Replies

1. 
   JsHerbel | Mar 19, 2004 10:33pm | #1

   Some kind of lubricant (I use paste wax) on the screws will probably solve your problem. Make sure that your screws are really wood screws and not drywall screws which are too brittle. The pilot holes through the maple fence should be at least as big around as your screws so that the screwing action doesn't cause unnecessary binding or cause the fence and the ply to push away from each other.

   
   

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   Edited 3/19/2004 3:37 pm ET by JS_HERBEL

2. 
   JohnWW | Mar 19, 2004 10:44pm | #2

   Going any more than an inch into the maple would be counter productive.  Don't use conventional wood screws, they're obsolete for any application except mounting hardware on traditional cabinetry. 

   Use sheetrock screws, or their pricier cousins made for cabinet work, or flat headed sheet metal screws.  No matter what type of screw you use, drill a full size pilot hole, and you shouldn't have any problems with screw breakage.  If the screw goes in hard or starts to squeak as you drive it, the pilot hole is too small and needs to be redrilled larger.

   The maple is probably going to change shape with the seasons, so don't glue it to the sled, it may need to be planed or adjusted to keep everything square.

   John W.

1. 
   Robbie | Mar 19, 2004 11:45pm | #3

   John:

   Thanks much.  You are right on the maple.  I face jointed and planed it from 8/4 stock last week.  It was perfect, but noticed that it already has moved slightly and needed correction.  

   In some respects, I wasted money using maple.  For the rear fence, I simply face glued two pieces of 3/4" baltic birch, laminated them with formica and rounded them over.  Probably will be much more stable than the maple.  I was concerned that I would get some wave under the formica - not enough to make a difference.  It cost virtually nothing compared to the maple which was not cheap.

   What is the best way to size a pilot hole?  I have always tried to match the "solid" portion of the screw - not including the threads.

   I've got some 1.5" and 2" flat head stainless steel screws with a "sharx" grip on the threads.  Will these be sufficient, John?

   Thanks again

   Edited 3/19/2004 4:47 pm ET by Robbie

   Edited 3/19/2004 4:48 pm ET by Robbie

   Edited 3/19/2004 4:49 pm ET by Robbie

1. 
   JohnWW | Mar 20, 2004 12:15am | #4

   I use a dial caliper to get the inner diameter of the screw's threads and then go with the nearest size drill bit.  In a hardwood I'll go to the larger of two sizes if the screw's diameter falls in between drill sizes.  Doing it by eye is fine though it may take a test hole to confirm that you've chosen the correct size. 

   As always if it starts to feel too tight, stop and redrill a size larger.  I've used ordinary sheetrock screws for thirty years and haven't broken more than a couple in that whole time.

   Stainless steel screws are fine but I would still drill a pilot hole and definitely make the hole's diameter on the large side. Stainless steel, depending on the type and treatment, can be fairly soft and more easily broken than ordinary steel screws.

   In a hard wood like maple you are better off to using a few extra short screws to hold the pieces together rather than to using just a few long screws that are more difficult to drive.

   Hope this helps, John W.

2. 
   jazzdogg | Mar 20, 2004 05:23am | #5

   "Use sheetrock screws"

   John,

   I agree with the previous poster: drywall screws are too brittle. In an application like this, I prefer to use deck screws.

   -Jazzdogg-

   Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, you're right.

1. 
   corners | Mar 20, 2004 05:32am | #6

   A good bet in a really hard wood like maple is to use machine screws. Drill and tap the wood just like you would with metal. I've seen tests and this is stronger than any wood screws - and they come out easily as well. Lee Valley sells a drill and tap set for this purpose.

   http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.asp?SID=&ccurrency=1&page=40057&category=3,41306

   Edited 3/19/2004 10:35 pm ET by Corners

2. 
   JohnWW | Mar 20, 2004 06:03am | #8

   My opinion on sheetrock screws is based on my own experience.  Over the course of thirty years, I've probably driven 50,000 of them in furniture, jig, and interior trim work, usually with pilot holes for the finer work, and I have broken no more than a half dozen screws.  Three of those screws came out of the same box which I chucked after the third one broke.

   John W.

3. 
   RANGERP75R | Mar 20, 2004 05:41am | #7

   Robbie

      Sheet metal or Spax screws.  If you'e using #8 screws, #9/64" drill bit and touch the tip of the screw in a jar of vaseline before you apply.

   sarge..jt

   Proud member of the :  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

   
   

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   Edited 3/21/2004 12:47 pm ET by SARGE

4. 
   BG | Mar 20, 2004 01:02pm | #9

   robbie,

   I'd attach that fense so it could be adjusted.  Drill out some angle material (aluminum(sp?))....and leave a bit of play around the screws so your fense can be fine tuned.
5. 
   eddiefromAustralia | Mar 20, 2004 01:55pm | #10

   Robbie,

   Further to John's advice, the link below is to an earlier post dealing with the exact same issue.

   http://forums.taunton.com/tp-knots/messages?msg=15355.6

   In this is a pilot hole size vs screw gauge chart which I got when I was training.

   Cheers,

   eddie

6. 
   ian | Mar 21, 2004 01:56am | #11

   Rob

   The attachment is the screw / pilot hole sizer I use.

   With wood screws going into hardwood you need both a pilot hole and a clearance hole (The clearance hole is for the screw's shank)

   Hope this helps

   Ian

   
1. 
   RANGERP75R | Mar 21, 2004 07:52pm | #12

   ian

      Thanks for the Imperial post. I looked at it and realized I had posted 5/64" for a #8 screw. I just edited as I acutally use the next one up to my 1/8" in my drill bit box which is a 9/64". I don't even look I have picked it up so many times. I just grab it. 9/64", huh! And now I know. ha.. ha...

   sarge..jtProud member of the :  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

1. 
   Robbie | Apr 01, 2004 05:56pm | #13

   Ended up using 2" deck screws to attach the maple fence to the ply sled.  Worked better than the 5 other varieties I tried.   Finished gluing / biscuiting the safety block onto the back of the maple fence this morning.  A couple of screws to fortify this joint and both sleds are complete. 

   The Highland plan was terrific as it included the template for the "saw handle", which should substantially improve safety.  I undoubtedly overbuilt these sleds, but they seem to cut perfect (and not half bad hanging "nested" on the wall).  Is it worth posting pics or is that ridiculous?

1. 
   RANGERP75R | Apr 02, 2004 06:07am | #15

   Robbie

      The Highland sled plan is nice. I wouldn't worry about doing it industrial strenght. I have a tendency to do that also.

      I would post them in a thread here instead of the gallery if you're that proud of it as I know you are. You might start a thead and ask if anyone else has built the thread.

   Just some thoughts to consider...

   sarge..jtProud member of the :  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

7. 
   RonInOttawa | Apr 02, 2004 12:13am | #14

   I just finished building a rock maple workbench, which has numerous screws. I use maple for many projects, as it is as cheap (or cheaper) than clear pine around Ottawa, especially if purchased in the rough. I agree with one of the previous posters concerning Spax screws, and all the posters who advise drilling pilot holes at least as big as the core diameter of the screw.

   I lubricate all screws into hardwood using the wax from an old toilet bowl seal. I just roll the tip of the screw in the wax and then insert it into the pilot hole. I've been using the same piece of wax for over 25 years, and there is at least another 25 years of use left in it.

   Regards,

   Ron