small -- or seemed to to me. I wanted the look of massive, rustic oak.  However, the walls are natural logs, and so they curve and swell at random.  The trick was to get the massive monolithic look and still somehow mnage to scribe it to the log wall -- and to do this with limited tools and time.  I wound up using a 7" long roughly 4 x8 section of the bur oak we salvaged here on the property as the main section.  I then cut and fitted sections of the same log to the back of this as sort of end caps, and ripped a 4-quarter board from the same tree to to a sharp angle to fit between the end caps.  In essence, the back of the mantel is an exotic box.  The shaping and fitting of the pieces is hard to describe without an illustration, but they were joined and glued, not nailed.  The joinery was somewhat pragmatic, though.

   The endcaps were a pain to scribe to the logs (no bandsaw here), but as they were only about 4" long each, it was doable.  I actually would up pushing a skillsaw sideways to hollow to the line, and chiseling for final fit (almost no chisels up here either and no gouges).   The 4q board was scribed easily because the knife edge limited wall contact.  I just used an electric hand jig saw. 

   I know this approach will cause pain to some of my better-tooled bretherin and sisters in woodworking, but one makes do with what one has. 

   The result is hard to tell from a monolith without very good light and a close look.

   Joe

1. 
   BilljustBill | Jun 11, 2007 04:31am | #12

     Thlanks for the reply, Joe.

      I can appreciate your hard work with simple tools.  Few souls out in the general population, few people really know how complicated a "Simple" piece can get. 

      With the wind blowing on a cold snowy night, in the firelight I'll bet it glows!!

      Bill

2. 
   Joe Sullivan | Jun 11, 2007 05:11am | #13

   Indeed it does.  It is best appreciated in the company of frineds after a day in the grouse coverts, over a glass of some adult beverage.

   Joe

5. 
   user-114258 | Jun 09, 2007 02:12pm | #9

   Aric,

   Lots of responses and opinions! IMO the best way to answer your question is for YOU to take a chainsaw and cut off a section of the log and look to see how much solid wood there is.  If you want take your axe and then split it and inspect it further.

   In general Oaks are quite forgiving and keep their quality longer than species like Birch or Maple.  Then again rotten...oh I mean spalted... Maple is a desirable thing for many.

   Forestry Forum and sawmill exchange are two good sources to find a used mill.

    

   max