Replies

1. 
   Bill3 | Jun 25, 2003 04:10am | #1

   If you're looking for that coarse grain that turns black with dark stains try hickory or ash. While hard, they accept dark stains well and don't cost $10 per foot!

2. 
   RW | Jun 25, 2003 05:13am | #2

   And a vote for something completely out of the ordinary . . . I just yesterday played around with a wood I'd never used before, because a customer is trying to achieve something of a different look, and they got it in their heads that keeping it all local would be kind of neat. Siberian Elm. I know a little about elms, mostly that there's a lot of interlocking grain and they're hard to tool by hand. But this stuff was different. I played with it for several hours to get a feel for it. It is dense, rigid, took stains well. Alcohol dyes really popped the surface into something quite interesting. It took a hand plane well, and I was told by the sawyer that this variety does not have interlocking grain. Its pore structure will remind you more of oak or chestnut than cherry - more of the open grained look. But it works more like a maple. It has that feel in the hand, albeit not quite as smooth textured.

   Now availability? Here they grow everywhere and this guy sells it for $2/bf. The only hitch from the trimwork perspective is you're not going to find many elms that give you more than 10, maybe 12 ft of cut before you hit a crotch, so those nice long 16's for base are unlikely.

   But I'm quite serious about being more than just moderately interested after our initial acquaintance. It's interesting stuff, and if you happen to be near any small time sawmill operators, it's worth a gander. It may fit very well with your theme.

   "The child is grown / The dream is gone / And I have become / Comfortably numb "      lyrics by Roger Waters

1. 
   dperfe | Jun 25, 2003 05:43am | #3

   That's an interesting idea.  Up here in western NY we have a variety of interesting trees.  I've seen a bit of apple around and it looks pretty nice.  I'll look into what else is available.

   Thanks,

   DP

3. 
   woody | Jun 25, 2003 05:50am | #4

   I wouldn't recommend Sassafras as a trim wood. It is very soft and may not hold up very well.

4. 
   jonsherryl | Jun 25, 2003 06:53am | #5

   David, sassafras is perhaps the best available species for countfeiting the appearance of chestnut...so, if your first priority is to achieve a chestnut look, it's probably your best choice. However, the warning posted by Rich is also valid. Sassafras is relatively soft and would have a tendency to dent quite easily...But the interesting historical footnote here is that chestnut and sassafras have very similar densities. In fact, with a specific gravity of 0.42, sassafras is slightly denser than chestnut, which averaged 0.40...So, chestnut also dented easily. The fact is, in its heyday, chestnut was regarded as a rather plebian choice for millwork. It was often used, but more because it was plentiful, cheap and easy to shape. Its modern appeal stems more from its association with an earlier America...and the fact that it, too, has now passed into oblivion.

   RW's idea of using one of the Oriental elms that have gotten established over here is a novel idea...Although I've never met an elm that didn't have some stability problems, all of the elms have a stunning figure...especially on a contoured surface. And if you use a varnish stain (so that you keep the high contast between its fine bands of porous earlywood and the denser latewood somewhat mellowed out) you can go with a relatively dark color. I've used it for clock cases and other accent pieces where its instability is more easily controlled, due to the small dimensions of the parts. If you use it for trim, you'll want to make sure the backs of the moldings are generously kerfed to prevent cupping and twisting with changes in humidity, but elm sure is one of the most attractive of the inexpensive, ring-porous woods.

   ...However, if you're hung up on achieving a chestnut look...and yet want a slightly denser and more  dent resistant species...Black ash (Fraxinus nigra) is another very good chestnut substitute. It's not quite as dense as the other ashes (it's specific gravity averages only a slightly more robust 0.45), but its natural color actually mimmics chestnut better than does sassafras...which has the advantage of simplifying the finishing process somewhat. Because it's a little more open grained that either chestnut or sassafras, its figure won't fool an expert...so, sassafras is still the better counterfeit (since, with enough effort, you can contol color, while the figure is indelible)...but black ash would be a strong second choice.

   ...Sorry for the length of this post, but I think the question you pose begs this kind of detail. You're definitely into the more subtle, short strokes on this project...and I detect you're also probably one of those insufferable perfectionists, like me. :O)

   PS: As for differences between the European chestnut and our native species, They are virtually identical in appearance. They're both quite soft (relative to the denser Oriental "Chinese"species of true chestnuts) and similar in color, with respect to their long term patina... Both can also be fumed to achieve a dark grayish hue, which might be the historic appearance you're looking for. Both are respectably stable woods, but unfortunately prone to splitting when used in wide panels (as is sassafras.)      

   
   

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   Edited 6/25/2003 12:40:49 AM ET by Jon Arno

5. 
   Manchild | Jun 26, 2003 04:54am | #6

   When you said french country I was reminded of a man that I did some work for on his homes. While he was designing the interior of his house he would find antique furniture that was falling apart so it was cheap and use the front for a built-in cabinet. A lot of them are falling apart. Like a large clothing piece. When you walked into the room it would seem that it was part of the original old house. He plastered the interior walls up to it. Anyway just an idea.

6. 
   fdampier5 | Jun 27, 2003 12:23am | #7

   An interesting wood to work with is Boxelder..

          It has these wild streaks in it that add tremendous charcter and clearly set it out as differant.  With just a clear coat of Varnish the color gets towards the darker side of cream except the brite wild red streaks

           Another wood that is interesting is Hackberry.  It's grain pattern reminds me of Chestnut but it's cost is closer to elm..

     What I would be tempted to do is take a ride out to several sawmills with a little pocket plane in hand and see what strikes my fancy.

           

7. 
   ron61 | Jun 27, 2003 12:31am | #8

   Dont they call Chesnut White Wallnut? How about Bleached Walnut