Ideas-In/Out Support, logs on bandsaw?
forestgirl
| Posted in Power Tools and Machinery on
OK, it’s soon to be time to cut up those cedar logs that hubby sectioned off with the new Huskie chain saw. They are currently in 8′ lengths, but that might be too ambitious, so will probably cut down to 4′, at least the larger logs. (They’re destined to be simple fence slats, ~3.5′ long.)
Am interested in any shop-built in/out supports that have worked for you when handling logs. The saw I’m using is a 14″. TIA!!!
forestgirl — you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can’t take the forest out of the girl 😉
Replies
FG
We are in the same spot. We just took down a walnut in the back yard. I had them split the trunk sections in half and about 66" long. Man! Are they heavy! I need help - but my plan is:
Rockler sells "bracket roller stands". I have two; one I mount on my TS front rail, the second on my jointer bed. Each will be about 30" from the BS which I'll move between the two.
Mount the halves on plywood so there will be a smooth surface to travel over the BS table and so there will be a straight edge for the fence. I'll waste plywood for each log but get staraight slabs.
Hope this helps. If there are suggestions for me, don't hesitate.
Jerry
Hi Jerry, thanks, maybe we can come up with something, eh? BTW, the carriage designs that I've seen did not involve sacrificing the plywood. I'll try to pull the references for you, but probably won't be until tonight or tomorrow.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
jfrostir,
don't! Those roller stands tip over too easy and then you're in trouble if not danger!
Make simple wood infeed/ outfeed tables.. make them very sturdy!
make them smooth and level with the table of the bandsaw.. I have a nail gun so I bang together infeed/outfeed tables in a few minutes. Don't waste a lot of time doing perfect work, you'll need to tear them apart as soon as you are done.. I leave the nails proud of the wood to make them easy to pull apart.
I didn't use "roller stands". Rockler has roller supports that clamp to other surfaces. My shop layout is such that the outfeed roller was clamped to the Unisaw and the infeed roller was clamped to the portable planer. Very solid and easily adjusted for height and direction.Of note: As I was cleaning up the shop to "furniture standards" yesterday I discovered that the sawdust which had built up inside the BS was as fine as "very-fine beach sand". Interesting - particularly considering the coarse, 1.6 TPI blade. I'm not really a "wimp", it is just that I get more satisfaction out of designing and making furniture than I do from making boards and waiting a year to use them.Jerry
Frenchy, here is the stand he was referencing. If we could cross it with the Veritas stand (non-directional), it would be ideal. forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
WowForest Girl,
Those are even more flimsey then I imagined.. I have wrestled with a lot of big timbers on my bandsaw, They are already square. I can imagine the danger involved in trying to work with logs..
What I use are the big 10 foot long roller sections like you see in grocery stores, except mine are really heavy duty.. They are set on stands I bang together out of big heavy timbers..
You don't need much to saw thru thick logs powerwise but the second the log shifts it causes the blade to bind....
I know at the sawmill they dog down the logs in order to keep them from pinching the blade. they use a 50m horsepower motor geared down to keep the blade speed within limits and yet with 50 horsepower if a log shifts, the blade stops!
I can't provide too much info, since we're really talking about someone else's set-up here (in our conversation), but wasn't he using an L-shaped sled? Have to go back and check.
Not saying that I, personally, would use rollers. Just pointing out the type of stand he was talking about, which clamps to a machine bed or whatever, not standing on the floor.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
I have been looking at ways to resaw small logs on my bandsaw and found this link to a woodworker who made a sled that rides in the miter groove and secures the log at both ends. I hope you find it useful.
http://users.goldengate.net/~kbrady/LogSled.html
Andy, thanks! I'll go through and take a goooood look.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Here is a link to an Australian forum were the poster accomplished basically the same thing you want to do.http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=29656
Hey, QC, thanks! Looks like a good system, and great pics. I've been to that site before, should go back more often.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Hi FG,
Here's another sled design: http://www.rd.com/americanwoodworker/articles/200008/main/
I fashioned something like it to satisfactorily re-saw some 2' irregular walnut logs. Only 6" height; no riser yet.
If the cedar still has a chance of being "green" ask Suffolk about which blade for green wood. 'Course, you already knew this.
I just purchased one of the Lee Valley infeed-outfeed supports with the rubber wheels and steel ramp to use with my resawing of logs. I've used it about a week now and it works well. The nice thing is that the rubber wheels swivel and don't result in any push-pull on the log. They are a bit expensive but have such fine adjustment systems that help in set up that I think they are worth it.
Funny, I always thought those Veritas rollers looked kinda hoakey, but it sounds like the work way better than others. Just shows to go ya that looks aren't everything! Thanks for the info. I'll have to build my own for this project, but will keep the LV's in mind for when $$ is available. (Their router fence is at the top of the list right now.)forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
I suppose you've heard of Roy Underhill, You could do it his way if you don't figure out a modern way. Know what I mean ?? Use a Pit saw ! My backs sore already. I actually have used one at Jamestown Va. Naturally they put me on the bottom of the saw, thats work but surprising fast, just under 1/4" per stroke in poplar (Yellow Poplar or Tulip) to some.Work Safe, Count to 10 when your done for the day !!
Bruce S. Counter Sales, Tech Rep. http://WWW.EAGLEAMERICA.COM
FG,
I think John White did an article a few years ago in FWW on building an infeed/outfeed table for the bandsaw. I remember it had storage, etc. and looked kinda fancy..but well designed. It was affixed permanently to the bandsaw which just would not work in my limited space. I've always used the rollar outfeeds and they are quite limited and unsatisfactory.
The key concept of J. White's design was supporting the infeed/outfeed table with wood stretchers that ran down to the base unit of the bandsaw. It might be just as easy to run the support legs to the ground and, therefore, allow for removal when finished. It would probably take a wide piece of melamine(or similar) about 8' long that could slide arond the blade and be suppoted on each end with legs to the ground. Anyhow, that is about as far as I gotten thinking about it, good luck
Thanks, BG, I'll trot over to the Ask the Experts area and see if he can give me the ref. Or, if I can ever find the index, look there. (I'm finding FWW.com pretty darned hard to navigate, even though Knots has improved greatly.)forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Index: Go to Taunton home page, go to second item down under woodworking which is "magazine" , look in top banner for index...cool.
Yesterday I tried the approach I mentioned in an earlier psot: mount a 1/2 log (split with a chain saw) on a strip of OSB, using screws on the left edge; support the infeed and outfeed with bracket mounted rollers from Rockler; then go to it.It worked like a dream on freshcut walnut. I could feed by pushing with two fingers - my 14" Laguna was equipped with a 1", 1.6 TPI, 'no-name' blade that came with the saw.Comments: A 4' half log is HEAVY! Those who say there is a LOT of sawdust have been there. I have good dust collection but that didn't start to do it; A 4' half log is HEAVY! A previous post stated that a roller feed must be perfectly aligned so that the feed is not misdirected. A 4' half log is HEAVY - or am I repeating myself.My nice, clean furniture shop is a mess. I will dry the slabs I cut yesterday, then burn the 6' and 8' logs I planned to save. From now on I'll buy my lumber.Jerry - The Wimp
Jerry, was the log heavy??? ROFL!!! "From now on I'll buy my lumber." Ooooo, hope I don't draw that conclusion. I wanna build a fence from my own cedar!
Sounds like I should plan on cutting outside maybe. I have a dust collector, but I'm sure it wouldn't get close to 100% of all the dust. Time to build that mobile base for the bandsaw.
to All above, I've read and appreciate your posts. Still working on gnarly taxes. Will go through and digest tonight!! Thanks!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
FG, I've been following this thread as I had a 'dream' of cutting my own boards from logs myself. Having said that, I'm curious as to why don't you haul your logs to a nearby sawyer/mill and have them sawn, OR call (woodmiser?) and find out who owns a portable sawmill in your area and would be willing to bring it out to your place. When I had my place up north in Snoh. county, I had a guy stop by one day and offer to saw my standing timber up for me to build a house, don't remember what he was going to charge me, it was a long time ago. He had his portable sawmill trailered behind his pickup. Whatever you do, good luck...
Jeff
"...curious as to why don't you haul your logs to a nearby sawyer/mill...." Well, still not totally out of the question, and trust me, if I had this many board feet of maple it would definitely be worth hiring someone to do it. This is cedar, and destined to be (I hope) a little slat fence, nothing more glorious than that. To keep hubby from giving it to daughter for firewood(!) I suggested we get some "free" fencing out of it.
The tree was dead for about a year before that big wind storm blew it down, so there may be some problems when I get into it, not sure. Some of it looks really, really solid. Other parts just look a little odd. Who knows. This is only the second tree I've cut up, so long on dreams and short on experience. The other one was maple, and it's still "spalting."forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
JW article is Soup Up Your 14" Bandsaw, issue 159 pg. 44
Jeff
Forest Girl, I have done a lot of resawing logs 60" or less. My saw is the Grizzly G1073 ,16" bandsaw,7 1/2" resaw at most. First thing,do you have enough hp?I would think 1 1/2 hp would be minimal for a lot of resawing.After you square the table to the blade, add a temporary 2x4 support under the table.This is necessary,the logs are heavy,just placing them on a saw table will move the table out of square. The locking knobs on the trunion won't hold against this weight.
I do not use rollers,just a very simple piece of mdo plywood for and aft the table.The mdo is about 10"x 30" on the infeed side.10"x40" on the outfeed side.I use a sled to carry the log.L shaped rides against fence. L shaped end pieces are lagged into log ends,screwed into side of sled.This keeps the log from rolling and moving on the sled.Two lags on one end,at least one on the other end.When cutting logs with chainsaw,cut them fairly square,otherwise lagging into the ends is a problem.
Use dricote once in a while on the tables,also on the blade. Use sharp blades,3 teeth or less per inch.Make your husband lift the logs,even cedar which is light in weight ,isn't that light when green.
mike
Hi Mike, thanks for the detailed description of your technique. No problem "making" my husband lift the logs -- he's not apt to let me do it considering how many days/year I get laid up with screaming-meamie pain.
My saw is the old Grizzly 1019Z, with a riser, but it seems to have plenty of power. Timber Wolf blades are my fave, and I'll order 3 or 4 for this project (hope that's enough!)
I think I'm going to try and invent a way to secure the ends without using lags -- reserve the lags for the side.
Taxes first though! I figure May 1st for starting the cutting up. Get the in/out supports and sled made, figure out where to stack the wood and set that up. Get the blades in.
Thanks again.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
FG,
If your fence slats are to be rustic in nature, you could try dispensing with the bandsawing and use a...lataxe (!) - that is, a froe - to cleave rather than saw the wood. With 4 foot logs, you generally start by splitting them down into quarters with a splitting axe, then further subdivide each quarter with the froe until you have the general size/shape parts you want.
Cleaved timber is not very neat, of course. So if your fence is to be a regular painted one, riving is no good. But if it is to be a rustic affair then rived palings would make it look very rustic indeed.
Lataxe
FG,
Here's a creative elaboration on the log resawing jig in Lonnie Bird's book - from the MiniMax forum:
View Image
View Image
My favorite thing about this sled is that it gives new life to an old cross country ski exercise machine. That's the white frame you can see in the first picture. I suspect you could get similar results with in-line skate wheels or other creative recycling. The key is to get smooth rolling as well as lateral control, with the jig doing absolutely all of the heavy work.
Hope this helps the creative juices. Let us know what you come up with. I just got my bandsaw set up, and have some walnut and olive to resaw next month so I'll be very interested in your results!
Wayne
I used to use a 20in band saw for resaw work and I made up a sled similar to the minimax one just using a simple pieces of timber as the guides and rollers. I moved work shops and lost the use of that bandsaw I now have access to a dedicated resaw and wouldn't go back. on the dedicated machine I don't have to baby it pushing so slowly that the timber is almost burning It has a power feed. I have used a power plane to get flat sides to logs. It also has a amazing dust collection system. When you are cutting through 18in logs the amount of dust made is amazing. I have found that it is easier to cut green and dry it than to dry it and then cut it. The only problem with the deicated resaw is that it is 39in to the table a long way when you want to lift a large log so I use a motorcycle table with rollers and a hydrolic system to lift the logs.
Well, I don't claim to be an expert and I haven't taken on anything 8' long yet, but I have learned a few things. As you've recognized, you need to get some flat sides to register from. Otherwise, you won't get a straight cut. You also need to avoid any chance of the log rolling and grabbing the band. I've had good results getting a flattish side on the log (jointer or duginske "sighting" method on bs) and then attaching it to a piece of reasonably straight board.
I went way over the top on bands at first, figuring that more width and coarseness would be better. Unless you've got loads of tension capability, big teeth and fat blades may be unstable for really tall cuts. I later backed it off and on my machine (an early 20" Delta) a 1/2"-3TPI works well for most things. I understand softwoods need coarser teeth than hardwoods, so mileage may vary.
Sawing logs generates insane amounts of dust, so dust collection is a good idea to keep you from burying your feet. Tall cuts still throw a lot of dust around even with dust collection.
I attached a couple of pics I took this winter. This is a chunk of oak log with the bottom cut flat that is 13" tall at the highest point. The band is Timberwolf 3/4X2PC which worked ok but was more aggressive than necesary.
Please post what you learn!
Pete
Now that I've posted all that, I'll second the comment that splitting the logs lengthwise might be just the ticket for a fence. I've seen a lot of fences in central Ontario made that way.Pete
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled