How would you make this cut???
A 30 degree angle on the end of a 8″ wide, 60″ long plywood skirt? (across the 3/4″ edge of the 8″ wide piece – sort of like a scarf joint, but not).
Too long to stand up vertically on the table saw, and too wide to fit under my miter saw blade, even with a jig to make the shallow angle cut.
The little grey cells, they come up with WAY too complicated methods at this point.
Any bright ideas ????? I’m sorta, kinda stumped.
Mike D
Edited 11/26/2007 10:24 pm ET by Mike_D
Replies
Rough cut the bugger then set the sander for said angle to dress to net.
Routs & sands
If you're talking about what I think you are, I came upon this situation cutting rafters a few months ago. The problem is cutting a very accute bevel on the end of a board. If there is a miter also, cut this first, then clamp thick support blocks sandwiched on either side of the mitered or squared end. You can take a circular saw (wormdrive is the only way to go) and, with and additional edge guide or not, with the shoe set to the desired angle, run it along the end grain of the piece, which is now a platform wide enough to safely support the saw. Pull the guard back manually as you make the cut so it doesn't drag the saw. For furniture work, this technique is rough and would require some cleanup. Do test cuts to set the perfect angle on the saw.
Brian.
Yeah, I was thinking along these lines. I'm assuming that you have to treat the support blocks as sacrificial for the cut - at least for the 1st one. Maybe could reuse them for the next 4.
Mike D
Mark it out well (accurate), cut with a handsaw, plane it to the lines. All of 5-7 minutes with most of that laying out the cut.
Take care, Mike
This is probably going to be the "best" suggestion. I have hesitated to do it this way because.....
1) I'm power tool centric (uuf, uuf, uff), and was thinking that way.
2) I tend to get a lot of break-out when I attempt to use hand planes on the edge of plywood unless it's something nice and dense like apple ply or baltic birch.
Thanks for all the input!!!
Mike D
No worries about the power tool-centricism. We all approach our problems from our point of reference.
A fine-toothed saw shouldn't have appreciable tear-out. I just made some ply jigs yesterday using a hand saw because the cuts are weird and I couldn't do them using my BS without too much fuss.
The ply when hand planing needs to be backed. If you have enough of these to do, a simple jig to guide the plane will back up the trailing edge and bottom of cut. This need not be as elaborate as at the following link, but you can figure out how it could be made and work.
http://www.whipplesargent.com/jig.pdf
That is from Alf's page on shooting boards here:http://www.cornishworkshop.co.uk/shootingboards.html
And there are other solutions on that page. But that's a resuable solution.
However, if the ply is not ripped to width yet, it is more simple to mark out the angles direct, cut and then plane to layout lines and then rip to width. That way the ragged trailing edge is simply trimmed away. For the bottom edge, it can merely lay upon a second sheet of scrap so the beveled edge will align with the scrap's edge. On the far edge of the over-width piece, slightly bevel back past where the line would extend. Else when the ply begins to break at the far edge, it may hold the plane from evenly planing to the line.
An inexpensive Japanese saw from a local hardware store such as the Shark Ryoba will provide a clean cut in ply if you don't own a good western hand saw with fine--and sharp--teeth. There are two cutting edges and no back. There will be a coarser rip tooth edge and a finer cross cut edge. Use the cross cut teeth and it will both go pretty quick and accurate.
Take care, Mike
One more option:
Cut a smaller block of wood to the desired angle (30 degrees)
Clamp it to the workpiece and use it as a shooting board for a handplane or handsaw
Be sure to tape and/or scribe the show-side of the plywood. This will minimize your tearout
Count to 10 when you're done
Great input!
But DARN!, now I NEED a Number 7 plane. :)
Now how am I going to convince SWMBO that it's absolutely critical that I find that Veritas catalog?
Mike D
I have clearly not been taking proper care of my handsaws. I discovered this afternoon that they might more properly be considered (to be) very narrow files.
Perhaps a little sharpening is in order. :(
Mike D
Edited 11/27/2007 10:12 pm ET by Mike_D
Hi Mike--such is life! They do work a tad bit better sharp.
The best saw for clean cuts in ply is that saw I emntioned. Something like $15 or so from Ace Hardware--at least the last time I looked.
For sharpening of western saws, consider Steve Cooke. http://www.cookessharpening.com/
Take care, Mike
I don't understand, why would you need to stand it vertically. can't you tilt the blade?
Jack
Edited 11/27/2007 12:49 am ET by JLMCDANIEL
You can tilt the blade, but not enough for that shallow of an angle. My table saw will only tilt to 45 degrees. I can make a 15 degree sled to get that to 30 degrees, but with a long piece to cut, that has a lot of lumber waving around in the air.
Sorry about that , but it was a long day and I was about brain dead.
Jack
I've certainly been there!
Mike D
I was about to write exactly what Mike W said-then I saw his post....
Radial Arm Saw?
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
There you go again, Bob, with all that radial arm saw stuff.......... :<)
Merry Christmas,
Paul
Gave it away when I retired. Never could keep the darn thing set up square.
Mike D
I'd use a router on a small sled with a frame to support the sled at the 30 degree angle.
John White, Yestermorrow School
Hi John,
Small sled? I'm not visualizing what you mean.
(Man, I love these conversations - I'm learning tons of stuff!)
Mike D
http://buildyourguitar.com/resources/tips/scarfjnt.htm
You were on the right track with scarf joint.
Mount the router on a 3/4 inch thick board about as wide as the base and about 2 feet long. The sled will need a hole in it for the bit to come through. Clamp down the plywood you want to scarf and then clamp down two blocks angled at 30 degrees on either side of the end of the plywood to be trimmed. Now place the sled across the two angled blocks and trim off the plywood as you move the sled back and forth over the sloped blocks.You won't need a special bit, any medium to wide straight bit will work, it should project around 1/2 inch beyond the bottom of the sled.John W.
Edited 11/27/2007 4:18 pm ET by JohnWW
Mike's "problem" was coming to the issue from a power tool-centric pov. Mine is the opposite.
John's router solution clicked in...simply go purchase a 30 degree chamfer bit at Woodcraft, Rockler et al. Use an edge guide set a tad wide of the mark and make a second clean-up pass if the quality is important.
Take care, Mike
Ah! and that bit is perhaps a tad cheaper than a new No. 7 plane.
Mike
Hah! SWMBO just walked up and said "How do you guys get anything made in the shop - you're always clacking away at the keyboard."
I've tried to explain that the keyboard replaces the old cracker barrel at the general store.
Mike D
OK so I like my router table..
http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?Offerings_ID=5504&TabSelect=Details&cookietest=1
That's a pretty simple solution, alright.
I assume that that bearing can come off and get out of the way?
MIke D
If I am seeing what you describe properly I would likely use a portable circular saw with a vertical fence attachment. These are used by some boatbuilders for scarfing joints.
Here's a link to one jig for that sort of purpose:
http://oneoceankayaks.com/stitchglue/plyshophtm/scarfjig2.htm
I would stand the board vertical in my Delta tenoning jig on the TS
James
Me too if my shop was in my garage instead of my basement!
Mike D :)
If you're not in too much of a hurry, order a 30 degree router cutter and run the router along a fence. Or build a ramp and use a straight cutter.
Hey Mike,
I would build your table saw jig to acquire the 30 degree angle you need. Then take a short piece of lumber (12" say) that is wider than the 8" board (at least 10" wide)and cut it in half with a 30 degree crosscut. This gives you two short pieces with 30 degree bevels. Next mark out your angle cut on your long board. Mark it all the way around. Then take the two short pieces and double stick tape or clamp them to the long board so they line up to the cut markings and are in line with each other (ultimately a 30 degree face on either side of your board) Once the short boards are attatched take a flushcut saw and make the cut keeping the saw registered to the two angled boards. Clean it up with a sanding block with the angled boards still attatched if you need to.
Edited 12/19/2007 6:30 pm ET by Cormaceby
I must be missing something....... but wouldn't any old circular saw work? (good carbide blade of course) I have a Festool saw with a guide rail, would take all of 2 mins......
Those Festools are sweet, but can you lay it down to 30 degrees? My circular saw (and my table saw) both stop at 45 degrees (it's the same kind of cut you make when you make a scarf joint).
What I did was make an angled jig with my table saw, applied it to the end of my board, and cut it with my circular saw. Got a good, clean, accurate cut, too.
Mike D
I thought the Festool tool saws had 45 degrees as most do?
go with the handsaw solution and make sure you have a SHARP plane to finish up. Another way you might want to explore is outlined in the Kreg tools pocket screw jig documentation. Not sure if you are trying to join boards together in your joint. If you are, just join them and plane/sand the edge to any angle you want.
you could build a quick plywood sliding jig for your tablesaw. have it angle up away from the sawblade at 30 degrees going 90 degrees from the blade. put a runner that follows the slots in the table top . set the saw blade to 30 degrees and clamp your board 90 degrees to the blade using a framing square against the saw guide and board.carefully run your board thru to make your 60 degree cut.
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